Ask In The Name Of Jesus And It Will Be Given

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2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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John 14:13-14 NLT - "You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!"

Friends, I'm wondering what you might think of Paul when he prayed that the Lord would remove the "thorn" in his "flesh" - a messenger of Satan (three times), but the Lord essentially said "No."

Jesus said that he would grant whatever was asked in His Name, yet Paul's prayer request was denied. Can we come up with a logical explanation for this?

Thanks!!
 
Gardenias

Gardenias

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Praise God, what a wonderful question.

Let's look at Paul first,not as an apostle but as a Jew. He was taught in the best of schools by the best of scholars.
He had an amazing zeal for God and all that was Jewish.

Here in ch.12 Paul is talking about visions and revelations that he saw of the Lord during a 14 yr search.
He will not name himself as the man who was caught up into the third heavens.( What a place with the Lord that must have been!)

According to him this man was caught up( raptured) to paradise ( remember Jesus told the thief on the cross,this day shalt thou be with me in paradise)

Here the wonders and glories and the words he heard were against the law to be spoken

Paul warred constantly with his FLESH for things the flesh desired to do. It is extensive in Romans this battle.
To keep the flesh under control he knew he could not glory for GLORY BELONGS UNTO GOD ONLY.

We all have battles of the flesh but I'm thinking Paul's were much more intense BC of his background and pride in his former life's accomplishments.
So to me by his way of suffering for Christ he used his infirmities for control over pride and hautiness.

To keep the flesh under control for the Spirit to thrive to accomplish what the Lord called him to do,he was given a thorn in the flesh.

Look at a thorn prickly and buried deep in the flesh,it hurts and throbs,gets red and swollen to the point you think of amputation of that member....ouch

Paul said it was given to him,the messenger of Satan to buffet him or keep pushing against his flesh.( to keep it under subjection). The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak!

Now we don't know first off whether Paul prayed for something to help him with his flesh so he might not get exhalted. We do know Paul prayed and sought the Lord to remove it 3 times.

I have heard over the yrs so much speculation as to what this " thorn' was. Paul doesn't say but it kept him humble.

The Lord spoke,I believe this is the second recording of direct conversation with Jesus. On his way to persecute the Christians and here......Jesus words are so beautiful...v 9. My GRACE IS SUFFICIENT FOR THEE: for my strength is made perfect in weakness.

So Paul astute as ever yielded and gloried rather in his infirmities ( weaknesses,suffering,tribulations ect), that the POWER of CHRIST may rest upon him.

Paul has said I AM CRUCIFIED WITH CHRIST....Ga.2:20
That Christ might glory in him.
 
C

Charlie24

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Oct 31, 2021
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2ndTimothyGroup said:
John 14:13-14 NLT - "You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!"

Friends, I'm wondering what you might think of Paul when he prayed that the Lord would remove the "thorn" in his "flesh" - a messenger of Satan (three times), but the Lord essentially said "No."

Jesus said that he would grant whatever was asked in His Name, yet Paul's prayer request was denied. Can we come up with a logical explanation for this?

Thanks!!
Click to expand...
It was not God's will that the "thorn in the flesh" be removed from Paul, it was for an intended purpose.

If a believer needs and can't afford an automobile, and prays for a Cadillac that may not be Gods will, you may end up with a Ford or Chevy, but you got the transportation.

Asking God for something must be in His will for your life. What you think you need or want may not be good for you and God knows.

But to get back to scripture, if you back up a verse you will see that Christ is speaking of the works that the believer will do for Christ.

This concerns the spiritual purpose of God for man, the asking of from God in Jesus' name is more predicated on this spiritual work than the literal. It is actually concerning the power the believer will need to accomplish the business of God, but the literal needs are not exempt and in many cases essential for the spiritual work.
 
M

montana123

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Oct 9, 2021
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2ndTimothyGroup said:
John 14:13-14 NLT - "You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!"

Friends, I'm wondering what you might think of Paul when he prayed that the Lord would remove the "thorn" in his "flesh" - a messenger of Satan (three times), but the Lord essentially said "No."

Jesus said that he would grant whatever was asked in His Name, yet Paul's prayer request was denied. Can we come up with a logical explanation for this?

Thanks!!
Click to expand...
In Paul's case he was given a thorn in the flesh to keep him humble because of all the revelations God shows him and worked mightily in his life.

Which God resists the proud but gives grace unto the humble and if Paul would of got arrogant thinking he was something special for God working in his life God could not use him like He would want.

When we ask Jesus for something we are not asking to have any harm come to us so it is something we need for spiritual edifying or our physical needs.

And Paul did not ask for a thorn in the flesh but it was given him for if we are not humble God can find a way to humble us.

Because God would not take the thorn away Paul said he shall glory in his infirmities for when he is weak then he is strong for the power of Christ rests upon him.

In John 17 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to only ask the Father and He will do it.

But in John 14 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to ask Him and He will do it.

Why would Jesus say only ask the Father and then say ask Him.

Explain.
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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Gardenias said:
Sorry that was so long!
Click to expand...
Oh, Gardenias! I have no rules! You are allowed to write as much as you like, particularly since you are kind and gentle in your words. And what's more, I love your energy! For example, I loved it when you wrote: "What a place with the Lord that must have been!"

That's what I like . . . to see people imagine; to place themselves in the shoes of others. As I have read the Bible in a timeline, chronological order several times now, I do my utmost best to place myself into the middle of the story. I want to hear what was heard, I envision what was seen, feel what was felt, and even smell what was taken it. Frankly, I wished I had done that before just five years ago when I believe my heart was Purified by Christ. Thank you!

As for your wonderful message, I'm going to have to read it again, and perhaps a couple more times. I'll respond more later . . . I promise. :)
 
C

Charlie24

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montana123 said:
In Paul's case he was given a thorn in the flesh to keep him humble because of all the revelations God shows him and worked mightily in his life.

Which God resists the proud but gives grace unto the humble and if Paul would of got arrogant thinking he was something special for God working in his life God could not use him like He would want.

When we ask Jesus for something we are not asking to have any harm come to us so it is something we need for spiritual edifying or our physical needs.

And Paul did not ask for a thorn in the flesh but it was given him for if we are not humble God can find a way to humble us.

Because God would not take the thorn away Paul said he shall glory in his infirmities for when he is weak then he is strong for the power of Christ rests upon him.

In John 17 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to only ask the Father and He will do it.

But in John 14 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to ask Him and He will do it.

Why would Jesus say only ask the Father and then say ask Him.

Explain.
Click to expand...
I know you didn't ask me, but I can tell you what I was taught on why in this scripture Jesus said to ask Him.

In my previous post I mentioned this is a prayer more so for the spiritual Work of Christ.

When Jesus taught us to pray He said to ask the Father in my name, but here He says to ask in His name that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

It refers to the spiritual work the believer will do from vs. 12. The Father will be glorified in the spiritual work of the believer by what Christ has done for mankind. In other words, the plan of God is being carried out as He intended for man with the glory being given to Him.
 
soberxp

soberxp

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2ndTimothyGroup said:
John 14:13-14 NLT - "You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!"

Friends, I'm wondering what you might think of Paul when he prayed that the Lord would remove the "thorn" in his "flesh" - a messenger of Satan (three times), but the Lord essentially said "No."

Jesus said that he would grant whatever was asked in His Name, yet Paul's prayer request was denied. Can we come up with a logical explanation for this?

Thanks!!
Click to expand...
My understanding is even Jesus has retained some human's weakness, not to mention us and Paul ?
 
wattie

wattie

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#9
2ndTimothyGroup said:
John 14:13-14 NLT - "You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!"

Friends, I'm wondering what you might think of Paul when he prayed that the Lord would remove the "thorn" in his "flesh" - a messenger of Satan (three times), but the Lord essentially said "No."

Jesus said that he would grant whatever was asked in His Name, yet Paul's prayer request was denied. Can we come up with a logical explanation for this?

Thanks!!
Click to expand...
God isn't a cosmic santa claus or giant lolly giver, so we dont get whatever we want.

God gives according to His will and our spiritual need.

Paul's thorn in the flesh would only last on earth. Then he is in heaven forever with Jesus. So God has that eternal perspective.

Sometimes also these frailties and disabilities allow us to relate to others with similar problems. God could use Paul's thorn in the flesh as an example of his humanity to others to testify of Jesus' healing power to save the soul over the flesh.
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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#10
Feb 20, 2021
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#10
Gardenias said:
Praise God, what a wonderful question.

Let's look at Paul first,not as an apostle but as a Jew. He was taught in the best of schools by the best of scholars.
He had an amazing zeal for God and all that was Jewish.

Here in ch.12 Paul is talking about visions and revelations that he saw of the Lord during a 14 yr search.
He will not name himself as the man who was caught up into the third heavens.( What a place with the Lord that must have been!)

According to him this man was caught up( raptured) to paradise ( remember Jesus told the thief on the cross,this day shalt thou be with me in paradise)

Here the wonders and glories and the words he heard were against the law to be spoken

Paul warred constantly with his FLESH for things the flesh desired to do. It is extensive in Romans this battle.
To keep the flesh under control he knew he could not glory for GLORY BELONGS UNTO GOD ONLY.

We all have battles of the flesh but I'm thinking Paul's were much more intense BC of his background and pride in his former life's accomplishments.
So to me by his way of suffering for Christ he used his infirmities for control over pride and hautiness.

To keep the flesh under control for the Spirit to thrive to accomplish what the Lord called him to do,he was given a thorn in the flesh.

Look at a thorn prickly and buried deep in the flesh,it hurts and throbs,gets red and swollen to the point you think of amputation of that member....ouch

Paul said it was given to him,the messenger of Satan to buffet him or keep pushing against his flesh.( to keep it under subjection). The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak!

Now we don't know first off whether Paul prayed for something to help him with his flesh so he might not get exhalted. We do know Paul prayed and sought the Lord to remove it 3 times.

I have heard over the yrs so much speculation as to what this " thorn' was. Paul doesn't say but it kept him humble.

The Lord spoke,I believe this is the second recording of direct conversation with Jesus. On his way to persecute the Christians and here......Jesus words are so beautiful...v 9. My GRACE IS SUFFICIENT FOR THEE: for my strength is made perfect in weakness.

So Paul astute as ever yielded and gloried rather in his infirmities ( weaknesses,suffering,tribulations ect), that the POWER of CHRIST may rest upon him.

Paul has said I AM CRUCIFIED WITH CHRIST....Ga.2:20
That Christ might glory in him.
Click to expand...
Ok . . . so I took the time to look into the 2nd Corinthians passages that you referenced and was able to track and follow exactly what you were saying. And . . . I think that what you wrote was wonderful. I love how you placed those passages and thoughts together. Clearly, you are doing your utmost best to understand the Word of God.

Thank you!
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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Feb 20, 2021
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Charlie24 said:
It was not God's will that the "thorn in the flesh" be removed from Paul, it was for an intended purpose.

If a believer needs and can't afford an automobile, and prays for a Cadillac that may not be Gods will, you may end up with a Ford or Chevy, but you got the transportation.

Asking God for something must be in His will for your life. What you think you need or want may not be good for you and God knows.

But to get back to scripture, if you back up a verse you will see that Christ is speaking of the works that the believer will do for Christ.

This concerns the spiritual purpose of God for man, the asking of from God in Jesus' name is more predicated on this spiritual work than the literal. It is actually concerning the power the believer will need to accomplish the business of God, but the literal needs are not exempt and in many cases essential for the spiritual work.
Click to expand...
Hmmm . . . I realize that you have these things worked out in your mind, and I'm sure that you're onto something. However, I'm not sure that I entirely follow without additional conversation.

I think that what's throwing me off is the "ask for anything."
 
C

Charlie24

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2ndTimothyGroup said:
Hmmm . . . I realize that you have these things worked out in your mind, and I'm sure that you're onto something. However, I'm not sure that I entirely follow without additional conversation.

I think that what's throwing me off is the "ask for anything."
Click to expand...
Not sure what you mean.
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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montana123 said:
In Paul's case he was given a thorn in the flesh to keep him humble because of all the revelations God shows him and worked mightily in his life.

Which God resists the proud but gives grace unto the humble and if Paul would of got arrogant thinking he was something special for God working in his life God could not use him like He would want.

When we ask Jesus for something we are not asking to have any harm come to us so it is something we need for spiritual edifying or our physical needs.

And Paul did not ask for a thorn in the flesh but it was given him for if we are not humble God can find a way to humble us.

Because God would not take the thorn away Paul said he shall glory in his infirmities for when he is weak then he is strong for the power of Christ rests upon him.

In John 17 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to only ask the Father and He will do it.

But in John 14 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to ask Him and He will do it.

Why would Jesus say only ask the Father and then say ask Him.

Explain.
Click to expand...
Pride. Ego. I agree with you and gardenias, that it was his rather large thinking of himself that he struggled with the most. Paul did speak about the things he could boast of, and it was extremely painful for him when he did. He hated talking about the things he did, or experienced that "qualified" him is several different ways. I'm sure that Paul simply wanted people to believe the things that he said, but not because of his experiences or amazing qualifications.

I would think that Paul knew that not all physical healings were to be given, for that is not the Purpose of Christ. The Purpose and Work of Christ revolves around Spiritual healing . . . the removal of the effect of the fall of Adam. The fact that the Lord said, "My Grace is sufficient for you, this seems to be the focus of his point, and not the thorn in the flesh.

In my opinion, "we" spend far too much time thinking about what that thorn might be instead of coming to an understanding of what, exactly, Grace is. Whatever that thorn is, the Grace of God is bigger, better, and more important. That Grace, in my opinion, is the four basic Works of Christ.

Grace is:

1. - The removal of the Curse of the Lord (or, the Sinful Nature)
2. - Enables a person to Turn and Repent
3. - Sends the Gift of the Holy Spirit
4. - Jesus on the Cross pays the debt for our sins, and taking the Curse applied to us and applying it to Himself

Of all the Gracious things God could do for a person, the above four Works are the greatest of them all.

I surely appreciate your thoughts on this. Thank you!
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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montana123 said:
In John 17 Jesus said when He resurrects to heaven to only ask the Father and He will do it.
Click to expand...
Chapter 17 is amazing. Glad I read it again. However, were you thinking of a different chapter? I didn't see anything about asking the Father to do anything (or maybe the translation I have is just worded differently).
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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Charlie24 said:
I know you didn't ask me, but I can tell you what I was taught on why in this scripture Jesus said to ask Him.

In my previous post I mentioned this is a prayer more so for the spiritual Work of Christ.

When Jesus taught us to pray He said to ask the Father in my name, but here He says to ask in His name that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

It refers to the spiritual work the believer will do from vs. 12. The Father will be glorified in the spiritual work of the believer by what Christ has done for mankind. In other words, the plan of God is being carried out as He intended for man with the glory being given to Him.
Click to expand...
I think I'm starting to get your collective points . . . including verse 12.

And by the way, I have no rules in my threads. You are free to talk about whatever you want and respond to what others have said and even asked of me. I"m here to learn and grow . . . not control and manipulate. :)
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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soberxp said:
My understanding is even Jesus has retained some human's weakness, not to mention us and Paul ?
Click to expand...
Thank you for this offering. But . . . Jesus having weakness doesn't seem to fit with an Almighty, Powerful God. Would it be fair to suggest that Christ had willingly stripped Himself of Godly Power? I may not understand what you mean, exactly, but I want to. In my mind, a weakness might be considered like a weak spot in a metal beam, and it is at that weak spot that the metal beam might collapse under pressure, perhaps like a collapsing bridge.

Be sure to correct me if I'm not reading you right!
 
2ndTimothyGroup

2ndTimothyGroup

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wattie said:
God isn't a cosmic santa claus or giant lolly giver, so we dont get whatever we want.

God gives according to His will and our spiritual need.
Click to expand...
Agreed. For example, who in the Bible asks God to allow them to never die? We must all die, hence, a prayer that could never be granted. Personally, I do ask that my cancer would be lifted, and I know that He can do it, but I don't expect it. In fact, if the Lord should leave me with cancer, I will use it in my life, somehow, to show His Power, if not my full and total Trust in Him.

Honestly, I could care less if I have cancer. The Lord can take my life however He chooses . . . it makes no difference to me.
 
C

Charlie24

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2ndTimothyGroup said:
"You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it . . ."
Click to expand...
The "anything" must be taken in context with vs. 12.

In other words, the "anything" is referring to the spiritual "anything" in relation to the work He spoke of in vs. 12.

It's not speaking of anything you desire, but what is needed for the work.
 
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