Not By Works

So what glory is Jesus giving us then in John 17?

I desire growth, any advice on growth?

Go beyond just reading and study the word diligently and apply the truths found therein....

Hi benher,
There are three types of sanctifications; 1) Positional Sanctification, the moment we are born again, Justified and set apart for the gospel; 2) Practical Sanctification, the practice of our daily walk with Jesus which continues on throughout our earthly life and, 3} Ultimate sanctification; when we stand before Jesus in heaven.

These were taught to me in adult Sunday School 40yrs ago, not my ideas.

Quote:
"I have to be honest TT but you seem to question a lot of what you think I'm saying and I have no idea why."

Hi BillG, I am still a bit shocked by your response to a post that I made but I will accept your criticism and be more careful responding to you from now on, please excuse me.

God bless

Both....one describes our standing in Christ as saved (set apart in Christ eternally) and is spoken of in Hebrews, the other is applicable unto our daily walk and how we are transformed (described in Romans 12) on the outside because of the inward change that is growing and maturing in Christ dia the word of God....

Use me for an example.....

Before salvation when I seen a smokin hot girl I would envision all sorts of things......now after salvation and any years of growth and maturity when I see a hot girl, I might think in my mind she is really pretty, but I take the thought process no further....

Also....I was doing all sorts of drugs after the Marine Corp when I went wild for a time, drugs such as coke, crystal methaphetamine, pills etc.....after salvation and growth and maturity I quit it all because I changed outwardly due to the inward change which was fed a steady diet of the word of God....

Love ya bro.

Okay I see what you are saying now. I always thought of Christ's "High Priestly Prayer", as meaning believers are at one with our Savior, not having the same glory as Christ, point taken very well. I will study more about this subject.

John17
22I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one— 23I in them and you in me—so that they may be brought to complete unity. Then the world will know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me.

So now you have a chance to make things right.


Does a person have to obey the Gospel to be saved?

1. Yes a person must obey the Gospel to be saved.
2. No a person does not need to obey the Gospel to be saved.

Be truthful!



JPT

I believe 100 percent in "Monergism" as opposed to Synergism", from being born again from above to my going home to be with our Heavenly Father. Everything that has happened to my Christian life including my "Justification and the imputed righteousness of Christ and being sealed by the Holy Spirit who is our guarantor of our inheritance, is of God and none of myself.

Everything has been 100 percent of God's grace and mercy in my life and zero percent of my doing anything.

Monergism is the view within Christian theology which holds that God works through the Holy Spirit to bring about the salvation of an individual through spiritual regeneration, regardless of the individual's cooperation.

"Not By Works

I have told you this before, BOTH OF YOUR QUESTION, because your approach your line of 2 questions with a PRESUPPOSITION that rules out the truth.

IT IS NOT A QUESTION to formulate WHO IS SAVED AND WHO IS NOT. IT IS A FREE GIFT OF GOD. Obedience HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SALVATION, it is PART OF OUR LOVE, that GOD HIMSELF PUT IN US, so that we can LOVE HIM AND OUR BRETHREN. LOVING HIM HAPPENS AFTER SALVATION.

In fact, TWO ERRORS NEVER DID MAKE A RIGHT, - - - IT IS JUST DOUBLY WRONG.

he Gospel is Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.

This is God’s loving invitation to be transferred into the kingdom of His dear Son. The kingdom of God.

It is also a command that must be obeyed, in which God’s Spirit is available during the preaching of those sent to announce the Gospel, to empower the lost unto salvation.

The Spirit empowers those who are sent with the word of truth, the Gospel of our salvation, in which those who obey through the Spirit, are born again and cleansed from their past sins.


Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


JPT

7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.
1 John 3:7


JPT

I ASKED YOU BEFORE WHAT IS DEFINITION OF THE GOSPEL, is it your #1 ? ? ?

My question was not, WHO IS SAVED AND WHO IS NOT.

Here is my question, which comes from this scripture -

3 We are bound to thank God always for you, brethren, as it is fitting, because your faith grows exceedingly, and the love of every one of you all abounds toward each other, 4 so that we ourselves boast of you among the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and [a]tribulations that you endure, 5 which is manifest evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you also suffer; 6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Thessalonians 1:3-8

• in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Does a person have to obey the Gospel to be saved?

1. Yes a person must obey the Gospel to be saved.
2. No a person does not need to obey the Gospel to be saved.

JPT

The Gospel is: Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.


This is God’s loving invitation to be transferred, out of the domain of darkness into the kingdom of His dear Son. The kingdom of God.


It is also a command that must be obeyed, in which God’s Spirit is available during the preaching of those sent to announce the Gospel, to empower the lost unto salvation.

The Spirit empowers those who are sent with the word of truth, the Gospel of our salvation, in which those who obey through the Spirit, are born again and cleansed from their past sins.


Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


Would you like me to explain this process more?


Maybe I could explain what repent means?




JPT

Hi benher, thank you for pointing this out to me, "we are joint heirs with Christ.",

Romans8:17
"Now if we are children, then we are heirs--heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

YOU STILL GOT IT WRONG, it is NOT part of SALVATION, IT IS PART OF OUR LOVE.


Deuteronomy 13:3 (HCSB)
3 do not listen to that prophet’s words or to that dreamer.
For the LORD your God is testing you to know whether you love
the LORD your God with all your heart and all your soul.


I seldom quote the Apocrypha, but somehow this seems appropriate:


Sirach 2:15-17 (NRSV)
15 Those who fear the Lord do not disobey his words, and those who love him keep his ways.
16 Those who fear the Lord seek to please him, and those who love him are filled with his law.
17 Those who fear the Lord prepare their hearts, and humble themselves before him.


IT IS NOT PART OF SALVATION!


1 John 4:19 (HCSB)
19 We love because He first loved us.


John 14:23-24 (NRSV)
23 Jesus answered him, "Those who love me will keep my word, and my Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.
24 Whoever does not love me does not keep my words; and the word that you hear is not mine, but is from the Father who sent me.


IT IS PART OF OUR LOVE!

Why are you so ANXIOUS to Rob GOD of the GLORY FOR YOUR FREE GIFT OF SALVATION? DO YOU WANT TO PAT YOURSELF ON THE BACK, or do you want to give all the glory to JESUS who bought and paid for your entire salvation?


1 Corinthians 6:19-20 (NASB)
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?
20 For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.


LOVE HAPPENS after the FREE GIFT IS APPLIED TO YOUR HEART, which is SALVATION. Then and only then, will you be able to LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD, with the same kind of LOVE that HE HAS SOWN INTO YOUR HEART.


Romans 5:5 (HCSB)
5 This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

Are you saying that man doesn't have the choice to believe or reject the Gospel. Are you saying that God chooses to cause some to believe and leave others in unbelief.
Do you believe in predestination and election or do you believe man chooses to believe or not to believe. There are good Biblical arguments to support either of these views, I would like to know what your view is and why. Thank you

You got more of it right than I thought you would. HOWEVER, the sentence in red is NOT SALVATION, it is talking about SANCTIFICATION, that ALWAYS COMES AFTER SALVATION. Perhaps I have discovered the FLAW in your theology. You think Salvation and Sanctification are the SAME THING, do you not? They are totally different terms, and happen at different times in the Believers Life. SALVATION is applied to our HEART, the moment the Holy Spirit births our Human Spirit into Eternal Life. Sanctification is a lifelong struggle of becoming more and more like CHRIST Himself.

Just so you know, that your first part of your post was very good, here is the definition of GOSPEL from Wikipedia:

"Gospel is the Old English translation of Greek, meaning "good news". . . . was used at the time of the Roman Empire to herald the good news of the arrival of a kingdom . . . The word "gospel" actually refers to the news of the kingdom, the message itself, . . ."


The GOT QUESTIONS Ministry puts it this way:

"Answer: The word gospel means “good news,” so the gospel of Christ is the good news of His coming to provide forgiveness of sins for all who will believe (Colossians 1:14; Romans 10:9). . . .

The gospel of Jesus Christ is the good news that God provided the way for man to be freed from the penalty of sin (John 14:6; Romans 6:23). But not all people will be saved from hell; only those who place their faith in Jesus will go to heaven when they die (Acts 4:12).

The gospel of Jesus Christ is the best news anyone will ever hear, and what a person does with this news will determine where he or she spends eternity. God is calling you to choose life. Call on the name of the Lord and be saved (Romans 10:13)."