Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

Nope. The Lord said in the Gospel of St. Matthew: "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." (Mat 5:16) and again in the Gospel of St. John: "8This is to My Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, proving yourselves to be My disciples." (Jn 15:8)

Those who work less glorify God less. Those who work more, with faith in Christ, glorify God more, and will be rewarded more. According to your opinion, those who faithfully follow Rom 2:6-7 are "focused on self not God". I disagree. They are focused on glorifying God, by living lives of holiness and good works which "glorify your Father in Heaven" as the Lord said.

Rom 2:6-7:

"6God “will repay each one according to his deeds(works)". 7To those who by perseverance in doing good seek glory, honor, and immortality, He will give eternal life"

In Christ,
Xavier.

Of course you can believe it. It seems reasonable from the human point of view that people can forfeit their salvation, but I lean more towards a different point of view, and that being that God’s ways are not our ways.

if we are not in christ (saved) we can not glorify God no matter how hard e work. The jews found that out when they were called out by Christ himself

Those who glorify God more or less, are in him (saved) the more we glorify him, the more reward. the less. the less reward. Our work will be tried by fire. but even the believer who glorified God the least will be saved even as through fire..

Not exactly. Matthew 25:14-30 proves it’s possible to be an unprofitable servant (someone who doesn’t glorify God) and still end up being cast into outer darkness.

if we are not in christ (saved) we can not glorify God no matter how hard e work.

Those who glorify God more or less, are in him (saved) the more we glorify him, the more reward. the less. the less reward. Our work will be tried by fire. but even the believer who glorified God the least will be saved even as through fire.

the jews were given the talent. as has the whole world.

The people who are cast in outer darkness are those who did not believe

He who believes is not condemned

He who does not believe is condemned already.

Yes, I think between the time the Lord said, Twelve Thrones for the Twelve: "Jesus said to them, “I assure you: In the Messianic Age, when the Son of Man sits on His glorious throne, you who have followed Me will also sit on 12 thrones, judging the 12 tribes of Israel." (Mat 19:28) and the time, probably 1 or 2 years later, that, as it is written, Satan entered Judas, somewhere in between, Judas lost his Salvation. Imo, the example of Judas shows the promises of God are conditional on perseverance. The Eleven Apostles, by the Grace and Mercy of God, persevered in Faith until the end and obtained the Promise. Judas failed to persevere and thus did not obtain it, though the Lord promised it. Matthias or Paul got it instead.



If you mean justified, yes. So, let's come to the point, what is necessary and sufficient to be justified?

(1) Confessing Jesus is Lord: "no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit." (1 Cor 12:3)
(2) Confessing Jesus is Son of God: "Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God." (1 Jn 4:15)

Likewise, similar passages show (1) Believing in Christ as Lord and Savior (2) confessing/repenting of one's sin is both necessary and sufficient for forgiveness/justification. Without any doubt, believe in OSAS is not necessary for salvation.

Since many non-OSAS Christians confess (1)-(2), it follows that Non-OSAS Christians are Justified. If OSAS were objectively true, NON-OSASers would also be OSAS just by this confession. But since it is not, perseverance in confession is needed.



Let's look at the passages:

1 Cor 3:13-15: "13his workmanship will be evident, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will prove the quality of each man’s work. 14If what he has built survives, he will receive a reward. 15If it is burned up, he will suffer loss. He himself will be saved, but only as if through the flames."

The passage describes two kinds of Christians (1) the first group is completely sanctified and faithfully labors out of love for the Lord, as he had said he and Apollos did in vs 8. These Christians receive a Reward from the Lord. (2) the second group, after justification, neglects sanctification. They suffer loss, lose rewards, face chastisement/discipline from the Lord, and are "saved but only as if through the flames". Now, why would anyone choose the 2nd path rather than the first?

Any thoughts on that? True that we can neglect sanctification a little and still be saved, yet it is unwise imo to do that.

Again in 1 Pet 2:5-11, quoted earlier, it describes two possible paths Christians can take, and one has far greater rewards.

God Bless.

The servants in Matthew 25:14-30 are believers. God’s servants aren’t unbelievers. These servants were cast into outer darkness. Consider this:

A subject of the kingdom isn’t an unbeliever.

Matthew 8:12
12But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”

they can't be believers, if they were. they are not condemned

Only the unbeliever isw condemned ALREADY!

God does not make mistakes my friend, God knows a person heart. he will not be fooled into giving eternal life to someone and have to take it back.. Thats his reputation at stake

Let’s not make any assumptions. The outer darkness is outside the kingdom of God. The kingdom of God is illuminated by God (Revelation 21:23), hence the area outside is darkness.

Are you sure getting eternal life means one is blissfully in the kingdom of heaven? Can someone have eternal life in the darkness as well, even if temporarily?

Ponder what it means to be a subject of the kingdom of God and still be cast into outer darkness.

Who is making assumptions?

I posted Jesus words

He who BELIEVES is NOT CONDEMNED
He who does not believe is CONDEMNED ALREADY

Judas lost his salvation after having believed

Not According To Scriptures:

Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For
Jesus Knew from the beginning who they were that
believed not, and who should betray Him.

Joh 6:70 Jesus Answered them, Have not I chosen
you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
Joh 6:71 He Spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon:
for he it was that should betray Him, being one of the
twelve.

Conclusion: Makes Perfect Sense then that "believe And THEN believe
not" is Unscriptural:

1) Christ Has Always KNOWN them "that are His Own"
(2Ti 2:19; Eph 1:4-6)

NO MIDDLE GROUND [I once knew you, BUT now I don't],
putting words in Jesus' Mouth, Correct?:

2) Christ Has NEVER Known them that are "NOT His!"
(Mat 7:21-23), Correct?

Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided(+ I and II)!

There are three legs upon which OSAS stands or falls. Do these verses mean what they supposedly mean, or have they been misunderstood and misapplied? When we examine them next to other scriptures that clearly contradict them will they hold up? Let's see.

First, 1 John 2:19—"They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us."

The OSAS interpretation of this verse says that those who "went out" were never in Christ to begin with; they were never saved. However, I suggest there's another meaning that conforms very well with other scriptures. This view says that those who "went out" were indeed saved and in Christ at one point, but were simply not as committed as the others. It's in this sense that they were not "of us." These are those spoken of in the parable of the sower (Matthew 13:5-6): "Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, but when the sun rose they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away." It sprang up, it had life to start with; but it "withered away."

Jesus' explanation of this passage is found in Matthew 13:20-21—"As for what was sown on rocky ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy, yet he has no root in himself, but endures for a while, and when tribulation or persecution arises on account of the word, immediately he falls away."

Second is 1 John 3:6—"No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him."

This seems pretty cut and dried: if someone turns away back into sin they never knew Him. But we have to understand this in light of other scriptures that contradict it. Those who "never knew Him," never had a proper understanding of Him. This corresponds to the first group in the parable of the sower: "When anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart." The seed was "sown in his heart," but was snatched away because of this person's lack of understanding.

Third is John 10:28—"I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand." I agree with this verse: no one can indeed snatch them out of His hand. However, the person himself can walk away. For this reason I prefer the phrase "forfeit salvation" to "lose salvation."

Now let's look at some scriptures that plainly talk about walking away and falling away. I'm not going to use Hebrews because Hebrews is fiercely objected to by those who advocate OSAS, even though is has many relevant warnings about falling away. But Hebrews isn't necessary—there are plenty of others.

2 Peter 2:20-21—"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."

This passage clearly illustrates a person who was once in Christ but who turned their back on Him. This shows a conscious action on the part of the one turning back. These verses correspond with Luke 9:26: "Jesus said to him, 'No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.' "

Matthew 24:10—"And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another."

1 Timothy 4:1—"Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons."

Matthew 24:13—"But the one who endures to the end will be saved."

Why say that those who endure to the end will be saved? If one cannot forfeit their salvation, why didn't He say "But all who have prayed the sinners prayer will be saved?"

Luke 9:26—"Jesus said to him, 'No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.' "

Already mentioned, Luke 9:26 is a clear warning from the Lord about falling away.

Come to understand what salvation is.
Then you will not be confused any longer.

Not According To Scriptures:

Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For
Jesus Knew from the beginning who they were that
believed not, and who should betray Him.

Joh 6:70 Jesus Answered them, Have not I chosen
you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
Joh 6:71 He Spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon:
for he it was that should betray Him, being one of the
twelve.

Conclusion: Makes Perfect Sense then that "believe And THEN believe
not" is Unscriptural:

1) Christ Has Always KNOWN them "that are His Own"
(2Ti 2:19; Eph 1:4-6)

NO MIDDLE GROUND [I once knew you, BUT now I don't],
putting words in Jesus' Mouth, Correct?:

2) Christ Has NEVER Known them that are "NOT His!"
(Mat 7:21-23), Correct?

Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided(+ I and II)!

24 “Then he who had received the one talent came and said, ‘Lord, ???I knew you??? to be a hard man, reaping where you have not sown, and gathering where you have not scattered seed. 25 And I was afraid, and went and hid your talent in the ground. Look, there you have what is yours.’

I posted Jesus’ words too. So why were the subjects of the kingdom cast into outer darkness if they weren’t condemned? Maybe there’s context in between single verses?