Thoughts on adoption

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MsMediator

MsMediator

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Lanolin

Lanolin

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interesting, I think most international adoptions are 'closed' as parents maybe dont want to have to deal with the birth parents should they change their mind, but in some ways this is hard on the child who maybe want to find them when they grow up or know their origins, it sets up a whole nother set of issues.

But otherwise, Im not sure that anything is that easy, raising you own is hard enough.
 
Lanolin

Lanolin

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I have often wondered what step parents do with children under 18. Do they adopt them? Are they allowed to?
 
MsMediator

MsMediator

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Lanolin said:
I have often wondered what step parents do with children under 18. Do they adopt them? Are they allowed to?
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I think both biological parents have to agree.
 
Billyd

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Magenta said:
The ultimate goal of the foster care system is to reunite the child with their biological parents.
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I have a niece and nephew who foster children (under six years old) with that goal. When they succeed, it is wonderful, but all too often they see the same child over and over. Almost all the repeats are for child neglect and parental drug abuse. It's awful to see a child that was thriving in a stable home environment, return terrified after a short time (sometimes days) in birth parent's home.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

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Lanolin said:
However Ishmael was treated like an enemy even though he had Abrahams genes.
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Actually Ishmael was greatly blessed by God (which is rather surprising). But since he was NOT the son of promise, and he also mocked Isaac, he and Hagar had to leave (though Abraham did protest). There is a spiritual significance to this which Paul discusses in Galatians. Christ was to descend through Isaac and Jacob, even though Jacob was a deceiver and a supplanter.

Getting back to adoption, it should be perfectly clear to Christians that if they are unable to have children, they should definitely adopt orphans. And some adopt even though they have their own children. IOW the attitudes of unbelievers and believers should be treated as distinct from each other.
 
Lanolin

Lanolin

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Drugs are a terrible scourge on people but they affect children THE MOST.

I wish ppl would maybe reflect a but on how their behaviour impacts on others not just themselves. But when you are drunk/stoned you are intoxicated and you cant think. Drugs literally peoples brain. Who wants a zombie for a mother or a father? Nobody.
 
Lanolin

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I had a six year old come in today and she told me her mother couldnt look after her so she was living with her nana, and how she loved her nana and she would give her lollies etc.

I dont think grandparents can adopt, but most of the time they take over. The girl had four sisters and a brother. Most of the time the cant looking after is because of illness.

You have to be in good health to be a parent as it takes a lot out of you. Its not fair for a child to take on the burden of caring for the adult. But many families do this.
 
K

Katia

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MsMediator said:
What are your thoughts on adoption? And, is there Biblical support for/against adoption?

Some people are strongly in favor of adoption, while others go to the extreme end by saying things like adoption is kidnapping, unnatural, etc.

I know this topic may be sensitive, and my intention is not to open wounds, etc. However, I feel the need to ask about this topic on this forum.

Also a related question is, why do (some/most) people have an urge to pass on their genes? Does God, or man for selfish reasons, create this urge? Please note I am making a distinction between people who marry and as a result have children (due to sex) without much thought to genes, versus for example the "blood is thicker than water" people who care a lot about genes and won't even adopt if childless but want children. I am talking about women who spend money freezing their eggs or older men who marry younger fertile women to get biological kids, rather than adopting. Are these routes Biblical? Where does adoption (and consequently adopted kids) fit in within this space?
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We adopted what we strongly suspected was a half Korean, half American GI baby that was 3 weeks old. We did not feel that the Bible either advocated or prohibited the action. We just used our common sense. She has blessed our lives.
 
soberxp

soberxp

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Having children and raising children is just a part of learning God's Word. God is your parent and you are his child. If you participate in it, you will understand God's Word better. If you don't participate in it, it doesn't mean you can't understand God's Word better.
 
K

Katia

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#31
soberxp said:
Having children and raising children is just a part of learning God's Word. God is your parent and you are his child. If you participate in it, you will understand God's Word better. If you don't participate in it, it doesn't mean you can't understand God's Word better.
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soberxp said:
Having children and raising children is just a part of learning God's Word. God is your parent and you are his child. If you participate in it, you will understand God's Word better. If you don't participate in it, it doesn't mean you can't understand God's Word better.
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Raising Children even adopted puts stress on a person, and joy in a way that even memorizing text can not match. Along the way, we might even learn things.
 
Dude653

Dude653

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I can't think of any good reason someone would be against adoption.
But the problem is with all the legal fees and stuff it's so expensive most people can't afford to do it
 
K

Katia

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Dude653 said:
I can't think of any good reason someone would be against adoption.
But the problem is with all the legal fees and stuff it's so expensive most people can't afford to do it
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She was born in 1983. I think that we spent over $10,000, part of it was on our VISA. It could have been $15,000. I've never regretted it.
 
B

blueluna5

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#34
MsMediator said:
What are your thoughts on adoption? And, is there Biblical support for/against adoption?

Some people are strongly in favor of adoption, while others go to the extreme end by saying things like adoption is kidnapping, unnatural, etc.

I know this topic may be sensitive, and my intention is not to open wounds, etc. However, I feel the need to ask about this topic on this forum.

Also a related question is, why do (some/most) people have an urge to pass on their genes? Does God, or man for selfish reasons, create this urge? Please note I am making a distinction between people who marry and as a result have children (due to sex) without much thought to genes, versus for example the "blood is thicker than water" people who care a lot about genes and won't even adopt if childless but want children. I am talking about women who spend money freezing their eggs or older men who marry younger fertile women to get biological kids, rather than adopting. Are these routes Biblical? Where does adoption (and consequently adopted kids) fit in within this space?
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I do believe adoption is extremely biblical. We're even considered adopted into God's family. God calls us to care for the fatherless.

When we went through infertility I did ivf. The idea being that I was already going through infertility, I didn't have the strength to go through the process of adoption. I think in the state I was in adoption would have been a terrible idea for me at that time. Ivf took me 2 months to get pregnant and worked 1st time. The emotion hurt more than any needle. Adoption for a baby takes almost a year. Another issue for me was that the biological mom has 30 days to change their mind. You have to set up a profile and the bio parent picks you. I felt like I had to perform some social media BS to get a baby. I also felt like adoption wasn't a "choice " for me. I'm not choosing it if I "need" it for a child. Also I was worried they would leave me in search of their bio parent as an adult.

When I had my kids I did think they would be little versions of myself and my husband. They don't act like either one of us. 😆 Very handsome boys, but I also don't think they look like me. So the joke is on me. I think in the end it doesn't actually matter. You always love your kids, adopted or biological.
 
MsMediator

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blueluna5 said:
Also I was worried they would leave me in search of their bio parent as an adult.
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Thanks for sharing. This is a major (legitimate) fear for many and I believe this is why more people do not adopt.
 
Deuteronomy

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MsMediator said:
...is there Biblical support for/against adoption? Some people are strongly in favor of adoption, while others go to the extreme end by saying things like adoption is kidnapping, unnatural, etc.
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Adoption may be unnatural (in a sense), but it is certainly Biblical, as it is also the only means by which we can become members of God's family. God, after all, has only One natural/begotten Son. The rest of us become His by "adoption" .. e.g. Ephesians 1:5; Romans 8:15.

God bless you!!

~Deut
p.s. - my wife and I adopted our (now) 24 yr old son, 24 years ago. We were told not to get our hopes up to high however (when we began the process), because back then, there were approximately 100 qualified families who were looking to adopt for every baby that was put up for adoption. From what I understand, it is even a greater ratio today, because back then, everybody was looking for married couples to adopt their babies. It was, in fact, VERY uncommon for a gay man or woman, or a single man or woman, to be qualified and then picked as an adoptive parent, but that is no longer the case today.

There truly are no "unwanted" children, so that should never be used as a reason or an excuse to have an abortion, because it simply/clearly is not true!
.
 
Dude653

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I have read the Bible cover to cover and there's nothing in there that says you can't adopt a child
 
E

EliB

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I feel this question is very problematic and it starts a pretty crazy chain that goes on down some pretty hard trails.

First, just to be clear; the base idea of adoption is clearly one of the few things throughout scripture that clearly and emphatically demonstrates the heart of God to us. He has adopted us, after all. so, on its face, adoption is one of the few things that is clearly from the heart of God.
However, is this true of our modern version of it? eh, that is much more unclear, for many reasons. note, I am referring to our system of adoption, not the act itself.

IVF however is clearly not so foggy. I believe IVF to be one of the few true and outright acts of rebellion against God we can make.
nothing quite screams rebellion to God like when God says no to you conceiving a baby and you say, "Fine, I'll do it myself." it outright rejects Gods right to ordaining life. note that I do not say that those who have done it are evil (at least, not most of them, I hope), just that the system of it very clearly seems to be an abject rejection of Gods natural authority and, if star couples are to be used as example, a hideous example of selfishness and pride.

and as for trying to pass on our genes..... Hahaha
This is literally the First commandment of God and one of the primary reasons he created the earth.
Isaiah 45:18 and Psalm 115:16 clearly show this. the Earth was created to be inhabited, and all that.
this point ties into the other two parts of the question. we are meant to raise children and build families, what our systems today reinforce is an abject rejection of children, family and blood.

I'm exhausted and it's almost 11. I'm gonna go to bed and try and flesh this out more tomorrow. TTYL
 
MsMediator

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EliB said:
I feel this question is very problematic and it starts a pretty crazy chain that goes on down some pretty hard trails.

First, just to be clear; the base idea of adoption is clearly one of the few things throughout scripture that clearly and emphatically demonstrates the heart of God to us. He has adopted us, after all. so, on its face, adoption is one of the few things that is clearly from the heart of God.
However, is this true of our modern version of it? eh, that is much more unclear, for many reasons. note, I am referring to our system of adoption, not the act itself.

IVF however is clearly not so foggy. I believe IVF to be one of the few true and outright acts of rebellion against God we can make.
nothing quite screams rebellion to God like when God says no to you conceiving a baby and you say, "Fine, I'll do it myself." it outright rejects Gods right to ordaining life. note that I do not say that those who have done it are evil (at least, not most of them, I hope), just that the system of it very clearly seems to be an abject rejection of Gods natural authority and, if star couples are to be used as example, a hideous example of selfishness and pride.

and as for trying to pass on our genes..... Hahaha
This is literally the First commandment of God and one of the primary reasons he created the earth.
Isaiah 45:18 and Psalm 115:16 clearly show this. the Earth was created to be inhabited, and all that.
this point ties into the other two parts of the question. we are meant to raise children and build families, what our systems today reinforce is an abject rejection of children, family and blood.

I'm exhausted and it's almost 11. I'm gonna go to bed and try and flesh this out more tomorrow. TTYL
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What do you think is the issue with the adoption system? When you say "modern version", are you speaking of the foster care system?

I personally don't see a problem with IVF if the egg and sperm belong to the couple. The Bible says that God knows the baby before the baby is formed in the womb. IVF is used as an aid, in my opinion. God is still forming the child, that's why not all IVF are successful. It gets more complicated with people using egg and sperm donors, and I can see why some people have an issue with it.

I am not fully convinced about the importance of passing on the genes. Our ancestry all trace back to Adam and Eve and all humans share 99.9% same genes/DNA. In that sense, people who don't have kids still have their genes passed forward (because 99.9% of their genes/DNA is shared with someone else). God did command people to populate the Earth in the Old Testament, but in the New Testament Paul promotes the blessings of singlehood. When the disciples get disappointed that men cannot easily divorce their wives, and say it is better not to marry in that case, Jesus does not disagree. The Bible says: 11“Not everyone can accept this word,” He replied, “but only those to whom it has been given. 12For there are eunuchs who were born that way; others were made that way by men; and still others live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.” There is genealogy in the Bible, but all focused towards the coming of Jesus. The genealogy is provided to show that prophecy is fulfilled. There are all sorts of people in Jesus' lineage (note Jesus' lineage is though Joseph, there is no blood relations there).
 
Dude653

Dude653

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MsMediator said:
What do you think is the issue with the adoption system? When you say "modern version", are you speaking of the foster care system?

I personally don't see a problem with IVF if the egg and sperm belong to the couple. The Bible says that God knows the baby before the baby is formed in the womb. IVF is used as an aid, in my opinion. God is still forming the child, that's why not all IVF are successful. It gets more complicated with people using egg and sperm donors, and I can see why some people have an issue with it.

I am not fully convinced about the importance of passing on the genes. Our ancestry all trace back to Adam and Eve and all humans share 99.9% same genes/DNA. In that sense, people who don't have kids still have their genes passed forward (because 99.9% of their genes/DNA is shared with someone else). God did command people to populate the Earth in the Old Testament, but in the New Testament Paul promotes the blessings of singlehood. When the disciples get disappointed that men cannot easily divorce their wives, and say it is better not to marry in that case, Jesus does not disagree. The Bible says: 11“Not everyone can accept this word,” He replied, “but only those to whom it has been given. 12For there are eunuchs who were born that way; others were made that way by men; and still others live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.” There is genealogy in the Bible, but all focused towards the coming of Jesus. The genealogy is provided to show that prophecy is fulfilled. There are all sorts of people in Jesus' lineage (note Jesus' lineage is though Joseph, there is no blood relations there).
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Not everyone is capable of passing on their genes because some people have infertility issues and that's why some people want to adopt
 
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