Is Baptism necessary for Salvation?

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Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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Ok.
Now I get you.

What did Jesus say as to what saves us?
What did Paul say?

I trust scripture as well.
I assume you believe I would not be saved if I wasn't baptised before I died regardless of the the below

Romans 10:8-13
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

If one is not baptised before they die but have proclaimed the above then is the fact they are not baptised the unforgivable sin?

What did Jesus mean when he said that he had to go back to the Father so that the Holy Spirit must come to convict the world of its sin?
That sin of unbelief in him?

What about Jesus saying that those who believe in him and on him will never perish?

What about those who proclaimed faith and are baptised then walk away and renounced faith.

Are they saved because they were baptized?
I dont deal in exceptions. Of coarse there are extenuating circumstances.
One Scripture however does not stand alone but is in the context of the body of scripture. If one believes and confesses why under normal circumstances would he then reject the rest of scripture says. Because Jesus also said he who believes and is baptised will be saved.
 
Jun 28, 2022
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Yes...all angels are "sons of God"...and the spirits of regenerate believers, and Adam, and Jesus.
What do all these have in common for them to share this label: "sons of God"? ...they all come directly from the Father. Among the rest, Jesus is unique because He is uncreated.
By the definition of create, a human male baby was begotten,created by the creator, in Mary's womb.
God made himself in the human baby form just as he made Adam and Eve. Only this child was of and from God. And imbued with all that that means when compressed into this mortal coil.
 

Dirtman

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Jul 19, 2022
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The debate is not about baptism per se. It is about whether baptism is necessary for salvation.

The Bible is very clear that we are saved by God's grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption. Baptism FOLLOWS salvation, as we see over and over again in the Bible. It is a command of Christ (Mt 28:19), and may not be neglected or ignored (Acts 10:46-48).

But the "water" which Christ said was necessary for the New Birth (John 3:5) is the "water" of the Word of God (the Gospel). The "clean water" of God (Ezek 36:25) is His living Word, which is alive and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword (Heb 4:12,13). Hence this is what Peter says about being born again in 1 Peter 1:23-25: 23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the Word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 24 For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: 25 But the Word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the Word which by the Gospel is preached unto you.

So the metaphors used for Scripture are many. It is called water, it is called incorruptible seed, it is called the Sword of the Spirit, and it is called the power of God unto salvation.

When the Gospel -- the true and full Gospel -- is preached, it generates faith. At the same time the Holy Spirit uses the Gospel to convince and to convict. Then sinners repent and are converted and their sins are forgiven (Acts 3:19) and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and are saved (Acts 16:31). Then they receive the Holy Spirit (Ezek 36:27) and are born again. And the New Birth means a new heart and a new spirit (Ezek 36:26), which means a new creature (or creation) in Christ (2 Cor 5:17; Gal 6:15):. All this is supernatural and has nothing to do with ordinary H2O.

Therefore those who teach that water baptism is necessary for salvation are promoting a heresy. And those who claim that water baptism is necessary for resurrection are promoting a fantasy.
Why then did Jesus give the directive to baptise, why did Peter baptise saying "rise all of you and be baptised washing away your sins? Why did Philip baptise the eunuch? Why were entire families also baptised? Why has the church baptized from its founding to this day?
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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This is satire so try not to be offended. It does however explain simply what I personally believe about baptism.

 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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Why then did Jesus give the directive to baptise, why did Peter baptise saying "rise all of you and be baptised washing away your sins? Why did Philip baptise the eunuch? Why were entire families also baptised? Why has the church baptized from its founding to this day?
Did you understand a single word that I wrote? Please go back and CAREFULLY READ what is written and meditate upon it before any further response.
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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Did you understand a single word that I wrote? Please go back and CAREFULLY READ what is written and meditate upon it before any further response.
Don't be a jerk.
I asked you a series of questions in response to what you wrote?
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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The word "why" has a meaning I began my questions with the word "why".
 

Diakonos

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Jan 19, 2019
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31
Anacortes, WA
By the definition of create, a human male baby was begotten,created by the creator, in Mary's womb.
God made himself in the human baby form just as he made Adam and Eve. Only this child was of and from God. And imbued with all that that means when compressed into this mortal coil.
The body of Jesus was created, but not the person of Jesus. Agreed?
 
Jun 28, 2022
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The body of Jesus was created, but not the person of Jesus. Agreed?
The flesh and bone of the male human born to Mary was by definition a person.

While all of that which appeared as a human person was actually of and from the holy spirit we call, God.
 
Jun 28, 2022
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Why then did Jesus give the directive to baptise, why did Peter baptise saying "rise all of you and be baptised washing away your sins? Why did Philip baptise the eunuch? Why were entire families also baptised? Why has the church baptized from its founding to this day?
Because Jesus was a Jew. He and his disciples. And they were ministering to Jews who were well aware of the Mikvah.
Notice baptism follows after coming to salvation?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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This is satire so try not to be offended. It does however explain simply what I personally believe about baptism.

The thief on the cross. LOL. Why do people assume and assert he wasn't baptized? We do not know that.
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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No.

Do you worship a person?
John the Baptist said, he, Jesus was before him.
John the Apostle said he was the word that was with God and was God and through him all things were created.
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
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441
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The thief on the cross. LOL. Why do people assume and assert he wasn't baptized? We do not know that.
This video and the teaching in the video in the very next post describe perfectly what I believe about baptism. Because its what the Bible says about the subject.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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This video and the teaching in the video in the very next post describe perfectly
what I believe about baptism. Because its what the Bible says about the subject.
The Bible does not say whether the thief on the cross was baptized or not. To say he was not is an assumption.

One verse says all the region of Judea and all of Jerusalem were going out to him (John the
Baptist) and were being baptized by him in the Jordan river. He could have been one of them.