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throughfaith

Well-known member
#1
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#1
1) Salvation is a free gift . And this free gift is permanent.

2) To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions. For Maturing , being useful for others, and the furthering of the gospel.

Most Christians do not know how how to reconcile these two points .

Oh the muddy waters in this area .
Most threads on here involve this issue . Any thread that is overtly labouring on water baptism , Repentance , obedience, and such ,is usually a red flag that someone is confused about these ' two things '
A red flag ,because they inevitably want to get you into 'conditional salvation ' . Blurring the lines between Point 1) and point 2) above
Thoughts ?
 
U

Unearthed

Active member
#2
May 18, 2021
200
70
28
#2
Yes salvation is a free gift however I do not believe it is unconditional.
If it were unconditional then everybody would be saved and there would be no purpose for following Jesus.

We must have faith that Jesus is who He is in order to be saved.
 
Aidan1

Aidan1

Well-known member
#3
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
#3
Unearthed said:
Yes salvation is a free gift however I do not believe it is unconditional.
If it were unconditional then everybody would be saved and there would be no purpose for following Jesus.

We must have faith that Jesus is who He is in order to be saved.
Click to expand...
But is this an reaction ore an condition?
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#5
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#5
Unearthed said:
Yes salvation is a free gift however I do not believe it is unconditional.
If it were unconditional then everybody would be saved and there would be no purpose for following Jesus.

We must have faith that Jesus is who He is in order to be saved.
Click to expand...
The prerequisite is 1cor 1.21 .
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#6
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,773
113
#6
throughfaith said:
To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions.
Click to expand...
This remark shows that you neither understand the Gospel nor salvation.

SALVATION IS CONDITIONAL! It requires (1) repentance toward God and (2) faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21).

So unless you properly understand the Gospel, you will continue to post inane threads.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#7
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#7
Nehemiah6 said:
This remark shows that you neither understand the Gospel nor salvation.

SALVATION IS CONDITIONAL! It requires (1) repentance toward God and (2) faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21).

So unless you properly understand the Gospel, you will continue to post inane threads.
Click to expand...
As I've been through this a million times on here ,I do forget however people's attention span is very short . I'm not referring to receiving Jesus
I'm referring Eternal security . I believe the prerequisite to recieve Jesus and the Holy Spirit and all the blessings that come with that is . 1cor 1.21 . Romans 10.9 . 1 cor 15 ,1-4 . Eph 1.13 . Simple . John 1.12 .
I do not believe in Lordship salvation. Which in some form or another front loads or back loads ' works ' into it .
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#8
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#8
Nehemiah6 said:
This remark shows that you neither understand the Gospel nor salvation.

SALVATION IS CONDITIONAL! It requires (1) repentance toward God and (2) faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21).

So unless you properly understand the Gospel, you will continue to post inane threads.
Click to expand...
" To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions." This should have made it clear that I'm referring to after receiving Jesus, not prior to it .
 
F

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#9
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
1,213
113
#9
Nehemiah6 said:
This remark shows that you neither understand the Gospel nor salvation.

SALVATION IS CONDITIONAL! It requires (1) repentance toward God and (2) faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21).

So unless you properly understand the Gospel, you will continue to post inane threads.
Click to expand...
Repentance only comes from those that have already been born again and heaven as their inheritance. The natural man as described in 1 Cor 2:14 will not, and even cannot, repent of breaking a spiritual law that he can not discern. Eternal salvation by God's sovereign grace.
 
Aidan1

Aidan1

Well-known member
#10
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
#10
Unearthed said:
?
Click to expand...
For to recieve salvation. If it is a free gift, then it has to be unconditional.
But it has to accept through faith. This is a reaction. I am not shure that you can call it a condition. You know what I mean?
 
CherieR

CherieR

Senior Member
#11
May 6, 2017
2,271
1,429
113
#11
throughfaith said:
1) Salvation is a free gift . And this free gift is permanent.

2) To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions. For Maturing , being useful for others, and the furthering of the gospel.

Most Christians do not know how how to reconcile these two points .

Oh the muddy waters in this area .
Most threads on here involve this issue . Any thread that is overtly labouring on water baptism , Repentance , obedience, and such ,is usually a red flag that someone is confused about these ' two things '
A red flag ,because they inevitably want to get you into 'conditional salvation ' . Blurring the lines between Point 1) and point 2) above
Thoughts ?
Click to expand...
I believe that obedience flows out from a heart that loves God. It is not perfect for we all sin. But “we love because he first loved us”( 1 John 4:19 NIV)
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#12
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#12
CherieR said:
I believe that obedience flows out from a heart that loves God. It is not perfect for we all sin. But “we love because he first loved us”( 1 John 4:19 NIV)
Click to expand...
Yes our love and motivation is because of his love , assurance and security that he has given and promised to us . Not given because we deserve it or can merit it ,but because of his love. This is what motivates a believer . Grace . Obedience? Is that the best word to use ? I don't know. Obeying from the heart maybe a little closer to the point. The book of philippians is a great insight on this. Serving selflessly for the furtherance of the Gospel because we have Eternal security because of assurance . We have salvation Guaranteed because of the sealing of the Holy Spirt . We have it ,now work out ' it ' for the furtherance of the gospel.
 
CherieR

CherieR

Senior Member
#13
May 6, 2017
2,271
1,429
113
#13
throughfaith said:
Yes our love and motivation is because of his love , assurance and security that he has given and promised to us . Not given because we deserve it or can merit it ,but because of his love. This is what motivates a believer . Grace . Obedience? Is that the best word to use ? I don't know. Obeying from the heart maybe a little closer to the point. The book of philippians is a great insight on this. Serving selflessly for the furtherance of the Gospel because we have Eternal security because of assurance . We have salvation Guaranteed because of the sealing of the Holy Spirt . We have it ,now work out ' it ' for the furtherance of the gospel.
Click to expand...
I like that wording grace obedience. What good thing may we give to God that has not been given to us? Nothing. It is the fruit of the Spirit in Galatians 5:22-23 for it is Jesus work in the heart and life of a believer. It is not something one can truly take credit for. It is a gift from God.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#14
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
113
#14
throughfaith said:
As I've been through this a million times on here ,I do forget however people's attention span is very short . I'm not referring to receiving Jesus
I'm referring Eternal security . I believe the prerequisite to recieve Jesus and the Holy Spirit and all the blessings that come with that is . 1cor 1.21 . Romans 10.9 . 1 cor 15 ,1-4 . Eph 1.13 . Simple . John 1.12 .
I do not believe in Lordship salvation. Which in some form or another front loads or back loads ' works ' into it .
Click to expand...

Not sure why people are afraid of good works?? I love good works - I don't have to either front or back load them into salvation, because to me salvation is deliverance not only from hell, but it is also deliverance from a life of service and slavery to sin and the Devil.
Good works are so intertwined with the beautiful salvation that God gives to us. What a gift when we believe in the atoning death of His Son!

I am not sure why anyone would not want Jesus' Lordship? Maybe it is because He is misunderstood as a mean, ugly judge or taskmaster!? He is not that at all! Try Him out, and you will find the kindest, most loving, the most gentle Master you ever met!

I proudly hail Jesus as my Lord, my Redeemer, and my God!
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

Senior Member
#15
Jul 2, 2011
21,425
6,704
113
#15
Chester said:
Not sure why people are afraid of good works?? I love good works - I don't have to either front or back load them into salvation, because to me salvation is deliverance not only from hell, but it is also deliverance from a life of service and slavery to sin and the Devil.
Good works are so intertwined with the beautiful salvation that God gives to us. What a gift when we believe in the atoning death of His Son!

I am not sure why anyone would not want Jesus' Lordship? Maybe it is because He is misunderstood as a mean, ugly judge or taskmaster!? He is not that at all! Try Him out, and you will find the kindest, most loving, the most gentle Master you ever met!

I proudly hail Jesus as my Lord, my Redeemer, and my God!
Click to expand...
Amen. So beutifully worded.. it makes me so happy and sad. More tears for that vial. Thank you...again, Beautiful.
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#16
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#16
Chester said:
Not sure why people are afraid of good works?? I love good works - I don't have to either front or back load them into salvation, because to me salvation is deliverance not only from hell, but it is also deliverance from a life of service and slavery to sin and the Devil.
Good works are so intertwined with the beautiful salvation that God gives to us. What a gift when we believe in the atoning death of His Son!

I am not sure why anyone would not want Jesus' Lordship? Maybe it is because He is misunderstood as a mean, ugly judge or taskmaster!? He is not that at all! Try Him out, and you will find the kindest, most loving, the most gentle Master you ever met!

I proudly hail Jesus as my Lord, my Redeemer, and my God!
Click to expand...
That's not ' Lordship salvation '
.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#17
Sep 4, 2013
30,675
6,865
113
#17
throughfaith said:
1) Salvation is a free gift . And this free gift is permanent.

2) To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions. For Maturing , being useful for others, and the furthering of the gospel.

Most Christians do not know how how to reconcile these two points .

Oh the muddy waters in this area .
Most threads on here involve this issue . Any thread that is overtly labouring on water baptism , Repentance , obedience, and such ,is usually a red flag that someone is confused about these ' two things '
A red flag ,because they inevitably want to get you into 'conditional salvation ' . Blurring the lines between Point 1) and point 2) above
Thoughts ?
Click to expand...
The confusion (IMO) comes because a whole lot of Christians do not know the difference between Salvation and Sanctification. As well, there are a number of people who do not believe in the indwelling presence of the Holy Ghost, which is necessary for a Christian to move from a "carnal" believer to a "spiritual" believer as the Apostle Paul taught. There are people who do not believe in the Holy Trinity. Some believe the "written" Word (Bible) is the "Comforter" Jesus promised to send.

To be perfectly honest, I struggle to understand how people who do not believe in the Holy Trinity, or the indwelling presence of the Holy Ghost can be included in the Christian Church. I thank God that it is not up to me to determine their salvation. That power belongs COMPLETE TO GOD/JESUS.

But, this is how so many arguments come about here on the BDF.

I do not see how to resolve the issue because people have their beliefs, Denominational teachings so ingrained that they refuse to believe they could be wrong.

A day is coming when the wheat will be separated from the chafe, and I fear many, many will be heartbroken on that day........

Matthew, Chapter 7:

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

Senior Member
#19
Jul 2, 2011
21,425
6,704
113
#19
Chester said:
He sure is my Lord and I surely am saved!
Click to expand...
Same here. It seems there is a vein of participants in the forum very anxious to assert new titles to teachings we all know..

Every knee, including my own, will boe, every tongue confess that Jesus, Yeshua, is Lord. He is the Messiah, amen.
 
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throughfaith

Well-known member
#20
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#20
Chester said:
He sure is my Lord and I surely am saved!
Click to expand...
' Lordship salvation 'is not " Yay I say Jesus is My Lord " . Or " Yes Jesus is God " . No its a belief that you have to MAKE Jesus Lord of your life . If Your not making Jesus Lord of all then you not saved at all . Its a focus on your 'works 'to prove your saved . Including making Jesus Lord ..
 
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