Do you believe everything the Bible says?

Are you referring to the Azusa street revival?

Nope that was in 1906-1915. I'm referring to the Charismatic outpouring 1964-2978 or so.

Azuza St. had some similarities, and resulted in several Denominations being formed, the LARGEST of which being the "Assemblies of God" in 1916 (presently about 3,000,00 in the U.S. and 80,000,000 worldwide. The assemblies of God largely REJECTED the "Charismatic Outpouring" largely since the AG was a legalistic Holiness denomination, and "Charismatics" weren't "Holy enough for them since the majority were from "Liberal Churches. "Reformed branches mostly rejected it, since they had to protect their "Cessationism" at all costs.

I humbly come before the Word of God, in much prayer. The Holy Spirit is the ultimate authority on this subject.

Reading the Bible, sometimes I stop, listen, and just wait for God to help me out a bit. I’ve learned much more about the Bible this way than just reading the words on the pages. I can’t even remember how many “wow. Oh my!” moments I’ve had that way.

People don’t learn that in “church.” What people seem to learn in church is just whatever the preacher says. Guess what? If the preacher is wrong then everyone in the congregation may be wrong. The seminaries aren’t pumping out Biblical teachers nor are they sending their best. The mainstream church has more or less been infiltrated.

Same old story. Anyone who disagrees with charismatics is narrow-minded, legalistic, judgmental and holier-than thou. It surely couldn't be all the false doctrine they export.

But probably more because of the TRUE doctrine they present. Cessationists hate to believe that their dismissal of the miraculous might be in error.

No arguement about there being some HORRENDOUS fringe groups (like the "discipleship movement" and the "Word of faith" bunch. Oddly enough, though, the Charismatic outpouring never "Denominationalized" the way the Pentecostal Revival at the turn of the century did. It didn't seem that we needed to.

Turns out, though, that when the Charismatic outpouring ended (as all times of refreshing do), Those of us who were part of the revival had two choices: Try to keep the revival going, which wasn't going to work without the Holy Spirit driving it, OR reunite with the existing churches that we'd come out of. A huge number of us went into the Assemblies of God in the following years, and changed it significantly into a much LESS legalistic Denomination. The Assemblies of God in 2023 bears little resemblance to the Assemblies of God in 1965. I've been a member in good standing for most of the years since 1964.

We will all say we believe the Bible, but unless we understand what we are reading, what have we believed?

Never a truer word spoken.

Precisely, Dino.

Unfortunately, that's not the only thing that he overlooked.

The epistle to the Hebrews was written to Hebrews, and the author of that epistle regularly cited his Old Testament quotations from the Greek Septuagint, and not from the Hebrew Masoretic text.

Here are a couple of examples:

Hebrews 1

6And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

Good luck finding that citation in the Hebrew Masoretic text because it doesn't exist there. It is found, however, in the Greek Septuagint in Deuteronomy 32:43.

https://biblehub.com/sep/deuteronomy/32.htm

Deuteronomy 32 (Greek Septuagint)

43Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him; rejoice ye Gentiles, with his people, and let all the sons of God strengthen themselves in him; for he will avenge the blood of his sons, and he will render vengeance, and recompense justice to his enemies, and will reward them that hate him; and the Lord shall purge the land of his people.

Here is how Deuteronomy 32:43 reads in the KJV, which was translated from the Hebrew Masoretic text in the Old Testament:

https://biblehub.com/kjv/deuteronomy/32.htm

Deuteronomy 32 (Hebrew Masoretic text)

43Rejoice, O ye nations, with his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, and to his people.

Like I said, the Old Testament citation in Hebrews 1:6 is nowhere to be found in the Hebrew Masoretic text, but it is found in the Greek Septuagint that the author actually cited from.

Here's another example where the writer of the epistle to the Hebrews clearly cited from the Greek Septuagint as opposed to citing from the Hebrew Masoretic text:

Hebrews 10

5Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

First, here is how this citation from Psalm 40:6 reads in the Greek Septuagint:

https://biblehub.com/sep/psalms/40.htm

Psalm 40

6(39:6) Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not; but a body hast thou prepared me: whole-burnt-offering and sacrifice for sin thou didst not require.

It's a perfect match.

Now, here is how Psalm 40:6 reads in the KJV, which was translated from the Hebrew Masoretic text in the Old Testament:

https://biblehub.com/kjv/psalms/40.htm

Psalm 40

6Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.

There's a world of difference between "but a body hast thou prepared for me" and "mine ears hast thou opened".

Anyway, there's a reason why Pilate did the following:

John 19

19And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS. 20This title then read many of the Jews: for the place where Jesus was crucified was nigh to the city: and it was written in Hebrew, and Greek, and Latin. 21Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews. 22Pilate answered, What I have written I have written.

Hebrew was pretty much a dead language in the first century in Israel, and this is precisely why the New Testament was written in Greek, and not in Hebrew.

In light of what I said here, can it honestly be said that the KJV is a perfect translation?

No, it cannot be honestly said, and there are many other examples that I could easily give. That said, I still maintain that the KJV is the best English translation, and I use it regularly. However, I do go back to the underlying texts quite often to ensure that things were properly translated from them into English. Many times, they simply were not. This doesn't mean that God's word itself is faulty. It does mean, however, that things often get lost in translation or mistranslation.

Wow, are you the final authority on what God has said? Let's think about that passage in Hebrews. I believe that those like yourself who criticize the King James Bible and question it's sources “And again, when he bringeth in the first begotten into the world, HE SAITH, AND LET ALL THE ANGLES OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” are entirely missing the point.

The inspired writer to the Hebrews is NOT quoting from some mythical Greek Septuagint but rather is referring to something that has not yet happened that WILL BE SAID at the Second Coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Holy Ghost is not referring to a past event, but rather to the future and no specific quote from the Old Testament is in the mind of the writer of the book of Hebrews.


Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible - “Such A REFERENCE TO HIS SECOND COMING as the Firstborn to finalize His creative and life-giving purpose, following the description of His first coming as ‘Son’, gives added significance to the passage, indicating an advancement in idea rather than it being just a string of quotations all with the same point, and significantly it parallels the similar idea in the seventh. It also fits in with the use of firstborn in Colossians 1:18 as ‘the firstborn from the dead’. He Who was the firstborn from the dead, the first to arise and the Lord of resurrection, NOW COMES AGAIN TO THE INHABITED WORLD FOR HIS OWN to raise them too, whether by resurrection or rapture (compare Hebrews 9:28).”

Once again, the KJV is the holy, pure preserved words of God in the English language.

Only in fantasyland.

In the real world, where I hope most of us live, the writer of the epistle to the Hebrews consistently quoted two or three proof texts or witnesses from the Old Testament in order to prove to his Hebrew hearers, who had previously been under the law, that the New Testament was prophesied of in the Old Testament. You know, that whole "in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established" thing (Deuteronomy 17:6, 19:15, Matthew 18:16, 2 Corinthians 13:1, 1 Timothy 5:19, Hebrews 10:28), even as Paul said here:

Romans 3

21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Anyway, you're free to stubbornly hold to your erroneous opinion, but I certainly wouldn't recommend it.

In the real world, does the word of God need to state something two or three times for it to be true?

27 out of 28 people have voted so far that they believe everything that the bible says. Really? Should we put that to the test? Everything?

.

I don't believe everything the Bible says; but I do believe everything the
Bible reports; for example:

• Gen 3:2-3 . . The woman said to the serpent; "We may eat fruit from the
trees in the garden, but God did say; "You must not eat fruit from the tree
that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will
die."

Was the woman's statement true? No, God said nothing about touching the
fruit. (Gen 2:15) The woman embellished God's instructions with the effect
of making them more strict than they really were.

Here's another:

• Gen 3:4 . . "You will not surely die" the serpent said to the woman.

Was the Serpent's statement true? No; Eve died. (Rom 5:12, Rom 5:17)

FAQ: The Serpent's statement was a half-truth. Eve died because of the
forbidden fruit, yes, but she didn't die from her own eating; she died from
Adam's just like all the rest of us. (Rom 5:12, Rom 5:17)
_

Wow... your devotion to your cult even extends to inventing hypothetical futures to justify the text.

You have been hovering on the edge of credibility for some time, but you just took a flying leap off it. I will no longer consider what you share on this subject to have any evidentiary value whatsoever. You're must too deeply deluded to take seriously.

Believing the bible has become a cult in the Laodicean Age.

Claiming that "the new versions do not want you to study the word of truth, nor rightly divide it" is total nonsense. Can you show me anywhere that one of the modern versions does not want you to study God's word? You can't!!!

It is obvious that you don't understand what "study" means in olde Englyshe. You would be better of reading a translation in your own language, the one that you use to think, read, and write.

The KJV has errors. Deal with it. If not, why has it been revised so many times?

"thee, thou, you, and ye are the correct forms of English"? What do you mean by correct? And if they are "correct", why don't you use them in your communications, oral or written?

To the best of my knowledge and ability, here is an exhaustive list of every place in the epistle to the Hebrews where such phrases as “said he”, “he saith”, “the Holy Ghost saith”, “while it is said”, “as he said”, “saying in David”, “as it is said”, “he that said unto him”, “him that said unto him”, “saith he”, “he had said before”, “him that hath said”, “of whom it was said”, “Moses said”, and “for he hath said” appear. In each and every instance, what follows such phrases are direct references to Old Testament passages of scripture. With such in mind, neither Peter Pett nor you know what you are talking about.

It took me quite a bit of time and effort to compile this list, so the least you could do is read it. Of course, I’d suggest that you not only read it, but that you also adjust your beliefs in accordance to the truths that I’m about to present. Lies come from the father of lies, Satan. No good can come out of embracing them.

Here is the list:

Hebrews 1

5For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

Here, “said he” is a direct reference to Psalm 2:7 and 2 Samuel 7:14/1 Chronicles 17:13/1 Chronicles 22:10/1 Chronicles 28:6.

6And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Deuteronomy 32:43 IN THE GREEK SEPTUAGINT, AND NOT IN THE HEBREW MASORETIC TEXT, whether you’ll ever admit the same or not.

7And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Psalm 104:4.

8But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. 9Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. 10And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands: 11They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment; 12And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Psalm 45:6-7 and Psalm 102:25-27.

13But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

Here, “said he” is a direct reference to Psalm 110:1.

Hebrews 3

7Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice, 8Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness: 9When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years. 10Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. 11So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest).

Here, “as the Holy Ghost saith” is a direct reference to Psalm 95:7-11.

15While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.

Here, “while it is said” is a direct reference to Psalm 95:7-8.

Hebrews 4

3For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Here, “as he said” is a direct reference to Psalm 95:11.

7Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

Here, “saying in David” and “as it is said” are direct references to Psalm 95:7-8.

Hebrews 5

5So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.

Here, “he that said unto him” is a direct reference to Psalm 2:7.

6As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Here, “as he saith also in another place” is a direct reference to Psalm 110:4.

Hebrews 7

21(For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec)

Here, “him that said unto him” is a direct reference to Psalm 110:4.

Hebrews 8

5Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

Here, “saith he” is a direct reference to Exodus 25:40.

8For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. 10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. 12For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Jeremiah 31:31-34.

13In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Jeremiah 31:31.

Hebrews 10

5Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me: 6In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure. 7Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

Here, “he saith” is a direct reference to Psalm 40:6-8 IN THE GREEK SEPTUAGINT, AND NOT IN THE HEBREW MASORETIC TEXT, whether you’ll ever admit the same or not.

8Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law; 9Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

Here, “he said” and “said he” are direct references to the same Psalm 40:6-8 IN THE GREEK SEPTUAGINT, AND NOT IN THE HEBREW MASORETIC TEXT, that the author had just finished citing in the previous verses, whether you’ll ever admit to it or not.

15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, 16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; 17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Here, “he had said before”, with the “he” being the Holy Ghost, is a direct reference to Jeremiah 31:33-34.

30For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

Here, “him that hath said” is a direct reference to Deuteronomy 32:35-36.

Hebrews 11

18Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:

Here, “of whom it was said” is a direct reference to Genesis 21:12.

Hebrews 12

21And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake)

Here, “Moses said” is a direct reference to Deuteronomy 9:19 IN THE GREEK SEPTUAGINT, AND NOT IN THE HEBREW MASORETIC TEXT, whether you’ll ever admit the same or not.

Hebrews 13

5Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

Here, “for he hath said” is a direct reference to Deuteronomy 31:6/Deuteronomy 31:8/Joshua 1:5.

The "ANGLES" of God worship Him? Which angles? Right angles, acute angles, obtuse angles, straight angles, reflex angles, or complete angles? For someone who is such a stickler for "correct" English, why are you so careless? Or does your KJV actually say "HE SAITH, AND LET ALL THE ANGLES OF GOD WORSHIP HIM." Or perhaps you meant "anglos", as in anglo-saxon?

There is no "mythical Greek Septuagint". It was the Koine Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures and was the Bible used throughout the Greco-Roman world at the time of Christ and the Apostles.

Finally, the KJV is NOT the holy, pure preserved words of God in the English language. It is a translation of the source documents available at the time and the revision of earlier translations to conform to a secular king's personal brand of Protestantism. There have been four major revisions of the KJV, as well as many other minor revisions. I sincerely doubt that you would be able to understand the actual 1611 version.

WHY DO YOU WORSHIP A BOOK???