Who Justifieth the Ungodly
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Quit ripping verses out of context in order to prop up your dogma ...What is written in Romans 4:6-8 is to be understood in light of what is written in Romans 4:1-7. However, if you want to start reading in Romans 4:6-8, go back and read what David wrote in Psalm 32 in order to fully comprehend Romans 4:6-8:
Psalm 32:
1 Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.
2 Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
3 When I kept silence, my bones waxed old through my roaring all the day long.
4 For day and night thy hand was heavy upon me: my moisture is turned into the drought of summer. Selah.
According to verses 3-4 ... when David "kept silence" (did not acknowledge his sin before God), his sin bothered him to the core of his being. However, read verse 5:
5 I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.
6 For this shall every one that is godly pray unto thee in a time when thou mayest be found: surely in the floods of great waters they shall not come nigh unto him.
7 Thou art my hiding place; thou shalt preserve me from trouble; thou shalt compass me about with songs of deliverance. Selah.
When David acknowledged his sin and confessed to God, then his sin was forgiven ... then David considered God his hiding place where David was preserved from trouble.
Your problem is that you consider "faith" on the part of mankind to be "works" when God clearly tells us in His Word that faith is not works. Believe what God says about faith and quit holding to a dogma which contradicts what God holds true. Bring your thoughts into alignment with what is written in Scripture ... do not manipulate Scripture to conform to your thoughts.
With the exception of the Lord Jesus Christ, no one is "afore Righteous" ... righteousness is imputed when God tells us righteousness is imputed (and God tells us righteousness is imputed when we believe):
Romans
4:20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it [Abraham's faith] was imputed to him for righteousness.
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1 Therefore being justified by faith we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
what you think you "know" does not align with Scripture ...
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
again you rip Romans 3:24 from its context in order to prop up your erroneous dogma.Romans 3:
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus
those who believe (vs 22) are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus (vs 24).
a reading the full context in Romans 4 reveals the error of your dogma:
Romans
4:20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it [Abraham's faith] was imputed to him for righteousness.
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1 Therefore being justified by faith we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
Your quotes in this thread have...
a. Justification at the cross before one believes. (post 524)
b. Justification by Faith in time at their call by the Gospel (post 464)
that makes two, teacher.
1. One before they were born and
2. one at their call by the Gospel.
See, I do read!
a. Justification at the cross before one believes. (post 524)
b. Justification by Faith in time at their call by the Gospel (post 464)
that makes two, teacher.
1. One before they were born and
2. one at their call by the Gospel.
See, I do read!
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Justified before Faith and why !
Justified before believing and why ? Its so because, its by means of the act of another, that other is Christ Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Now why are those Christ died for Justified or made Righteous before God before they believe ? Its because they were prior to condemned by the act of Adam, acting as their head and representative, and so when he sinned in that capacity [as their Head /Representative], God imputed condemnation upon all men that he did represent Rom 5:18a, for they [the all men] did not at that time have an actual existence, and so its not an act of theirs [personally] that resulted in the passing of Judgment of condemnation upon them.
Now it is true that the condemnation incurred as per Rom 5:18a by the sin of Adam does become sensibly realized when by the Spirit we are convinced of sin [sinnership], however we were condemned prior to being made sensible to it, by the act of another Adam ; AND so likewise, it is true that the Justification given us in Christ Our Head and Representative, is revealed to God given Faith, however we were Justified by the act of another [Christ] before the sensible realization of it is given though Faith !
Now Adam was a figure/type of Him that was to come [Christ] who came also in a Covenant Head/ Representative Capacity, and scripture tells us that by His act or doing or obedience [Vs 18], that all those He represented, the Judgment and sentence of God passed upon them because of it, is that they are made or declared Righteous and given Justification of life, and this as with the figure Adam, even before they He represented had any being or physical existence, Rom 5:18-19. 8
Justified before believing and why ? Its so because, its by means of the act of another, that other is Christ Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Now why are those Christ died for Justified or made Righteous before God before they believe ? Its because they were prior to condemned by the act of Adam, acting as their head and representative, and so when he sinned in that capacity [as their Head /Representative], God imputed condemnation upon all men that he did represent Rom 5:18a, for they [the all men] did not at that time have an actual existence, and so its not an act of theirs [personally] that resulted in the passing of Judgment of condemnation upon them.
Now it is true that the condemnation incurred as per Rom 5:18a by the sin of Adam does become sensibly realized when by the Spirit we are convinced of sin [sinnership], however we were condemned prior to being made sensible to it, by the act of another Adam ; AND so likewise, it is true that the Justification given us in Christ Our Head and Representative, is revealed to God given Faith, however we were Justified by the act of another [Christ] before the sensible realization of it is given though Faith !
Now Adam was a figure/type of Him that was to come [Christ] who came also in a Covenant Head/ Representative Capacity, and scripture tells us that by His act or doing or obedience [Vs 18], that all those He represented, the Judgment and sentence of God passed upon them because of it, is that they are made or declared Righteous and given Justification of life, and this as with the figure Adam, even before they He represented had any being or physical existence, Rom 5:18-19. 8
Your quotes in this thread have...
a. Justification at the cross before one believes. (post 524)
b. Justification by Faith in time at their call by the Gospel (post 464)
that makes two, teacher.
1. One before they were born and
2. one at their call by the Gospel.
See, I do read!
a. Justification at the cross before one believes. (post 524)
b. Justification by Faith in time at their call by the Gospel (post 464)
that makes two, teacher.
1. One before they were born and
2. one at their call by the Gospel.
See, I do read!
That's one.
That's the other.
Two justifications per Brightfame documented. One by Grace alone before you believe and one by faith when you are called by the Gospel.
Take care, Brightfame.
That's the other.
Two justifications per Brightfame documented. One by Grace alone before you believe and one by faith when you are called by the Gospel.
Take care, Brightfame.
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