Not By Works

We know our brothers and sisters....

These individuals who come here hiding behind many screen names, acting in spite, holding grudges, breaking forum rules, mocking Gods children and the negative emotes they pass out hold no weight.

I'm not afraid of these angry faces or disagreements.

God knows what's what and so do my family in Christ.


Praise God for giving us eyes to see.


We are saved by grace through faith and not of works...

😏

Haters gonna hate.

? ? ? . . . . . must be than rude teenager with the angry faces.

I still think management should make a new rule, that you cannot use the reaction such as , until you have been a member in good standing for 6 months.

I agree....limited responses based upon time on site.......

@UnderGrace @posthuman @dcontroversal @VCO

Thanks guys for answering my question. I pretty much was thinking what you guys responded...so it's cool. I'm glad we're on the same page. Let that not hesitate you from spreading the truth!

If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me.
Luke 9:23

Following Jesus is about obeying Him and doing what He did.

Those who desire to claim obeying Jesus is trying to be righteous, miss the point, it is righteous
to obey Jesus and do as He commanded because this is the way of life.

And we do not "obey" because we must, we obey because this is life.
Now anyone who would claim I am following something else other than Jesus by obeying Him,
I will not repeat.

What is of no surprise is how those hypocrite hunters, condemners and mockers, who want to find
fault rather than follow Jesus, always bring focus on the wrong issues.

Jesus is the way to life, and if you do not follow you do not have life.

There is a sad reality here. Whatever you wish to call me is fine by my except when I am
repeating a post which implies I am not following Jesus, I will not agree with this.

I wonder how much you love the deepest thing in your heart? Would you deny the Honour, debt
and gratitude towards that person that is due?

I thank Jesus for all He has done in my life.
For anyone to mock such a thing, to suggest somehow Jesus is not worthy of being followed or
His eternal words should be listened to and obeyed does not love Him or know Him.

When I understand who I am speaking to and why, I can forgive, because I know this lostness and
unbelief, though I did not expect it, its hardness and harm are obvious.

I am stunned by how God works. It is not through confrontation but through quietly showing His
love and declaring things we all care about, and how to find resolution through repentance, and love.

So my friend, God bless you, however you wish to cause me harm, I forgive you, though I can never
quite understand the place where you live.

Why should someone not follow Jesus?

Our hearts are changed, we are cleansed, forgiven, transformed, made mature in Him,
flowing from our hearts in love and grace from Christ and His word dwelling within and
full of the Holy Spirit.

So this person, who has this reality, would they not follow Jesus and do what He does?

Jesus's way is a reflection of life realities of who He is, and what life in Him is like.

We live in a anti-hero world, where ripping into people is reality, where aspirations are jokes,
and self harm and depression and anxiety are a way of life.

But if we have a hero Jesus, we know the reality of repentance, the indwelling of the Holy Spirit,
victory over our sin struggles and addictions, have humbleness over our position and achievements,
why would we find Jesus's ways hard, are they not the outflow of what is within.

So my question to you as a reader of this forum, is why are you not following Jesus and listening
to Him? And if you are, greetings brother and sister in Christ, Amen, Praise the Lord.

Are you really sensitive to an angry face?
Do you need the feedback of men more than that of God?

The words spoken declare much more harm than an angry face,
yet obviously an angry face icon seems to have much more impact.

Funnily I do not feel angry at the expressions being given but profound
sadness at eternal realities being dismissed like gone off piece of meat.

People do the most evil deeds, but yet Gods love goes there also and
shines like a light in the darkness. It is not as if the people themselves do
not detest what they have become, but in their lostness they see no other way
out, until God shows His forgiveness and purity and calls sinners to learn the
walk of righteousness and the Kingdom of heaven.

the people living in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death a light has dawned.
Matt 4:16

It is such a privilege to speak the word of God, Halleluyah that He chooses such as
us to speak His words through, thank you Jesus, that you take the forgotten and rejected
to shame the wise and powerful, Amen.

Not sure why you keep accusing dcon of lying to the Holy Spirit, but the Lord does not forsake His saints/they are preserved forever (Psalm 37:28); ..preserved in Jesus Christ (Jude 1:1); ..give them eternal life/never perish/no one can snatch them from My hand (John 10:27-29); ..and whom He justified, these He also glorified (Romans 8:30); sealed with the Holy Spirit/who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession/unto the day of redemption (Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30) etc.. is not a man made doctrine. *NOWHERE does the Bible specifically say "lose or lost salvation." Works-salvationists in general who attend various false religions and cults, including Roman Catholicism, Mormonism, Campbellism, Seventh Day Adventism etc.. ALL unanimously teach that a genuine born again Christian can "lose their salvation," which has always been a red flag for me.

Don't forget there are 3 tenses to salvation that often get mixed up by works-salvationisints. 1. We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification) 2. We are being saved from the POWER of sin (ongoing sanctification) 3. We will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (final sanctification or glorification) Waiting for Jesus is descriptive of genuine believers. Believers are initially sanctified/set apart in which we are made holy in standing before God positionally in Christ. 1 Corinthians 6:11 - Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. Yet in regards to practical, progressive holiness in which the reality of that holiness becomes more and more evident in our actions, words, thoughts, attitudes, and motives is the process of ongoing sanctification. Our hears are purified by faith. (Acts 15:9) In Hebrews 10:10, we read - "..sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and in verse 14, we read, "perfected for all time those who are sanctified."

There is nothing wrong with Hebrews 9:26-28. Unbelievers will be judged and condemned and some (like the scribes and Pharisees who Jesus is addressing in Matthew 23:14) will receive greater condemnation. For believers, we will be judged (not to be condemned - John 3:18) but our works will be judged to determine rewards and loss of rewards (1 Corinthians 3:11-15). So once again, waiting for Him is descriptive of genuine believers. You must not confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture.

once again, how can you claim to follow Jesus when you refuse to properly define sin??

this is like saying you obey traffic laws but you do not know what they are.....

27 The jailer woke up, and when he saw the prison doors open, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself because he thought the prisoners had escaped.
28 But Paul shouted, "Don't harm yourself! We are all here!"
29 The jailer called for lights, rushed in and fell trembling before Paul and Silas.
30 He then brought them out and asked, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
31 They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved--you and your household."
32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all the others in his house.
Acts 16:27-32

2 "'Or if a person touches anything ceremonially unclean-whether the carcasses of unclean wild animals or of unclean livestock or of unclean creatures that move along the ground-even though he is unaware of it, he has become unclean and is guilty.
3 "'Or if he touches human uncleanness-anything that would make him unclean-even though he is unaware of it, when he learns of it he will be guilty.
4 "'Or if a person thoughtlessly takes an oath to do anything, whether good or evil-in any matter one might carelessly swear about-even though he is unaware of it, in any case when he learns of it he will be guilty.
Leviticus 5:2-4

Sin is the issue ie failure before the King and resolution through Jesus.
When looking at defining what it means to be unclean, God declared guilt for things
whether you were unaware or not, and other things only when you became aware.

Learning, understanding, dwelling and conviction are all part of having a clean conscience.
God defines sin, not man. And He is very gracious as we grow to show us levels and issues
we need to deal with. If we fully saw our sin or issues, we would give up before we began.

God spoke words to humans. humans wrote them down. they words have meanings. we need to recognize what these words means.

you refuse to do this. until you do, all your claims about following Jesus, walking as he walked , are hollow and empty.

Wow, I never thought of this. Absolutely a great idea. It would be nice actually see this be considered by the moderators.

If you don't mind me saying something here:

I remember this portion of a debate on a movie I watched:

Atheist: Wasn't the Bible written by man?

Christian: Yes it was!

Atheist: Then how is it the word of God?

Unfortunately, the person being asked this wasn't able to answer that. But, we all know the Holy Spirit breathed upon the word in which the men wrote. It was all ordained by God.

My answer would have been John 1:1 ---- > In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

I know this maybe out of topic, but in the Bible (i think somewhere in Romans...correct me if I'm wrong.... ) it says we'll be judged according to our works. But, we're not saved by works/deeds, right? Why are we then judged according to our works?

Just want to see some different answers on this because it does confuse me.
Thank you for helping "little one" out

I have begun to look at this question which might help.
What is the difference between intention and action?

It is the action that takes place that demonstrates the intention.

We get so involved in our intentions and what we will do or not do, which are often
pipe dreams or dealing with frustration. When it comes to actually doing it, it is much
more difficult than we thought and we often bottle, and do not do it.

God judges His people by what they do. So the emphasis is on confession, in song, word,
praise and actions like good works, service, helping. You need the right foundation and
the proof that things are real, shown in the action. It is like the action proves or shows the
foundation.

Go a little deeper. Gods work in us is His word becoming a plant in our hearts that produces
new words that are spread to others. But words come and go, and a plant is not substantial,
we are this sea of facts and feeling blowing about. But Jesus sees us as growing into something
that is strong, eternal, unmoved and rooted in Him. This can only happen when we personally
know this reality in our hearts. Amen

Hi gb9,

I recognise what God means. You seem to believe I am failing to accept Gods meaning.
Please show me the verses you are referring to. I suspect you are talking theology and ideas
derived from scripture, which is a poor foundation until you explain it.

I have quoted God and His intention

1 cor 3

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;


13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.


14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.


15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.


Remember, a reward is not a gift.

Are you talking about God will "render to every man according to his works" in Romans 2:6? If one reads Romans 2:6-10 in isolation from the rest of the book of Romans, one might conclude that Paul was teaching salvation by works. However, we need to keep in mind that these verses do not describe how one becomes saved, but the way the saved (and unsaved) conduct their lives. These works done are the result of, not the basis or means by which one becomes saved.

So patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (vs. 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life, but as a description of those to whom God does render life eternal. *Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. *Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (vs. 9).

What those passages of scripture convey is that though our deeds are judged by God, it's not the good deeds themselves which are the basis or means of receiving salvation, but the type of deeds expose whether our heart was saved, or not. These deeds done out of faith are the fruit, not the root of salvation. If Paul wanted to teach that we are saved by works, then he would have clearly stated that we are saved through faith and works in Ephesians 2:8,9 and that we are justified by faith and works in Romans 5:1 but that is clearly NOT what Paul said. *Also see (Romans 4:2-6; Philippians 3:9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9 etc..).