Controlling the eyes from lust

I'm sorry but I think provocative dressing is wrong whether someone do it intentionally or not. What you are saying is "when a woman from Brazil come to India she'll draw lot of attention that's not her issue because it's ok in her country". That's a nono because she is making someone else sinning. My understanding is that there is one standard modesty and any saved woman would be guided by God to dress like that may be step by step but she'll reach that modest appearance in the end. Also there are men who intentionally look at a woman with lust no matter how modest she has dressed up in that case what you said may be applicable that the guilt will only fall on men. But if a woman says I dress like this because it's ok in my region and I don't carry any guilt that's not possible.

You know that dressing is not like this a decade ago in our country. It has been changed by following films and celebrities. You know how good Indian women dressed back in days. And I don't see any reason for changing our cultural dressing but still things have changed and it changed in a bad way. And in past 2 years it has gone really worse that television channel show something equivalent to porn every 5 minutes. I have never seen inner wear advertisements this much exposed in our country since childhood. This is becoming new normal now like it's ok to dress this way in public there's nothing wrong in exposing the body a little bit. No my sister it's not normal no matter how many people get used to it, sin is sin.

I have no problem with appropriate dressing.

Yes that's what I'm saying. It's on man's nature to fall for these things and I don't think women can ever understand that.

A sane person who has seen topless tribes exist and show respect for the bond of marriage would have to ask is it the breasts that are sexual, or the caressing and fondling of the breasts that is sexual? I'm not going to debate that our culture has sexualized breasts because certainly in most western nations the breasts (at least women's breasts, bare chested men seem much more acceptable and much less sexually provocative in our culture) are considered a sexual part of the body. But I think it's debatable that they are inherently so in all cultures. The cold hard biological fact of breasts is that they're special glands for providing milk to babies and there isn't a logical reason (granted human being are not purely logical) why they would be any more inherently sexual than a cow's or goat's udders.

I think you've got it backwards. It's not that it's ok for the Brazilian woman to run around topless in India because it's ok in her country (though she may need a good local friend to explain to her that it's not cool to do so). But rather that the visitor to her area of Brazil shouldn't think that all the topless women running around are being immodest or signaling sexual availability or interest.

No one is arguing that women shouldn't be modest. We're arguing that modesty is often culturally defined and therefore not an exact universal standard that can be applied to everyone. Though personally my general rule of thumb is cover everything between the shoulders and the knees (except maybe for swimwear).

No...
Men don't have to fall for these things.
A woman doesn't cause anyone to sin by the way she is dressed.

No one can cause someone else to sin...that's got logical fallacy written all over it.

If I bake a cake and it looks inviting and tempting...and someone grabs at it with their bare hands destroying it...is that my fault, the cake's fault, or the glutton's fault?

Well to me if a man of God is falling because of a women's dressing no matter what her culture defines modesty to be she has been a cause of sin and she will carry guilt. There's this man of God in my state who literally sees every girls as his own daughter, such a sweet person once went to USA or idk for sure but there he saw a girl wearing something inappropriate to church and he said "I was disturbed by that, if I a man of father age is disturbed by this what level of temptation would she cause to youngsters of her church, so dress modestly my daughters". It is after his message i realised no matter where you live a woman carry responsibility for what she wear. God has given most rules for humans also some rules for women and men seperately.

Yes one person can make another person sin by posing temptation. That's what satan has been doing all the time duh!.. he tempts believers to do something if they yield sin. Let's make it clear with your cake example. You said you made the cake tempting the intention of that cake is to tempt the person who sees it but if you have kept the cake in a safe place instead of putting it in a place making it look like anyone can eat it nobody is gonna touch it. And if a person eats the cake even after knowing it's yours, it will fall under stealing. In that case you won't carry any guilt because you made a cake that looks appealing to you but someone else misused it. But this example of yours can't be used for lust because God through apostle paul didn't say run away from baked cakes instead he said youthful lust so I have used your spoiled example to make my point valid now that's spoiled too just like your cake😉.

And dear brother/sister you definitely can't use tribes and ancestors as an excuse to support being topless and carry no guilt. There are tribes out there which don't have any idea what marriage relationship is they will literally do intercourse like animals and there are tribes which practice cannibalism. Kindly think before choosing an example. It would be really great if you take examples from scripture

By this logic, a beautiful woman had better never leave her house. She's almost guaranteed to pose a temptation to some guy out there who likes beautiful women a bit too much. How evil of her.

Or maybe it makes more sense for everyone to take responsibility for themselves (so yeah, everyone should dress modestly and not oogle other people, even if they're dressed like they're asking for it) and use the standard of a generic average person in their time and place when considering how their choices will affect others.

you can wear special glasses that stop you from looking at women and lusting after them

I think they are called 'Ray Bans' or something like that

If you are having trouble with your eyes, I'd recommend seeing an optometrist.

Exactly. It's a habit, and given enough time habits will change

On going topless...dont generally do it here as its too cold, but sometimes its necessary to get your boob out to feed a baby.

A lot of mothers try and do it discreetly in public (some room set aside for that purpose) as its not really that fun to do it in the toilets.

apparently there is a nudist park somewhere in the suburbs near me (its called a naturist club) and there are some designated nudist beaches, but in general, here ladies dont walk round naked.

I found that even clothed, some men can be rude and stare at you like you are a piece of meat. I also think for many women its actually harder to be beautiful and attractive because its like you are a bone to a dog. There is nothing much a bone can do except be hidden away in the ground, but we women actually need to go out and do stuff.

So maybe its on the dog to control himself and stop drooling.

Or I know..go to Jesus, look to the cross and die to your flesh. You'll be free and then wont have this problem. If Jesus can get rid of sin, then its likely that you wont sin as well because well, thats the miracle of believing.

Recall that when Jesus went to stay with Mary and Martha he was teaching them, he wasnt ogling them. Then some people were like why is Jesus friends with a sinful woman? eg Mary Magdalene. And He was like shes been forgiven.

I think some were expecting Jesus and Mary to be like...they could only ever be together for one reason. she's a prostitute! Why is he even eating with her? Well they were wrong.

Do you even understand logical fallacy?

So because I didn't cover my cake I'm now the guilty person?

You have just claimed that God is guilty of sin by making women beautiful by extension.

I never talked about girl's beauty. Idk why you're totally Changing the topic. A beautiful girl isn't the problem here, you literally suported girls going topless. That is the problem don't divert from the subject.

Wowww lol why are you both taking the term beauty now. Beauty isn't the problem here. And I said you cake example can't be used for this because desiring a cake is stealing but woman is different. Just don't try to change the topic.

Lo I said I am not lusting. I don't enjoy it if you can't understand the problem it's ok. Thanx for trying to help though.

Ya totally agree on that and I'm trying on it.