The theif on the cross misconceptions
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The word Baptism as used by Jesus
Matt 20: 17- 19 And Jesus, going up to Jerusalem, took the twelve disciples aside along the way, and said unto them, Behold, we go to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, And shall deliver Him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him . And the third day He shall rise again.
Matt 20: 22 But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto Him, We are able.
In verse 18 and 19, Jesus is explaining the events that He has to experience when they go up to Jerusalem. In verse 22, He calls this experience of events that He has to go through a Baptism.
Luke 12: 50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I constrain till it be accomplish!
Again, Jesus refers to an event that He has to experience as a Baptism.
Rom 6: 3 Know ye not that, as many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into His death?
"Baptized into Jesus Christ" means Baptized in the name of the Son, where one believes in Jesus as Lord and Savior and becomes part of His spiritual body. As a member of His spiritual body, we become adopted sons of God and we, as part of His body will share in His reward of life, death, resurrection, and eternal life.
Rom 6: 4 Therefore, we are buried with Him by Baptism into death, that as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory ( Holy Spirit) of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
When we are baptized in the name of the Son by believing, we receive the Father's Holy Spirit and become born again with a new heart that will aid in obeying the Spirit of the Law ( letting love be the motive for all thoughts and actions).
1 Cor 12: 13 For by one Spirit (the Holy Spirit of the Father) were we baptized into one body (the spiritual body of Christ), whether we be Jews or Greeks, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
When you are baptized in the name of the Father, you receive His Holy Spirit ( drink into one Spirit) which makes us part of the spiritual body of Christ which was given to Him when He ascended into heaven to get glorified by the Father. When we believe in Him ( Christ) as Lord and Savior, we receive the Father's Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 12: 3 Wherefore, I give you to understand that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.
It is the Spirit of the Father that convicts us of our sins and into believing and trusting that Jesus is Lord and Savior.
Eph 3: 14-15 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
Those that belong to the Family of the Father have been baptized in the name of the Father and have received His Holy Spirit.
Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water, but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.
This verse seems to indicate that one kind of baptism ( water) is going to be replaced with a new kind of baptism ( Spirit).
Acts 8: 12 But when they believed Phillip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
This verse indicates that the time of the baptism occurs at the same time as the believing. When they believed, ... , they were baptized.
Matt 20: 17- 19 And Jesus, going up to Jerusalem, took the twelve disciples aside along the way, and said unto them, Behold, we go to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, And shall deliver Him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him . And the third day He shall rise again.
Matt 20: 22 But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto Him, We are able.
In verse 18 and 19, Jesus is explaining the events that He has to experience when they go up to Jerusalem. In verse 22, He calls this experience of events that He has to go through a Baptism.
Luke 12: 50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I constrain till it be accomplish!
Again, Jesus refers to an event that He has to experience as a Baptism.
Rom 6: 3 Know ye not that, as many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into His death?
"Baptized into Jesus Christ" means Baptized in the name of the Son, where one believes in Jesus as Lord and Savior and becomes part of His spiritual body. As a member of His spiritual body, we become adopted sons of God and we, as part of His body will share in His reward of life, death, resurrection, and eternal life.
Rom 6: 4 Therefore, we are buried with Him by Baptism into death, that as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory ( Holy Spirit) of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
When we are baptized in the name of the Son by believing, we receive the Father's Holy Spirit and become born again with a new heart that will aid in obeying the Spirit of the Law ( letting love be the motive for all thoughts and actions).
1 Cor 12: 13 For by one Spirit (the Holy Spirit of the Father) were we baptized into one body (the spiritual body of Christ), whether we be Jews or Greeks, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
When you are baptized in the name of the Father, you receive His Holy Spirit ( drink into one Spirit) which makes us part of the spiritual body of Christ which was given to Him when He ascended into heaven to get glorified by the Father. When we believe in Him ( Christ) as Lord and Savior, we receive the Father's Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 12: 3 Wherefore, I give you to understand that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.
It is the Spirit of the Father that convicts us of our sins and into believing and trusting that Jesus is Lord and Savior.
Eph 3: 14-15 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
Those that belong to the Family of the Father have been baptized in the name of the Father and have received His Holy Spirit.
Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water, but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.
This verse seems to indicate that one kind of baptism ( water) is going to be replaced with a new kind of baptism ( Spirit).
Acts 8: 12 But when they believed Phillip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
This verse indicates that the time of the baptism occurs at the same time as the believing. When they believed, ... , they were baptized.
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Acts 11: 18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
This verse seems to indicate that it is the Father who grants the repentance that is necessary to gain life. When one is baptized in the name of the Father, he first repents and then turns to Him for forgiveness. This repentance given by the Father is not a gift that can be refused. Repentance is a state of being and once it is granted, you have it.
Acts 2: 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized, everyone of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Peter explains the steps that takes place in salvation. You get baptized in the name of the Father who grants repentance. Then you get baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins. This is not refering to water baptism as illustrated in the next verse which explains how baptism in the name of Jesus Christ occurs. And then ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit ( baptism in the name of the Holy Spirit).
Acts 19: 1-6 And it came to pass that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper borders came to Ephesus and, finding certain disciples, He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Spirit since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there is any Holy Spirit. And he said unto them, Unto what, then, were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on Him who should come after him, that is on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke with tongues, and prophesied.
Baptism in the name of the Son occurs when a person believes on Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. John's baptism with water was a baptism of repentance. The Jews that came from all around the Jordan to get baptized by John knew nothing about salvation through Jesus Christ. Throughout the Old Testament, God's chosen people experienced hardships when they broke away from the God of their Father's. When they repented and returned to God, God forgave them and they received good fortune. That is why Jews went to get baptized by John. It was a Jewish ritual to publicly and to God declare repentance and a return to God so that they can receive good fortune from God. The water represented the washing away of their sins as they acknowledged their sins aloud and repented.
Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized; and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Peter was preaching to the Jewish crowd about Jesus and those that believed were baptized in the name of Jesus just like like John's disciples in Acts 19: 1-6 when they heard about Jesus Christ. Three thousand divided by 12 equals 250. If it was a water baptism each of the 12 apostles would have to baptize 250 people which would take a lot of time and waiting. People get baptized in the name of the Son automatically when they hear about Christ and believe.
Acts 2: 47 Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.
That word "should" means "supposed to" because those that get saved are ordained by God ( predetermined ) from the beginning of creation.
Acts 8: 36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water; and the eunuch said, See, here is water. What doth hinder me to be baptized?
The eunuch had just left Jerusalem and was heading back to Egypt. He had gone to Jerusalem to worship and was probably of Jewish descent and followed Jewish customs. When the eunuch asked Philip what would hinder him to be baptized, Philip replied that if he believed (v.37) he could. The eunuch declared that he did believe on Jesus which means that he was already baptized in the name of Jesus. You can't be baptized in the name of the Son unless you first get baptized in the name of the Father ( who grants repentance). The eunuch wanted to declare his repentance through water baptism and Philip obliged.
John 1: 32-33 And John bore witness, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon Him. And I knew Him not; but He that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, the same is He who baptizeth with the Holy Spirit.
It was John the Baptist who was sent to baptize with water knowing that one of the participants would be the Christ. God let him know how he would be able to identify the one who will be baptizing with the Holy Spirit. It is Christ who baptizes in the name of the Holy Spirit of the Father and that happens when the Father grants repentance ( baptism in the name of the Father) and the person believes on Jesus Christ ( baptism in the name of the Son) who baptizes in the name of the Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 1: 16-17 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas; besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
If he baptized with water, he would know who he baptized. His not knowing means that in his preaching, he does not know all who gladly received his words.
For Christ sent me not to baptize but to preach the gospel;
In other words, let Jesus do the baptizing by our preaching.
1 Cor 1: 21 For after that, in the wisdom of God, the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
Spreading the gospel of Jesus by preaching should be our bread and the Father's will. That is how people get baptized into believing and getting saved.
Acts 9: 17-18 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even ( that is) Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Spirit.. And IMMEDIATELY there fell from his eyes as it had been scales; and he received sight, and arose, and was baptized.
When did the scales fall from his eyes? Immediately
When did he receive sight? Immediately
When did he arise? Immediately
When did he get baptized? Immediately
Matt 28: 19 Go ye, therefore, and TEACH all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,
If it was one baptism, it would have read " in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit." Since it reads, "in the name of the Father, in the name of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit", it is describing each of the persons of the Godhead's part in Baptism. This baptism occurs by teaching. He didn't tell them to make sure they bring plenty of water for water baptism.
This verse seems to indicate that it is the Father who grants the repentance that is necessary to gain life. When one is baptized in the name of the Father, he first repents and then turns to Him for forgiveness. This repentance given by the Father is not a gift that can be refused. Repentance is a state of being and once it is granted, you have it.
Acts 2: 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized, everyone of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Peter explains the steps that takes place in salvation. You get baptized in the name of the Father who grants repentance. Then you get baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins. This is not refering to water baptism as illustrated in the next verse which explains how baptism in the name of Jesus Christ occurs. And then ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit ( baptism in the name of the Holy Spirit).
Acts 19: 1-6 And it came to pass that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper borders came to Ephesus and, finding certain disciples, He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Spirit since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there is any Holy Spirit. And he said unto them, Unto what, then, were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on Him who should come after him, that is on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke with tongues, and prophesied.
Baptism in the name of the Son occurs when a person believes on Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. John's baptism with water was a baptism of repentance. The Jews that came from all around the Jordan to get baptized by John knew nothing about salvation through Jesus Christ. Throughout the Old Testament, God's chosen people experienced hardships when they broke away from the God of their Father's. When they repented and returned to God, God forgave them and they received good fortune. That is why Jews went to get baptized by John. It was a Jewish ritual to publicly and to God declare repentance and a return to God so that they can receive good fortune from God. The water represented the washing away of their sins as they acknowledged their sins aloud and repented.
Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized; and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Peter was preaching to the Jewish crowd about Jesus and those that believed were baptized in the name of Jesus just like like John's disciples in Acts 19: 1-6 when they heard about Jesus Christ. Three thousand divided by 12 equals 250. If it was a water baptism each of the 12 apostles would have to baptize 250 people which would take a lot of time and waiting. People get baptized in the name of the Son automatically when they hear about Christ and believe.
Acts 2: 47 Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.
That word "should" means "supposed to" because those that get saved are ordained by God ( predetermined ) from the beginning of creation.
Acts 8: 36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water; and the eunuch said, See, here is water. What doth hinder me to be baptized?
The eunuch had just left Jerusalem and was heading back to Egypt. He had gone to Jerusalem to worship and was probably of Jewish descent and followed Jewish customs. When the eunuch asked Philip what would hinder him to be baptized, Philip replied that if he believed (v.37) he could. The eunuch declared that he did believe on Jesus which means that he was already baptized in the name of Jesus. You can't be baptized in the name of the Son unless you first get baptized in the name of the Father ( who grants repentance). The eunuch wanted to declare his repentance through water baptism and Philip obliged.
John 1: 32-33 And John bore witness, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon Him. And I knew Him not; but He that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, the same is He who baptizeth with the Holy Spirit.
It was John the Baptist who was sent to baptize with water knowing that one of the participants would be the Christ. God let him know how he would be able to identify the one who will be baptizing with the Holy Spirit. It is Christ who baptizes in the name of the Holy Spirit of the Father and that happens when the Father grants repentance ( baptism in the name of the Father) and the person believes on Jesus Christ ( baptism in the name of the Son) who baptizes in the name of the Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 1: 16-17 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas; besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
If he baptized with water, he would know who he baptized. His not knowing means that in his preaching, he does not know all who gladly received his words.
For Christ sent me not to baptize but to preach the gospel;
In other words, let Jesus do the baptizing by our preaching.
1 Cor 1: 21 For after that, in the wisdom of God, the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
Spreading the gospel of Jesus by preaching should be our bread and the Father's will. That is how people get baptized into believing and getting saved.
Acts 9: 17-18 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even ( that is) Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Spirit.. And IMMEDIATELY there fell from his eyes as it had been scales; and he received sight, and arose, and was baptized.
When did the scales fall from his eyes? Immediately
When did he receive sight? Immediately
When did he arise? Immediately
When did he get baptized? Immediately
Matt 28: 19 Go ye, therefore, and TEACH all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,
If it was one baptism, it would have read " in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit." Since it reads, "in the name of the Father, in the name of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit", it is describing each of the persons of the Godhead's part in Baptism. This baptism occurs by teaching. He didn't tell them to make sure they bring plenty of water for water baptism.
I'm sorry... I really had no intention of doing that.
I admit that I am one who does not believe water baptism is necessary for salvation, but my last post
was an effort to hear another's point-of-view.
I boiled-down things you have said (and others have said) to the two things being repeated by people
who believe in something I can't comprehend.
1. Water Baptism is not needed for Salvation.
2. If you don't get Baptized in water, God punishes you... likely sending them to Hell for disobedience.
That doesn't sound "right" to me...?
I admit that I am one who does not believe water baptism is necessary for salvation, but my last post
was an effort to hear another's point-of-view.
I boiled-down things you have said (and others have said) to the two things being repeated by people
who believe in something I can't comprehend.
1. Water Baptism is not needed for Salvation.
2. If you don't get Baptized in water, God punishes you... likely sending them to Hell for disobedience.
That doesn't sound "right" to me...?
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Don't they believe that going to confession and saying a few "Our Fathers and Hail Marys" will erase your sins. Some do understand Salvation through Jesus Christ. I would say that the whole organization ( which is the richest in the world) is in error. When Peter went to visit Cornelius, Cornelius got on his knees and bowed down to Peter. Peter's response was, " get up. I'm just a man like You". Yet the Pope declares that he is Christ's vicar on earth, is infalible, and a descendent of the line of popes starting from Peter. Catholics bow down to the Pope and kiss his hand in worship. However, I'll let God be the judge.
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I believe many things in Catholicism are flat wrong, but Catholics who have confessed Jesus Christ as Lord and believed in their heart that God raised him from the dead shall be saved (Rom 10:9). God looks on a person's heart, He does not make sure all their doctrines are correct. If that was the requirement to be saved, we'd all be in trouble.
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" Hence we say that the Lord Jesus is God of God: we do not say that the Father is God of God, but simply God: and we say that the Lord Jesus is Light of Light; we do not say that the Father is Light of Light, but simply Light. Accordingly, to this belongs that which He said I am from Him. But as to my being seen of you in the flesh, He sent me. When you hear,He sent me, do not understand a difference of nature to be meant, but the authority of Him that begets. "
https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1701031.htm
https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1701031.htm