No Eternal Security = No Salvation?

Wow, that's what I call multi-tasking!

Here's my other self:

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Chester, this is a bit of a deceptive post. You omitted the line that makes the post a strawman you tear down.

"That you don't know the answer to the question shows ignorance of what Scripture says about salvation:"

So after saying that, you proceed to build the strawman that somehow my faith is in the doctrine of OSAS rather than Jesus Christ.

Remember, in the OP, the question was mainly intended for those that believe in Eternal Security. OBVIOUSLY those that don't, already fully have their mind made up that they are saved. At least for the moment. Not that you or anybody else can'y chime in, but I wanted to know what eternal security people thought.

I also said at one time I thought you COULD lose Salvation, and now believe EVEN at that time I was saved. BECAUSE, looking back, Jesus NEVER left me!

Good OP, and never saw it until today (as far as I recall anyhow).

It all comes down to the monergistic and synergistic understanding of salvation. The former teaches that it is God alone who saves, the latter teaches that it is a cooperative effort between man and God.

Monergism: Who saved me? God and he alone. Who keeps me saved? God and he alone.

Synergism: Who saved me? God with my cooperation. Who keeps me saved? God, with my cooperation.

One is a false gospel. However, I believe there are many who are converted but are just ignorant of the basics of soteriology, and really do not understand the Gospel very well or as they should.

A person(s) cannot understand the Gospel truly if said person(s) thinks they took part in their salvation.

For instance, there are many here who believe God chose them because they did some good deed, made a proper decision, had love for God while spiritually dead, sought God and found him while spiritually dead, among other unbiblical beliefs. Cornelius in Acts 10 is used as their proof, and they also deny being part of those mentioned in Romans 3:10ff.

None of those passages have a thing to do with staying saved.

DD teaches the above?

Irresistible grace doctrine is about the elect not the non-elect. IOW it doesn't teach the non-elect cannot resist God's grace.

Alright, I will bow out and leave you to continue your conversation with others. You obviously did not understand what I was saying, so we can just leave it go . . .

Ok. But please don't go away mad. I actually fall pretty much in line with your statement that there are some eternal security people unsaved and some non osas that are saved. I just think the non osas saved don't realize yet that they ARE eternally secure.

As I stated in the most recent OSAS thread, I believe in a form of OSAS, but I also believe there are possible conditions to it.

1. Christ taught us the Lord's Prayer:
Within this prayer, He states if we do not forgive those who have sinned against us, the Father would not forgive us from our own sins.

Ironically, some OSAS'ers believe you can sin without seeking forgiveness and still be saved.
So that leads to this question: If one of those OSAS'ers who believe you can sin without seeking forgiveness...what if they refuse to forgive those who sinned against them? Christ is clear they won't be forgiven of their own sins. So, if the sin OSAS'ers are committing is not forgiving others, how can their salvation be guaranteed since Christ specifically states their sins WON'T BE FORGIVEN?


2. It seems illogical, but we do have FREE WILL. And within that FREE WILL, we could choose to walk away from God. And since the scriptures are clear that God does not interfere with our FREE WILL, I believe God would have to deny them for their choices to leave Him!!


3. And even though Christ's shed Blood covers ALL SIN (but blasphemy), most OSAS'ers refer back to the moment you were saved to claim ALL SINS including your FUTURE SINS are 100% covered guaranteed. This is hard to buy since I was saved at 10 years old. I am now on the verge of becoming 50, and I can promise you that the sins I committed at 10 were extremely minor compared to the sins I have committed since growing older. And at 10, I had no knowledge of the sins one could commit when older. Therefore, my conversion and forgiveness I believe was based upon the sins I knew of at 10 and confessed to. Not about sins I would commit 40 years later!!

To me, it only seems logical to have needed to seek forgiveness for the sins I committed later on in life, since at 10 I was unaware of them!!

Interesting how you pick and choose scripture for your own purpose. Those scriptures Splagna provided are specific compared to the scriptures you have tossed around. Your scriptures can be interpreted several ways, but the scriptures Splagna provided are as clear as water!!

You literally talk in circles!!

One would think after reading your posts that you have circular logic

AMEN!!

It all sounds like the foundation of the new SEEKER FRIENDLY CHURCHES!!

All a bunch of baloney!!

I like how you skipped passed verse 21:

21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

This states for us to actually do something!! Where is the GRACE in this verse? This is a COMMAND!!

Not hardly pal.......and my quoted post is correct......maybe actually study the word and open your eyes to the truth.......here one ore time...read SLOOOOWWWWWW so you can grasp it.....


dcontroversal said:
Exactly....CALLED CHASTISMENT for SONS and Daughters that walk contrary....NOT the loss of salvation! A son by birth will always be a son by birth...It is the spirit that is born from above by INCORRUPTABLE SEED and the GIFTS OF GOD ARE IRREVOCABLE!

Interesting how YOU fail to actually quote the verses I stated and then try to make me look bad by only posting one side of the reply....10 to 1 you are a Democrat........same kind of rigmarole they do.....

Your titles you have attached to how someone thinks is not even biblical, it's a man made title and you use it like you have a clue. This OSAS is nothing but a SEEKER FRIENDLY church catch phrase. It's not even a biblical term itself. I amazed at your terminology that you attach to anything you disagree with that is not even found within the scriptures. You actually don't even have a clue since you use titles SOMEONE ELSE obviously made up for you

I have questioned several of your posts concerning your opinion of the OSAS you believe is scriptural. I don't need to quote scripture since I have a posting history with you. And no one here can make you look like anything but yourself. I voted for Reagan, Bush 1, Dole (lost to Clinton), Bush 2, Romney and McCain (both lost to Obama), and Trump... hmmmmm, now which one of those candidates were Demoncrats oh genius one?

Look at the verse.

Work out YOUR SALVATION.

Salvation is something they had. It is not something they were trying to earn or work for.

In the greek, the word work out was a mining term, It was used of moners who were mining for things that had great value, the gems and metals were already their, they were not working to make them, they were working to make them usefull.

Paul is telling us, Take our salvation, and work it out so it is not hidden inside, but actually made useful to the world..

Paul always feared he woudl not do enough to help people, or do something which would have caused him his testimony to be shattered to the point he was no longer trusted.

Thats exactly how is is telling us to be. To fear lest we burn out our light, because people are watching.

You mean like the 1 John scripture you keep saying can be interpreted different ways although John is quite specifit.

You not one to judge when you do that very thing my friend.