How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

Paul added to that: "Whether in the body, I cannot tell. "

Since Christ himself says no one ascended, that means no one. As an example read up on stories of people on LSD--what they see is REAL to them. Just as real if you or I were standing in front of them.

1 Corinthians 16:19 says this: "19 The churches in the province of Asia send you greetings. Aquila and Prisca greet you warmly in the Lord, and so does the church that meets at their house."

Is there a reason why you inserted that reference? Just wondering...


Maybe it was a "typo"?? (I've made very many of those myself!! lol)


[my Post #49 should read: "Dan12:13 'BLESSED' " ]

Oh I stand correcteed..
God Bless!!

They need their own thread.
The grand canyon leaps of amil are never, ever, going to be agreed on.

Waste of time.

"not having received the promises"......undoubtedly speaking exclusively to Abraham Isaac and Jacob.

The promises given to Abraham of Genesis 12, 13, 15, 17 and 22.
Confirmed to Isaac Genesis 26.
Confirmed to Jacob Genesis 28, and 46.

We need to pray for these people. I don't know how you get on that track to begin with but when you do........it seems extremely difficult to get back on the right one.

I will never understand how anyone could possibly trampled underfoot all of those promises made to the patriarchs and the nation Israel. I mean it is literally throwing two thirds of the Bible into the trash can.....

Angela53510 The word itself was a Mistransliteration by Jerome with that level of thinking there's no words at all.because there was no English words I know what he ment He took poetic licence with the word harpazo and used the word rapture to be overwhelmed with joy awe,,greatfulness..He ment the joy of being taken by god.

Yes, I know and I corrected that to Hebrews 13 in another post.

No you've got that all wrong. Not even close. You woud do well to read some commentaries on the matter.

Did you forget about this bit...?
"Who is in heaven"......better yet check out the Greek.

" Philip was taken by the Holy Spirit" "Suddenly took Philip away".......

Perfect example of a lesser type for THE ultimate rapture thank you. Our rapture will just be ALL Christians and a greater distance lol. And before the 70th week of Daniel/wrath of God begins of course.

"Our rapture?" 🤔

Let’s begin again. What did Jesus say about His return and when that would be?

Matthew 24:29-31
The Coming of the Son of Man
29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Revelation 11:15 Immediately after the tribulation
Seventh Trumpet: The Kingdom Proclaimed
15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!”

Our gathering together to Christ is referred to as the "rapture" by some. Personally, I prefer it as written in the Bible, “Our Gathering.”

It's definitely mine and I truly pray that it is yours as well.....

How so? Here is the scripture with the list of those 'by faith'--Abel, Enoch, , Noah, Abraham and Sarah
(note it only says Enoch was translated-it does NOT he was translated to heaven, btw),


11 Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for.
3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.
4 By faith Abel brought God a better offering than Cain did. By faith he was commended as righteous, when God spoke well of his offerings. And by faith Abel still speaks, even though he is dead.
5 By faith Enoch was taken from this life, so that he did not experience death: “He could not be found, because God had taken him away.”[a] For before he was taken, he was commended as one who pleased God. 6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
7 By faith Noah, when warned about things not yet seen, in holy fear built an ark to save his family. By his faith he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness that is in keeping with faith.
8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going. 9 By faith he made his home in the promised land like a stranger in a foreign country; he lived in tents, as did Isaac and Jacob, who were heirs with him of the same promise. 10 For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God. 11 And by faith even Sarah, who was past childbearing age, was enabled to bear children because she[b] considered him faithful who had made the promise. 12 And so from this one man, and he as good as dead, came descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as countless as the sand on the seashore.
13 All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance, admitting that they were foreigners and strangers on earth. 14 People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. 15 If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 Instead, they were longing for a better country—a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.

Also Divine Water Mark tried to say Enoch was somehow a category to himself, however these verses are bookended by Abel and Sarah--then in verse 13 it says "All these people were still living by faith when they died.

Adding to this that CV5 has truncated the verse--who is he trying to fool here?

Here is the rest of the story:

…38And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water, and Philip baptized him. 39 When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord carried Philip away, and the eunuch saw him no more, but went on his way rejoicing. 40But Philip appeared at Azotus and traveled through that region, preaching the gospel in all the towns until he came to Caesarea.…Act 8:38-39

I think it's important to highlight what happened right before the seventh angel sounds and we all gather to Jesus.

Revelation 11:3-15

3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”
4 These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the [a]God of the earth. 5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner. 6 These have power to shut heaven, so that no rain falls in the days of their prophecy; and they have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to strike the earth with all plagues, as often as they desire.
The Witnesses Killed
7 When they finish their testimony, the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will make war against them, overcome them, and kill them. 8 And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also [b]our Lord was crucified. 9 Then those from the peoples, tribes, tongues, and nations [c]will see their dead bodies three-and-a-half days, and not allow their dead bodies to be put into graves. 10 And those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them, make merry, and send gifts to one another, because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth.
The Witnesses Resurrected
11 Now after the three-and-a-half days the breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and great fear fell on those who saw them. 12 And [d]they heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, “Come up here.” And they ascended to heaven in a cloud, and their enemies saw them. 13 In the same hour there was a great earthquake, and a tenth of the city fell. In the earthquake seven thousand people were killed, and the rest were afraid and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past. Behold, the third woe is coming quickly.
Seventh Trumpet: The Kingdom Proclaimed
15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The [e]kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!”

And here is more--I was unaware of this verse, but it helps confirm that Elijah did not go to heaven (only he was seen taken up into the air--the first 'heaven'--according to scripture there are three)

Elijah carried away

Obadiah speaking to Elijah when he is trying to escape from Ahab who is seeking to kill him

“ And it shall come to pass, as soon as I am gone from thee, that the Spirit of the Lord shall carry thee whither I know not; and so when I come and tell Ahab, and he cannot find thee, he shall slay me: but I thy servant fear the Lord from my youth.”_1st Kings 18:12

Commentary:
And it shall come to pass...Clearly Obadiah regards Elijah’s concealment as only possible, amid such a thorough inquiry, by reason of divine aid. This may be exercised again, and he be taken away and concealed, before Ahab can be brought to him.
https://biblehub.com/commentaries/1_kings/18-12.htm

More opposition to plain Bible truth from Laura. Are you here to troll or simply sow the seeds of doubt and confusion? But so that no one listens to Laura's NONSENSE, I will post Scripture to refute the above statement which makes God a liar:
And it came to pass, when the LORD would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal. (2 Kings 2:1)

And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. (2 Kings 2:11)

So the real issue is "What causes people to flatly deny what is in the Bible?"

2 Kings 2 bsb -

12 As Elisha watched, he cried out, “My father, my father, the chariots and horsemen of Israel!” And he saw Elijah no more. So taking hold of his own clothes, he tore them in two.

13 Elisha also picked up the cloak that had fallen from Elijah, and he went back and stood on the bank of the Jordan. 14 Then he took the cloak of Elijah that had fallen from him and struck the waters. “Where now is the LORD, the God of Elijah?” he asked.

And when he had struck the waters, they parted to the right and to the left, and Elisha crossed over.


15 When the sons of the prophets who were facing him from Jericho saw what had happened, they said, “The spirit of Elijah rests on Elisha.” And they went to meet him and bowed down to the ground before him.

16 “Look now,” they said to Elisha, “we your servants have fifty valiant men. Please let them go and search for your master. Perhaps the Spirit of the LORD has taken him up and put him on one of the mountains or in one of the valleys.”

“Do not send them,” Elisha replied.

17 But when they pressed him to the point of embarrassment, he said, “Send them.”

And they sent fifty men, who searched for three days but did not find Elijah.

18 When they returned to Elisha, who was staying in Jericho, he said to them, “Didn’t I tell you not to go?”




[that last line... LOL!]

That is not how it works. The Bible is not a textbook of theology, and Bible truth is to be discerned spiritually.

1. So the first question is this: "In the Bible is Christ presented to us as the divine Bridegroom, and is the Church presented to us as the Bride of Christ, which will ultimately become the wife of the Lamb?" The answer should be obvious.

2. The second question is this: "Does the Marriage of the Lamb take place on earth or in Heaven (God's Heaven)" And once again the answer is obvious from Revelation 19.

3. The third question is this: "Does the Marriage of the Lamb occur just before the Second Coming of Christ to earth WITH His saints and angels?" And once again the answer is obvious from Revelation 19.

4. Therefore, in order for the saints to come with Christ at His Second Coming it was absolutely necessary for all of them to be in Heaven for the Marriage of the Lamb.

5. And since the Marriage of the Lamb in Heaven occurs while the Great Tribulation is proceeding on earth, it should be obvious that the Rapture CANNOT be after the Tribulation. Therefore the Resurrection/Rapture occurs BEFORE the Tribulation and Great Tribulation. So when Christ spoke about the Rapture in John 14:1-3, He IMPLIED that it would be before the Tribulation. And that is the answer to your question.

6. Consequently the Post-Tribulation Rapture theory is total nonsense and should be discarded out of hand. It does make Christ a liar.