Two things .

[JaumeJ]

' Lordship salvation 'is not " Yay I say Jesus is My Lord " . Or " Yes Jesus is God " . No its a belief that you have to MAKE Jesus Lord of your life . If Your not making Jesus Lord of all then you not saved at all . Its a focus on your 'works 'to prove your saved . Including making Jesus Lord ..

Stop the arguing over words and seeking fault in all others due to your new to the Bible perception of a phrase. What can Lord mean other than your long drawn-out decision as to what it means.
Lord means Lord. Your lordship doctrine is just a bit ridiculous, sinca ll who claim Jesus, Yeshua, know He is God. Stop the splitting of hairs and get with the Word.

 

[Hungry]

1) Salvation is a free gift . And this free gift is permanent.

2) To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions. For Maturing , being useful for others, and the furthering of the gospel.

Most Christians do not know how how to reconcile these two points .

Oh the muddy waters in this area .
Most threads on here involve this issue . Any thread that is overtly labouring on water baptism , Repentance , obedience, and such ,is usually a red flag that someone is confused about these ' two things '
A red flag ,because they inevitably want to get you into 'conditional salvation ' . Blurring the lines between Point 1) and point 2) above
Thoughts ?

I think it’s humorous how your second statement completely cancels itself. If your unconditional salvation requires actions then it is by definition…. conditional.

Yes most people who don’t know how salvation works, don’t know, that they don’t know. Unless you have been born spiritually and have experienced the transformation you really can’t fathom the concepts. It would be like a bunch of people blind from birth being told that there is this visual sense. You can see a person from across a field. You can see the hundreds of colours and hues and shades. Beauty takes on new meaning with shapes and symmetry. Then as it is being described vividly, their imagination concocts new thoughts and feelings about this sense and the more people who describe it, the more real it becomes. Then they think that these thoughts and feelings are what sight must be, and it excites them, and they think they see. It isn’t until their eyes are truly open that they see how blind they were. What they thought was sight was a fake representation.

Spiritual birth is your eyes being truly opened. The biggest problem is that once people think they found salvation they stop looking for it and get lost in their blindness.

 

[throughfaith]

Stop the arguing over words and seeking fault in all others due to your new to the Bible perception of a phrase. What can Lord mean other than your long drawn-out decision as to what it means.
Lord means Lord. Your lordship doctrine is just a bit ridiculous, sinca ll who claim Jesus, Yeshua, know He is God. Stop the splitting of hairs and get with the Word.

John Macarthur is famous for writing a book on this ( In defense of it ) Just type it in and get with the programme . Type in 'Lordship salvation 'and Ray comfort ' , Get with the programme . Type 'Lordship salvation Calvinism works salvation ' get with the programme . Have you been in a cave for the last 40 years ?

 

[throughfaith]

I think it’s humorous how your second statement completely cancels itself. If your unconditional salvation requires actions then it is by definition…. conditional.

Yes most people who don’t know how salvation works, don’t know, that they don’t know. Unless you have been born spiritually and have experienced the transformation you really can’t fathom the concepts. It would be like a bunch of people blind from birth being told that there is this visual sense. You can see a person from across a field. You can see the hundreds of colours and hues and shades. Beauty takes on new meaning with shapes and symmetry. Then as it is being described vividly, their imagination concocts new thoughts and feelings about this sense and the more people who describe it, the more real it becomes. Then they think that these thoughts and feelings are what sight must be, and it excites them, and they think they see. It isn’t until their eyes are truly open that they see how blind they were. What they thought was sight was a fake representation.

Spiritual birth is your eyes being truly opened. The biggest problem is that once people think they found salvation they stop looking for it and get lost in their blindness.

I think it’s humorous how your second statement completely cancels itself. If your unconditional salvation requires actions then it is by definition…. conditional.

Yes most people who don’t know how salvation works, don’t know, that they don’t know. Unless you have been born spiritually and have experienced the transformation you really can’t fathom the concepts. It would be like a bunch of people blind from birth being told that there is this visual sense. You can see a person from across a field. You can see the hundreds of colours and hues and shades. Beauty takes on new meaning with shapes and symmetry. Then as it is being described vividly, their imagination concocts new thoughts and feelings about this sense and the more people who describe it, the more real it becomes. Then they think that these thoughts and feelings are what sight must be, and it excites them, and they think they see. It isn’t until their eyes are truly open that they see how blind they were. What they thought was sight was a fake representation.

Spiritual birth is your eyes being truly opened. The biggest problem is that once people think they found salvation they stop looking for it and get lost in their blindness.

To do something with the salvation we already have was the point .To do something with 'eternal security '. 'To do something with what we have that cannot be lost ect ect .

 

[JaumeJ]

John Macarthur is famous for writing a book on this ( In defense of it ) Just type it in and get with the programme . Type in 'Lordship salvation 'and Ray comfort ' , Get with the programme . Type 'Lordship salvation Calvinism works salvation ' get with the programme . Have you been in a cave for the last 40 years ?

John McArthur is not mentione as a prophet to come, nor is anything any man writes today an addition to God's Word. Get with the Word, and if you wish to quote anyone, make certain they are abvailble for discussion. Otherwise you may be in idolatry.

 

[throughfaith]

John McArthur is not mentione as a prophet to come, nor is anything any man writes today an addition to God's Word. Get with the Word, and if you wish to quote anyone, make certain they are abvailble for discussion. Otherwise you may be in idolatry.

The writers of the bible are aware of false teachings of their day and so such we be . If you don't know about them ,how will you avoid them ?

 

[JaumeJ]

The writers of the bible are aware of false teachings of their day and so such we be . If you don't know about them ,how will you avoid them ?

You are teaaching people not to rely on the Word as preserved by the Father, and this is wickedness.

You nor I may cherry pick authors of books on faith as reliable. This is only done by the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit has not given any writings to be added to the Word, for it is complete from the first day of creation until th e Final Trump. If you knew the Word, you would already know this.

Stop misleading people into false prophets and prophecies. This is nto to be done if you are here to aactually discuss the Word.

 

[throughfaith]

You are teaaching people not to rely on the Word as preserved by the Father, and this is wickedness.

You nor I may cherry pick authors of books on faith as reliable. This is only done by the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit has not given any writings to be added to the Word, for it is complete from the first day of creation until th e Final Trump. If you knew the Word, you would already know this.

Stop misleading people into false prophets and prophecies. This is nto to be done if you are here to aactually discuss the Word.

//You are teaaching people not to rely on the Word as preserved by the Father, and this is wickedness.//
What are you talking about? The bible warns us to watch out for false teaching. 'Lordship salvation ' as taught by calvinistic proponents is false teaching. It leads people to look to thier own works instead of Jesus .

 

[AandW]

But is this an reaction ore an condition?

God gives you the Faith to believe and then He invites you to become a part of His family. All we have to do with what God gives [Faith to believe] and the Invitation [to become part of His Family] is to say, Yes/No. It's clearly a Condition on God's part and a Reaction on our part to choose Yes/No,

 

[throughfaith]

God gives you the Faith to believe and then He invites you to become a part of His family. All we have to do with what God gives [Faith to believe] and the Invitation [to become part of His Family] is to say, Yes/No. It's clearly a Condition on God's part and a Reaction on our part to choose Yes/No,

Does he give everyone the faith to believe?

 

[JaumeJ]

Any with faith have received it from the Father. No man can come to Jesus, Yeshua, unless the Father draws him to Him.

 

[CherieR]

' Lordship salvation 'is not " Yay I say Jesus is My Lord " . Or " Yes Jesus is God " . No its a belief that you have to MAKE Jesus Lord of your life . If Your not making Jesus Lord of all then you not saved at all . Its a focus on your 'works 'to prove your saved . Including making Jesus Lord ..

There can be different things meant by make Jesus Lord of your life. One meaning may just be receiving Jesus as your Lord. It may be acknowledging his Lordship/Kingship. It can be asking Jesus to be Lord in your heart and life.

If you use the phrase make Jesus Lord as a way of promoting this idea of you have to do certain good things ( example read Bible, be generous, volunteering etc) or avoiding doing sin in order to saved, this I would disagree with.

Salvation is a gift of God. You cannot add to the work of Christ on the cross to pay for sins. Jesus is enough. He doesn’t need help in the salvation of his people.

 

[pottersclay]

What I believe is missing here is understanding God's grace.
By faith we are saved through grace.
Faith should change your whole perspective in the ways of thinking and doing.
It is coming in agreement with God. That you are a sinner in need of a savior.
That there is a one and only one living God. That his ways are just and holy.
Many can believe that jesus died for their sins, that he is the son of God, that's not faith it's just belief.
We are instructed to "follow him" do as he did, continue the ministry and to prepare for his soon return.

Now about that grace......
God chooses not to remember your sins as only he can do. It's not that he looks the other way or gives us a get out of jail free card. Nor does he just forget...but he chooses to forget.
The same free choices we make on this earth God also has a choice .
Grace has a time limit but his grace is limitless. For he can save to the outermost.
God's grace is sufficient. It endures and is long suffering.
Now then what if God chooses not to forget...for who councils the Lord?
Did he not say I will have mercy on who he chooses?
Not everyone that says... Lord..Lord ..shall enter in ....but those who do the father's will.

 

[AandW]

Does he give everyone the faith to believe?

Christ died for everyone. Therefore He will give each person a chance to believe or deny Him.

 

[Jocund]

1) Salvation is a free gift . And this free gift is permanent.

2) To do something with your unconditional salvation requires actions. For Maturing , being useful for others, and the furthering of the gospel.

Most Christians do not know how how to reconcile these two points .

Oh the muddy waters in this area .
Most threads on here involve this issue . Any thread that is overtly labouring on water baptism , Repentance , obedience, and such ,is usually a red flag that someone is confused about these ' two things '
A red flag ,because they inevitably want to get you into 'conditional salvation ' . Blurring the lines between Point 1) and point 2) above
Thoughts ?

Is this a question of saved by works vs saved by grace?

 

[Chester]

Is this a question of saved by works vs saved by grace?

We are saved by grace through faith, not of works: we are HIS workmanship. That is clearly what the Bible says.

The above is very different than saying that works have zero to do with salvation.