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Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
5,296
3,123
113
I am 96 and enjoying myself, but really of no use to anyone any more. Living with the Lord sounds like a wonderful life. I paint, and there is a painting I'd like to do first. Certainly, I am not afraid. I watched my father when he died, and there were angels to help him. I trust the Lord to take care of it completely.
I understand what you are saying, Blik. I had a heart problem about 3 years ago. They had to "reboot" my heart. In other words, stop it and start it again. What could possibly go wrong? So I had mixed emotions. I've not yet finished the race set before me. On the other hand, heaven sounds so appealing that I'd be happy to leave this world behind.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,843
1,854
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You raise great points and questions. The important point is to distinguish between God's irrevocable laws in both the Old and New Testaments, and the man made laws and traditions not of God. The Jewish elders of the Old Testament established many of their own laws and traditions, not of God, but of man. These are the laws that Paul speaks about in his epistles. The Jews/Pharisees/Scribes created their own customs/laws/teachings which were far from the hearts of God.

But, make no mistake. God's laws of the Old Testament are valid and haven't changed. And Jesus' fulfillment of the Old Testemant with the New Testament are one and valid. The whole point is to observe God's Law, and the manmade law/traditions of the Old Testament are not valid.
  1. Deuteronomy 27:26
    Cursed is the one who does not confirm all the words of this law by observing them.’ “And all the people shall say, ‘Amen
  2. Galatians 3:10
    For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”
  3. James 2:10
    For whoever shall keep the wholelaw, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all
So how well are you actually keeping the law as required?
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,843
1,854
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It is up to you to discern God's law, His Will, from both the Old and New Testament. Ask for the Holy Spirit to guide you. Without the guidance of the Holy Spirit you will never be able to ascertain God's will or his commandments. But remember this, Jesus told us that all God's will and commandments are fulfilled with love of God and neighbor. In the parable of the Good Samaritan, Jesus told us that if we love God and neighbor we shall inherit eternal life. How much clearly could Jesus have put it?
You just hit it there.
Jesus gave you the law of love.

We are not “Good” because we follow the law. The law condemns us, because we have failed and continue to fail tp keep it as required.

We are good (morally good) because we follow the law of love.

It is the root of obedience, because if you love someone you will never begin the downfall that leads to breaking one of the commandments.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,843
1,854
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Ignorant post, God in the Old Testament is the same God as in the New Testament, unchangable. His laws and His will are forever.
Yep

And no one in the OT kept the law. And the only one in the NT who kept it was Christ.

His law does not change

cursed is the one who does not obey every word. Every jot and tittle.

Stumble in one area, and your guilty.
 
J

JohnChamberlain

Guest
1- The Christian Bible is not a religion.
2- Come as you are, all are equally welcome.
3- Your dues have already been paid.
4- Peace beyond understanding is your reward.

So...., WHAT IS IT?
It is to live by grace and grace alone. All our transgressions have been wiped off the slate by the blood of Jesus Christ, Amen!
 
Dec 22, 2021
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Christianity is the faith and life of being a disciple of Jesus Christ. A Christian is not a disciple of Moses!

Before the Law of Moses, men would be obeying by instinct the commands of Law, as is described by Paul:

"For when Gentiles who have no Law obey by natural instinct the commands of the Law, they, without having a Law, are a Law to themselves; since they exhibit proof that a knowledge of the conduct which the Law requires is engraven on their hearts, while their consciences also bear witness to the Law, and their thoughts, as if in mutual discussion, accuse them or perhaps maintain their innocence—" (Rom 2:14-15, Weymouth)

Sin existed in the world before the law because of the sense of right and wrong was written on their hearts, therefore people then died; yet they did not sin in violating the like command given to Adam:

"Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:— for until the law sin was in the world; but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the likeness of Adam's transgression, who is a figure of him that was to come." (Rom 5:12-14, ASV)

The Old Covenant, the Law of Moses was given to Israel alone in a specific time frame and location:

"And what great nation is there, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?" (Deut 4:8, ERV)
"These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai." (Lev 27:34, ERV)

Our justification is based on "the promise of the Spirit through faith" and not annulled by the Law:

"Now to Abraham were the promises spoken, and to his seed. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. Now this I say; A covenant confirmed beforehand by God, the law, which came four hundred and thirty years after, doth not disannul, so as to make the promise of none effect." (Gal 3:16-17, ERV)

Moses prophesied that there was a prophet to come to whom they were to listen, who is Jesus:

"Moses indeed said, A prophet shall the Lord God raise up unto you from among your brethren, like unto me; to him shall ye hearken in all things whatsoever he shall speak unto you. And it shall be, that every soul, which shall not hearken to that prophet, shall be utterly destroyed from among the people." (Acts 3:22-23, ERV)

Gentile Christians, the disciples, were not put under the Law of Moses:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, that ye should put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that we shall be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, in like manner as they." (Acts 15:10-11, ERV)

Jesus said in Matthew 5:17-18 that he would fulfil, complete and accomplish all the Law and he did so at the cross:

"When Jesus had received the wine, he said, 'It is finished.' Then he bowed his head and gave up his spirit." (John 19:30, NRSV)

"he has cancelled the bond which was outstanding against us with its legal demands; he has set it aside, nailing it to the cross." (Col 2:14, REB)

"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;" (Eph 2:14-15, KJV)

"In speaking of “a new covenant,” he has made the first one obsolete. And what is obsolete and growing old will soon disappear." (Heb 8:13, NRSV)
*we know the first Covenant included the 10 Commandments (words)
"He was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the ten commandments." (Exod 34:28, NRSV)

"But even if we or an angel from heaven should proclaim to you a gospel contrary to what we proclaimed to you, let that one be accursed! As we have said before, so now I repeat, if anyone proclaims to you a gospel contrary to what you received, let that one be accursed!" (Gal 1:8-9, NRSV)
 
J

JAPOV

Guest
I am 96 and enjoying myself, but really of no use to anyone any more. Living with the Lord sounds like a wonderful life. I paint, and there is a painting I'd like to do first. Certainly, I am not afraid. I watched my father when he died, and there were angels to help him. I trust the Lord to take care of it completely.
My great grandmother passed when she was 96. I thought I knew her well, but everybody started telling stories about her when she was gone lol. If I were you, I'd get to work on my autobiography! With pictures and commentary to keep the stories straight! :)
 
J

JAPOV

Guest
Christianity is the faith and life of being a disciple of Jesus Christ. A Christian is not a disciple of Moses!

Before the Law of Moses, men would be obeying by instinct the commands of Law, as is described by Paul:

"For when Gentiles who have no Law obey by natural instinct the commands of the Law, they, without having a Law, are a Law to themselves; since they exhibit proof that a knowledge of the conduct which the Law requires is engraven on their hearts, while their consciences also bear witness to the Law, and their thoughts, as if in mutual discussion, accuse them or perhaps maintain their innocence—" (Rom 2:14-15, Weymouth)

Sin existed in the world before the law because of the sense of right and wrong was written on their hearts, therefore people then died; yet they did not sin in violating the like command given to Adam:

"Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:— for until the law sin was in the world; but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the likeness of Adam's transgression, who is a figure of him that was to come." (Rom 5:12-14, ASV)

The Old Covenant, the Law of Moses was given to Israel alone in a specific time frame and location:

"And what great nation is there, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?" (Deut 4:8, ERV)
"These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai." (Lev 27:34, ERV)

Our justification is based on "the promise of the Spirit through faith" and not annulled by the Law:

"Now to Abraham were the promises spoken, and to his seed. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. Now this I say; A covenant confirmed beforehand by God, the law, which came four hundred and thirty years after, doth not disannul, so as to make the promise of none effect." (Gal 3:16-17, ERV)

Moses prophesied that there was a prophet to come to whom they were to listen, who is Jesus:

"Moses indeed said, A prophet shall the Lord God raise up unto you from among your brethren, like unto me; to him shall ye hearken in all things whatsoever he shall speak unto you. And it shall be, that every soul, which shall not hearken to that prophet, shall be utterly destroyed from among the people." (Acts 3:22-23, ERV)

Gentile Christians, the disciples, were not put under the Law of Moses:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, that ye should put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that we shall be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, in like manner as they." (Acts 15:10-11, ERV)

Jesus said in Matthew 5:17-18 that he would fulfil, complete and accomplish all the Law and he did so at the cross:

"When Jesus had received the wine, he said, 'It is finished.' Then he bowed his head and gave up his spirit." (John 19:30, NRSV)

"he has cancelled the bond which was outstanding against us with its legal demands; he has set it aside, nailing it to the cross." (Col 2:14, REB)

"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;" (Eph 2:14-15, KJV)

"In speaking of “a new covenant,” he has made the first one obsolete. And what is obsolete and growing old will soon disappear." (Heb 8:13, NRSV)
*we know the first Covenant included the 10 Commandments (words)
"He was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the ten commandments." (Exod 34:28, NRSV)

"But even if we or an angel from heaven should proclaim to you a gospel contrary to what we proclaimed to you, let that one be accursed! As we have said before, so now I repeat, if anyone proclaims to you a gospel contrary to what you received, let that one be accursed!" (Gal 1:8-9, NRSV)
This is a great outline! I would only add that Romans 2, 14-15 should be proof that "ALL MEN" were created in God's image.:cool:
 
Dec 22, 2021
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This is a great outline! I would only add that Romans 2, 14-15 should be proof that "ALL MEN" were created in God's image.:cool:
An excellent point! I keep my outlines and notes in various folders and I'll make that addition. Thanks.
 

GRACE_ambassador

Well-known member
Feb 22, 2021
3,197
1,601
113
Midwest
Romans 2, 14-15 should be proof that "ALL MEN" were created in God's image.
Huh?

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

Wouldn't that be ONE man, Adam "was Created In God's Image," and AFTER "the
fall into sin," the rest of ALL men (Excluding JESUS, Of Course), were CONCEIVED
into the "fallen" image?

Just sayin' or asking...
 
Dec 22, 2021
41
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Huh?

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

Wouldn't that be ONE man, Adam "was Created In God's Image," and AFTER "the
fall into sin," the rest of ALL men (Excluding JESUS, Of Course), were CONCEIVED
into the "fallen" image?

Just sayin' or asking...
"Then God said, ‘Let us make human beings in our image, after our likeness, to have dominion over the fish in the sea, the birds of the air, the cattle, all wild animals on land, and everything that creeps on the earth.’ God created human beings in his own image; in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." (Gen 1:26-27, REB)

"For your own lifeblood I will surely require a reckoning: from every animal I will require it and from human beings, each one for the blood of another, I will require a reckoning for human life. Whoever sheds the blood of a human, by a human shall that person’s blood be shed; for in his own image God made humankind." (Gen 9:5-6, NRSV)
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
You just hit it there.
Jesus gave you the law of love.

We are not “Good” because we follow the law. The law condemns us, because we have failed and continue to fail tp keep it as required.

We are good (morally good) because we follow the law of love.

It is the root of obedience, because if you love someone you will never begin the downfall that leads to breaking one of the commandments.
So right, the law of love leads you to obedience of the ten commandments.

The law of love is the spirit of the law, it is the law as God gives us the law. There is love in the ten commandments. If you love you do not murder, steal, bare false witness, etc. You could obey by the letter of the law and disobey by the spirit of the law. Christ pointed to the original law, the law as it was from God. God is love.
 
Nov 23, 2021
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Christianity is to the majority one of several religions in the world which focuses on Jesus Christ , others being Budda in Buddhism , Mohammed in Islam , Confuses in Confucianism . Whether Christianity is about Christ Jesus in Spirit and Truth is a whole different animal. To the Catholic the Pope is the Head of the Church and Protest( ants) are heretics. To the Protestant Jesus is the Head of the Church and the Pope is . I'll save that one for later.
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
5,219
2,618
113
London
christianchat.com
I’d rather just boast in Christ and leave the battle with Satan to Jesus.

I just got to make “the decision” to hand the battle to Jesus Christ…. that’s it! That’s the ONLY part I get to do…. “I choose Jesus Christ!”

Jesus takes it from there! :love:(y)
well my size is Jesus ... but I'm not sure our part is entirely passive
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
well my size is Jesus ... but I'm not sure our part is entirely passive
Following Jesus isn't passive, it is something we do. It is like following a wonderful beautiful road with the world of sin at its edges. We have a magic key, and that key is "repent". That is a word meaning to wish to follow on the road, and it results in grace. The law is made up of God's love and it is like borders on the road. It is put in our hearts and minds, and we feed it with the word. It lights up our road and we follow Christ who rules it.
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
6,886
3,631
113
well my size is Jesus ... but I'm not sure our part is entirely passive
If Jesus wants to fight my enemies then who am I to tell Him I’d rather do it?!!!

Why not hand ALL the battles over to Jesus Christ? If there’s something He wants me to do, He’ll tell me.

King Jehoshaphat only had to sing and praise the Lord and then collect all the spoil after God destroyed the enemy….so, why not give our battles to the Lord?!
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
Same God operating a different covenant with a different people ... we should not be ignorant of that.
Right, and we need to be aware of the sameness and the differences -----how it is different.

It was all the same, except it was the prophesy of Christ who gave forgiveness, that forgiveness was fulfilled in Christ. The law was in stone, made up of rules. The rules didn't change but the delivery did. God is spirit, God is love, and true law is of God. The law in stone could be obeyed by the letter of the law without the spirit, Christ brought the Holy Spirit to our minds and heart and the law reflected that.
 
Nov 23, 2021
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What is Christianity ? To Whom ? At one point in my life it was people hiding in the shadows in the church up the hill. Later after my conversion it was something else. Christianity is different things to different people . I think What is following Jesus? or What does a personal relationship with Jesus entail? or How do you please God ?or What is the duty of the beiiever would be a better way of asking rather than what is Christianity ?

Micah 6:8
King James Version

8 He hath shown thee, O man, what is good: and what doth the Lord require of thee but to do justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?
 

KALYNA18

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2016
1,700
371
83
God is holy, we who belong to him, the bible says, " Be ye therefore holy, for without holiness no man shall see the Lord. "" You could find this scripture, it just came as I read this. Christian is a title. Your life is not a title. Lot's of them, titled as one, say they went to church as Christians, but never accepted Christ, personally. Christian to me is not a name a born again believer is, it's a title, but we are new creatures, a peculiar people, adopted and engrafted, it's more than just that word, We can't live in that title. Like any other religion, if they aren't' obedient than their just not obedient Christians. It's more than a word. Ty.