By Works

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J

Jackson123

Senior Member
#1,141
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
#1,141
I forget to say

Salvation not by work, because as soon as people accept Jesus and die in the next second, he save. Accept Jesus mean invite Jesus in our heart and Jesus in us Will make us bear fruit and the fruit of the Holy spirit is love.
But I believe we still have a free Will that is why after invite Jesus in our heart, we still sin, not that Jesus in our heart produce sin, but our free Will is.
We still have a free Will to chose a job that may not His Will or to take the mark If the beast, again It doesn't mean Jesus in our heart teach us to take the mark If the beast

Matt 24
10 And then many will fall away[a] and betray one another and hate one another. 11 And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray.

Fall away from what?
 
Rosemaryx

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
#1,142
May 3, 2017
3,756
4,119
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#1,142
dcontroversal said:
I would answer, but no longer have any value after you were turned against us!
Click to expand...
Hi @dcontroversal ...
Thank you for at least acknowledging my post , but I want to ask you Who is the us that I have turned against ? , I have turned against no one , I have been reading the Word and seeing things deeper than what is under the ink...
I have been learning Scripture and would like to sometimes ask questions , but to be honest as I have said in another thread , the thought of being attacked for what I am finding , keeps me holding close to my heart for it being trampled on by you and your followers , but I do not see how I have been turned against you , and who has turned me against you ?...

Should you no longer come along side of me , your sister in Christ to explain with answer to my question that I posted above , instead I feel as if you through me a side instead of helping me , that is not very brotherly , we should help each other in love and truth , but you chose to disregard me...

And @EleventhHour , could you not find in your heart to use the agree symbol or like symbol on DC post , no , you would rather use the great ribbon symbol , the medal symbol , and I believe it delights your heart , and that is sad , you also could of come a long side of me and helped by given an answer to my honest question , but you to left me wondering , your action speak for itself...
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#1,144
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#1,144
Rosemaryx said:
Hi @dcontroversal ...
Thank you for at least acknowledging my post , but I want to ask you Who is the us that I have turned against ? , I have turned against no one , I have been reading the Word and seeing things deeper than what is under the ink...
I have been learning Scripture and would like to sometimes ask questions , but to be honest as I have said in another thread , the thought of being attacked for what I am finding , keeps me holding close to my heart for it being trampled on by you and your followers , but I do not see how I have been turned against you , and who has turned me against you ?...

Should you no longer come along side of me , your sister in Christ to explain with answer to my question that I posted above , instead I feel as if you through me a side instead of helping me , that is not very brotherly , we should help each other in love and truth , but you chose to disregard me...

And @EleventhHour , could you not find in your heart to use the agree symbol or like symbol on DC post , no , you would rather use the great ribbon symbol , the medal symbol , and I believe it delights your heart , and that is sad , you also could of come a long side of me and helped by given an answer to my honest question , but you to left me wondering , your action speak for itself...
Click to expand...
11 liking whatever dcon post is to be expected.

I am curious though, Has she ever disagreed with dcon before in this forum?
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,145
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
113
#1,145
Jackson123 said:
So after you genuinely save in the past,

1. There is no possibility to do sin, example killing, robing the bank raping etc or

2. You believe after you genuinely save in the past, killing, raping, robing the bank is only lose reward but go to heaven
Click to expand...
You missed what I was saying by the statement I made: "It is not good news (to me) if I have to live a life of good works to keep proving to those around me that I was really genuinely saved at a point in time in the past."

The person who believes in "once saved always saved" and lives their life on that philosophy has to keep on doing good works to be able to keep proving to those around them that they were really genuinely saved. But that is not what I believe.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#1,146
#1,146
Rosemaryx said:
Hi @dcontroversal ...
Thank you for at least acknowledging my post , but I want to ask you Who is the us that I have turned against ? , I have turned against no one , I have been reading the Word and seeing things deeper than what is under the ink...
I have been learning Scripture and would like to sometimes ask questions , but to be honest as I have said in another thread , the thought of being attacked for what I am finding , keeps me holding close to my heart for it being trampled on by you and your followers , but I do not see how I have been turned against you , and who has turned me against you ?...

Should you no longer come along side of me , your sister in Christ to explain with answer to my question that I posted above , instead I feel as if you through me a side instead of helping me , that is not very brotherly , we should help each other in love and truth , but you chose to disregard me...

And @EleventhHour , could you not find in your heart to use the agree symbol or like symbol on DC post , no , you would rather use the great ribbon symbol , the medal symbol , and I believe it delights your heart , and that is sad , you also could of come a long side of me and helped by given an answer to my honest question , but you to left me wondering , your action speak for itself...
Click to expand...

The ribbon was for "no longer have any value"
I believe that to be true.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,147
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
113
#1,147
throughfaith said:
Your making the mistake of not realising Jesus has died for all sins . All our sins , past, present and future. Sin is no longer a issue , even for unbelievers.
Click to expand...
Jesus died for the sins of all people: maybe that is what you are saying here?

Forgiveness is available for everyone for sins they have committed.

Those who are in Christ Jesus have been forgiven of all past sins and are ongoingly forgiven if they do commit sin.

There is no Scripture that says that the sins that a believer commits tomorrow are already forgiven .
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#1,148
#1,148
Guojing said:
11 liking whatever dcon post is to be expected.

I am curious though, Has she ever disagreed with dcon before in this forum?
Click to expand...
Why would I disagree with anything that pertains to OSAS, Not By Works and the faulty dogma of Calvinism, where I spend the majority of my time where he and many others are aligning with scripture?
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,149
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
113
#1,149
Jackson123 said:
If you ask my opinion, every body who believe in Jesus that has been Lie or kill, as long he repent, go to heaven.

But Seem to me you believe after accepting Jesus, keep killing still go to heaven, only reduce his reward, don't you

You don't believe a branch that not bear fruit Will be Cut and burn, so you not agree with Jesus
John 15:6
Click to expand...
The error in what you say above is that he goes to heaven "as long as he repent". Yes, the believer does need to repent and it is part of the process of the Christian life and living for God. But forgiveness is not because of our actions and response: but because of Jesus' blood sacrifice at Calvary.

I used to think that God wrote down all my sins against me, and until I confessed and repented of each one, only then would he forgive them. But God does not accuse the believer; the Devil is the "accuser of the brethren"!
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#1,150
#1,150
Rosemaryx said:
Hi @dcontroversal ...
Thank you for at least acknowledging my post , but I want to ask you Who is the us that I have turned against ? , I have turned against no one , I have been reading the Word and seeing things deeper than what is under the ink...
I have been learning Scripture and would like to sometimes ask questions , but to be honest as I have said in another thread , the thought of being attacked for what I am finding , keeps me holding close to my heart for it being trampled on by you and your followers , but I do not see how I have been turned against you , and who has turned me against you ?...

Should you no longer come along side of me , your sister in Christ to explain with answer to my question that I posted above , instead I feel as if you through me a side instead of helping me , that is not very brotherly , we should help each other in love and truth , but you chose to disregard me...

And @EleventhHour , could you not find in your heart to use the agree symbol or like symbol on DC post , no , you would rather use the great ribbon symbol , the medal symbol , and I believe it delights your heart , and that is sad , you also could of come a long side of me and helped by given an answer to my honest question , but you to left me wondering , your action speak for itself...
Click to expand...
And actually NO it does not delight my heart at all by any means and I am glad my ribbon was noticed that was my hope!

You are heading right into the false teachings God delivered me from... my recommendation stop listening to MacArthur, Sproul and all the others that may have been recommended to you.

Once their false teachings enter your mind, scripture becomes very skewed and yes anything presented by those of who do not

subscribe to the teachings under-girded by the tenets of Calvinism would have no value to you.

It is very hard to discern truth once you have accepted false doctrine.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#1,151
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#1,151
Chester said:
Jesus died for the sins of all people: maybe that is what you are saying here?

Forgiveness is available for everyone for sins they have committed.

Those who are in Christ Jesus have been forgiven of all past sins and are ongoingly forgiven if they do commit sin.

There is no Scripture that says that the sins that a believer commits tomorrow are already forgiven .
Click to expand...
All your sins were yet Future when Jesus died ,so that makes no sense .
 
Duskey

Duskey

Banned
#1,152
May 31, 2020
1,706
1,559
113
#1,152
Chester said:
Those who are in Christ Jesus have been forgiven of all past sins and are ongoingly forgiven if they do commit sin.

There is no Scripture that says that the sins that a believer commits tomorrow are already forgiven .
Click to expand...
Your paragraphs seem to contradict one another. What am I misreading?
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#1,153
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#1,153
Chester said:
Jesus died for the sins of all people: maybe that is what you are saying here?

Forgiveness is available for everyone for sins they have committed.

Those who are in Christ Jesus have been forgiven of all past sins and are ongoingly forgiven if they do commit sin.

There is no Scripture that says that the sins that a believer commits tomorrow are already forgiven .
Click to expand...
Col 2.14
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
 
Rosemaryx

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
#1,154
May 3, 2017
3,756
4,119
113
63
#1,154
EleventhHour said:
And actually NO it does not delight my heart at all by any means and I am glad my ribbon was noticed that was my hope!

You are heading right into the false teachings God delivered me from... my recommendation stop listening to MacArthur, Sproul and all the others that may have been recommended to you.

Once their false teachings enter your mind, scripture becomes very skewed and yes anything presented by those of who do not

subscribe to the teachings under-girded by the tenets of Calvinism would have no value to you.

It is very hard to discern truth once you have accepted false doctrine.
Click to expand...
There is a few good men who you forgot , Sinclair Ferguson , Steve Lawson , I like those to...
I know little of Calvin , learned more about the hate towards him in the Calvin thread from you and others...
These men that you have mentioned above are your brothers in Christ , no they are not 100 percent correct , and neither are you , should you be shunned because not everyone believes as you do ?

I stopped listening to you and others a while ago , not by my doing , but by the Holy Spirit showing me He does not want me having the same attitude as you have , you are cold towards others who see things you cannot see , and only the Holy Spirit can work that pebble out your heart before it turns into a stone...
 
Blue_Of_Lake

Blue_Of_Lake

Active member
#1,155
Jun 12, 2020
212
83
28
#1,155
Guojing said:
If you have no eternal life in you, are you still saved?
Click to expand...


Matthew 5
22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, ‘Raca,’ will be subject to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be subject to the fire of hell.…



1 John 2:9
If anyone claims to be in the light but hates his brother, he is still in the darkness.



1 John 2:11
But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness. He does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#1,156
#1,156
Rosemaryx said:
There is a few good men who you forgot , Sinclair Ferguson , Steve Lawson , I like those to...
I know little of Calvin , learned more about the hate towards him in the Calvin thread from you and others...
These men that you have mentioned above are your brothers in Christ , no they are not 100 percent correct , and neither are you , should you be shunned because not everyone believes as you do ?

I stopped listening to you and others a while ago , not by my doing , but by the Holy Spirit showing me He does not want me having the same attitude as you have , you are cold towards others who see things you cannot see , and only the Holy Spirit can work that pebble out your heart before it turns into a stone...
Click to expand...

Believe as you will, they are from "Reformed" circles as well.
And you have judge my heart and motives... this is typical of what happens.
 
J

Jackson123

Senior Member
#1,157
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
#1,157
Chester said:
You missed what I was saying by the statement I made: "It is not good news (to me) if I have to live a life of good works to keep proving to those around me that I was really genuinely saved at a point in time in the past."

The person who believes in "once saved always saved" and lives their life on that philosophy has to keep on doing good works to be able to keep proving to those around them that they were really genuinely saved. But that is not what I believe.
Click to expand...
Do you talking about doing good work to prove people around you that you are save.

That not the issue my friend.

The issue is not to prove to other.

The issue is If Jesus in yout heart, He Will produse fruit from you.
Fruit of love other.

Killing and raping is not the fruit of Jesus.
And Jesus say, No fruit, Cut and burn.

Burn hell

You believe killing only lose the reward but not lose salvation

Not Cut and burn

So you not agree with Jesus
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,158
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
113
#1,158
throughfaith said:
All your sins were yet Future when Jesus died ,so that makes no sense .
Click to expand...
Duskey said:
Your paragraphs seem to contradict one another. What am I misreading?
Click to expand...
When Jesus died all of my sins were yet future - quite obviously . . .

And none of those sins were forgiven before I was born - and none of them were forgiven until I put my faith in the blood atonement of Jesus Christ. Jesus' death made the provision for forgiveness and made it available.

But today the sins of mine yet in the future (and I am likely to commit sins yet in the future) are not forgiven: they are not yet, so there is nothing to forgive: that should be quite obvious. Jesus does not go about selling indulgences so that our future sins are forgiven. But when we do sin, then at that moment in time his blood cleanses us from that sin, and we are forgiven. PTL! Hallelujah!
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,159
May 23, 2016
4,314
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#1,159
throughfaith said:
Col 2.14
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Click to expand...
The "handwriting of ordinances" is the writing of the OT law that was against us and condemned us saying - "you are guilty"! But Jesus' death removed that condemnation that the law brought on the one who was not able to keep it!
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#1,160
May 23, 2016
4,314
1,442
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#1,160
Jackson123 said:
Do you talking about doing good work to prove people around you that you are save.

That not the issue my friend.

The issue is not to prove to other.

The issue is If Jesus in yout heart, He Will produse fruit from you.
Fruit of love other.

Killing and raping is not the fruit of Jesus.
And Jesus say, No fruit, Cut and burn.

Burn hell

You believe killing only lose the reward but not lose salvation

Not Cut and burn

So you not agree with Jesus
Click to expand...
Sorry, you are not getting at all what I am saying above. But that is OK. . .

I believe if a person kills and committs murder - that is sin - and unless that sin is forgiven and cleansed by the blood of Christ - then that person will go to hell. Is that clear enough that you understand?

And yes, I agree completely that the issue is if "Jesus is in your heart"! And I believe that if Jesus is in your heart that you will produce fruit. Killing and raping is not the fruit of Jesus - you are absolutely right!
 
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