By Works

David, Moses many wonderful men of god come to Mind

I've never believed my faith caused my conversion, nor have I ever believed it merited grace as some teach.

Do you believe your faith caused you to be converted?

That, and please leave off the ad hominen thing that my "Calvinism" "forces" me to do thus and so. Frankly it isn't true nor is it necessary brother.

No, I do not believe my "faith caused my conversion" - at least not in the way you seem to be asking about.
I just know that I was saved by God's grace through faith.

Very good!

That one believes is evidence of their conversion, it isn't the cause. Natural man cannot believe, he must be regenerated. 1 Corinthians 2:14. Ephesians 1:19 is also a good passage to consider.

LOL! That is how you say it --and you may - but I don't. Separating the cause and effect is not always that simple.

To make a statement like "natural man cannot believe" does give some good insights, but then you must define "natural man" and you must define "believe": and the starting points of the interpreters may be different.

Furthermore, I Cor. 2:14 and Ephesians 1:19 do not say that "natural man cannot believe, he must be regenerated". I Cor. 2:14 does not even mention "believing" and Ephesians 1:19 does not even mention the "natural man".

Well, you need to think a bit deeper because you're missing it.

We know that everyone who has been born of God does not sin (1 John 5:18 HCSB).

"Sin" in I John 5:18 is a present tense in Greek which means that the one who has been born out of God does not keep on/practice sinning. It does not say in that verse that the born again believer stops sinning.

Unless you are a KJV only who believes the exact KJV English words were inspired by God? If you are, then your text says that a born again believer does not sin - and so if someone commits one sin, then you can know they are not a Christian.

Quite frankly the baloney about “Greek present tenses” is a cop out for those who cannot get it through their heads that when they sin they are not obeying their Lord; and Christ said that those who love him keep his commandments.

Furthermore I quoted the HCSB not the KJV so I don’t know why you brought up KJV-only.

Christ expressly told two person to stop sinning (John 5:5-14; 8:10-11).

I believe what Christ said is possible; he said we would do the works he has done and greater works (John 14:12).

First of all, I didn't inspire the text and have the original writers write in koine Greek. So if you have problems with the Greek present tense you will have to take that up with the author of the Book!

Secondly: Everything else you write above I completely agree with and say AMEN to!

People use the Greek present tense as a cop out - yes, they do . . . SAD!
When we sin we are not obeying the Lord - AMEN!
Christ said those who love him keep his commandments! -- Amen!
Christ expressly told two person to stop sinning - Yes, you are clearly right!
And it is "possible" to do what Christ said - Yes, absolutely - because he has given all that is needed for godliness . .


But all the above is different than saying "a born again believer stops sinning." Theoretically it is possible to stop sinning and God has given us all of the resources to live above sin, but no Scripture says that every believer will always and completely live above sinning.

Your statement "a born again believer stops sinning" implies that every believer will always and completely live above sinning. And with that I do not agree and I do not think you will find a Scripture that says that.

So why do believers sometimes sin? because we follow our own flesh, mind, and will - but God has given us all the resources to live above sin - and He commands us to follow Him and cease sinning! Sin is despicable, makes a person miserable, and dishonors our Redeemer. Let's go forth and plan on never again sinning!

Then you do not agree with the holy scriptures:

We know that EVERYONE who has been born of God does not sin (1 John 5:18 HCSB).

Anyone who believes he is born again yet does not believe he can cease from sin need to examine themselves; wether or not they are in the faith in truth.

Well, well -- I do believe that the one who is born again can cease from sinning (through the power of the Spirit).

I already commented on I John 5:18 so I will leave that . . .

So you believe converted Christian may back to drunk and don't need to repent to go to heaven, am I correct?

I believe we all have sins and if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves, and when he live in those sins the chastening of God which leads us back works. Painful but it works, I know because I been there done that

gods demand is perfection, you do not and can not meet that requirement, so trying to make yourself better than those people is wishful thinking

I'm pretty certain @Jackson123 doesn't believe any of what you falsely accuse above, do you Jackson123?

This what I believe my brother.
Yes we aren't not perfect but it doesn't mean God willing us to keep sining and not repent.

Luke 13
6 He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none.
7 Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?
8 And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:
9 And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down.

I know a man in my town call himself Christian, but he is lazy and don't want to work, he steal from house for to house as daily income. He believe salvation by faith not by work.

Yes salvation is by faith, but real faith mean invite Jesus in our heart and Jesus in our heart will help us not steal.
I believe God want him to repent if he not repent from his habit, God may wait for another year or 5 years, if he keep stealing, like a tree that not bear fruit, will be cut or go to hell.

John 15:6
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

If we not abide in Him, we will be burn or go to hell, not only lose our reward but go to heaven, one again Jesu, not me, say will be burn.

Yes I believe we still sin but we need repent every time we sin, like David and moses, they are sin but repent.

My brother, honestly I myself still not perfect and do sin, but I fell the Holy Spirit warn me not to, every time I do sin. I believe as long as we still have a sorry felling every time we do sin, Holy Spirit still in us, and we save as long as we repent every time we sin.

To be perfect like Jesus is our target, and only happen when we abide in Him, branch can not bear fruit of itself.
Jesus want us to love other like we love ourself and Jesus give example what is biblical definition of love
After I ponder what is that love?
Die on the cross for other. Can we do that kind of love of ourselves? The answer I say no, branch can not bear fruit of itself

Only people like Stephen that willing to die to love other, to preach gospel to other so they save that do biblical definition of love.

Feed the hungry is love, but some Buddhism do feed the hunger.

Jesus sacrifice HImself on the cross, that is the quality of love Jesus talking about, and it is impossible for us to do it of ourselves ( branch can not bear fruit of itself)
It is require to abide in Him, so do salvation.

Salvation by faith, mean entrust or abide in Him.

Why God drive Adam away from the Garden

God say not to eat that fruit, Satan say eat, and he trust or have faith to Satan.

Simple mistake. Not obey

See. To me faith cause obey, if a man say have a faith but not obey, he may lie, he doesn't have a faith

If a man say love God but hate his brother, he is liar

1 John 4:20

“If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?”
Seem to me Bible teach that there is correlation between love, faith and good work
Faith without work is dead.
If a man have a Faith he have love, and love mean help the needy or good work
Not mean salvation by good work, but salvation produce good work if that man have time and ability

It may a man accept Jesus and die the next second, he have love because as soon as Jesus in his heart he have love but no time to manifest.

The fruit of Holy Spirit is love.
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How can you keep repenting, either you know it is a sin or not. This religious thinking you have to change your mind about a sin all the time is not from God, you repented when you were saved.

now confession? We should always confess of our sins, but like John said, we always have an advocate, I am not going to judge anyone who is committing any sin, as not being saved, because I have to look inside. And see my own sin (take the plank out of my eye)

we need to come side by side with our brothers and sisters. Not as their judge, that’s Gods job, but as their brother and sister, helping each other in love.
that’s why we all should be in some sort of discipleship relationship with someone in our church,

The above shows precisely why your gospel understanding is both truncated and errant. His repenting lifestyle "is not from God?" What!? The Christian walk is a LIFESTYLE of repentance!

Goodness sake no wonder you don't get it, the above shows exactly why.

Amen! 1 John 5:18 (AMPC) - We know [absolutely] that anyone born of God does not [deliberately and knowingly] practice committing sin, but the One Who was begotten of God carefully watches over and protects him [Christ’s divine presence within him preserves him against the evil], and the wicked one does not lay hold (get a grip) on him or touch [him].

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. (1 John 1:8-10)