Science Disproves Evolution

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Phillipy

Guest
5. There must be an eternal power beyond the universe that caused the universe to come into existence.
6. Intelligent life exists in the universe.
7. It takes an intelligent living being to create an intelligent living being.
How could a material, inanimate, unintelligent, unconscious force produce on intelligent living, breathing being?
8. Therefore there must be an intelligent, living, eternal power, beyond the universe, that created the universe.
Aside from the fact that you couldn't possibly demonstrate 7, you only appeal to an argument from ignorance, you also made a serious logical flaw, a non-sequitur, in saying that "the creator of life on Earth had to be an intelligence, therefore the cause of the universe was intelligent".
Even hypothetically granting premise 7, you forget the option that maybe the universe had a natural, non-intelligent cause but life on Earth was created by an intelligence.
 
G

Grey

Guest
A Logical Argument for God's Existence

1. Something exists.

That seems pretty simple, right? Can we all agree that this is true? Even the atheist will agree that this is true. This seems to be undeniably true. Anybody who would say that “nothing exists” would have to exist in order to say that in which case he would be defeating his own statement.

2. Nothing does not produce something.

This statement is of course true as well. Think about it. It would be absurd to say that nothing could create or produce something.

Nothing is no-thing. Nothing does not have the power to do anything at all, does it! Even David Hume one of the most zealous skeptics of Christianity ever agreed to the truth of this second premise. He said, “I never asserted so absurd a proposition as that anything might arise without a cause.” (Feb. 1754).

To propose that nothing could do anything at all sounds utterly foolish. A basic law of physics (and if you ever had a physics class you’ll recall this) is called the Law of Conservation. It states: “From nothing, comes nothing.”

This supports our second premise as well. So if the first two premises are true, that 1. Something exists and 2. Nothing does not produce something, then a rather astounding conclusion logically follows...

3. Something must have always existed.

Why’s that? Okay, well, let’s walk back through this. Something now exists. Nothing does not produce something, then something must have always existed.

Why must something have always existed? To have brought the “something” that now exists (in No.1) into existence. Why? Because premise number two is true (Nothing does not produce something). But the critic asks, “Why does that something have to be eternal? Aren’t you just assuming the eternality of that something that brought into existence the something that now exists (no.1)?"

Not at all. Stay with me on this. There is a reason why that something (no. 3) must be eternal. To say that that something (in premise no. 3) did not always exist would be to say that it was finite. Right?

If that something (in premise no. 3) was finite, that means it had a beginning. If that something had a beginning we are back at our start. How did that something (premise no. 3) begin? Did nothing create something? No, that’s impossible. Nothing can’t do anything.

Anything that begins to exist must have a cause. If we deny this we are saying that nothing produced something from nothing and by nothing. But this is absurd. So we are left with the only other option and that is that something in no. 3 must have always existed.

Do you understand why premise 3 must be true?
Now, there are only two options as to what that “something (No.3) [that] always existed” might be:

A. The universe, or
B. Something outside the universe

The fourth premise in my argument is this:

4. The universe has not always existed.

In 1948, a theory known as The Steady State Theory, was set forth, that proposed that the universe was eternal (William Lane Craig, Reasonable Faith, p. 102). It stated that the universe has always been. “If this theory is correct” the critics of Christianity said, “there is no need for a Creator.” Well, the theory sounded good on paper for the atheist, for a while but the scientific evidence against it has since demolished the theory.

Numerous evidences from the field of astronomy now overwhelmingly point to the fact that the universe actually began to exist a finite time ago in an event when all the physical space, time, matter, and energy in the universe came into being.

And that is exactly what the Bible affirms, that the universe had a beginning. “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth” (Gen. 1:1).

Let me share with you just 2 facts of science that deal a fatal deathblow to the theory of an eternal universe. The first blow to this theory that universe is eternal is…

A. THE MOTION OF THE GALAXIES

Prior to the 1920’s, scientists had always assumed that the universe as a whole was stationary. [Of course they acknowledged that there was movement of planets in solar systems, etc.]

But in 1929 an alarming thing happened. An astronomer named Edwin Hubble discovered that the light from distant galaxies appeared to be redder than it should. The startling conclusion to which Hubble was led was that the light is redder because the universe is growing apart; it is expanding! When the source of incoming light is moving away from an object the light that you see is shifted toward the red end of the spectrum. The light of the galaxies was redder because they are moving away from us. But here is the interesting part: Hubble not only showed that the universe is expanding, but that it is expanding the same in all directions. Scientists have concluded that the galaxies in the universe are not stationary but are expanding further and further away from each other from what appears to be some stationary point.

Imagine that I were to draw a bunch of dots on a balloon that represented galaxies and then blow up the balloon. If you were to suck the air back out, or let’s say rewind the film, go back in time—what would happen? The dots would converge, i.e. get closer to one another. The same is true with our universe. If you go back in time scientists say that the stars would converge into a singular space, where they exploded into being:

This explosion or beginning of the universe is often referred to as, you know the name:

“THE BIG BANG." We call it Genesis 1:1!! It’s incredible that the scientific evidence that helps establish Big Bang theory also helps verify what the Christian theist has always believed: That the universe actually had a beginning!!

Genesis 1:1 “In the beginning, God created the heavens..."

A second blow to the theory that the universe is eternal comes from the facts behind...

B. THE SECOND LAW OF THERMODYNAMICS

[The first law says that the actual amount of energy in the universe remains constant—it doesn’t change.]
The Second Law of Thermodynamics is one of the best, most established laws in all of science. In fact, there is no recorded experiment in the history of science that contradicts it. It states that: the amount of useable energy in any closed system (which the universe is) is decreasing. In other words, the useable energy in the universe is dying out like the batteries in a flashlight.

Scientists acknowledge that the sun can not burn forever, and that even our galaxy itself will one day, if left to itself, burn up and die out. So we reason that if the Second Law of Thermodynamics is true for all closed systems, and it is, then it is true for the universe as a whole. The universe according to the atheist is a gigantic closed system, since to them it is all there is and there is nothing outside it. This means that the universe is currently running out of useable energy.

If it is running out of useable energy, then it cannot be eternal, for a finite amount of energy (no matter how large the quantity.) could never have brought the universe through an eternity of time.

Flashlight Illustration: Let's say you stumbled upon this flashlight and you’re curious how long it has been burning. So you do a little investigation. Through your investigation you discover that the batteries are going down hill. They are running out of energy. You turn to a scientist standing nearby and ask him: “How long do you think the flashlight’s been burning?” Now, what if he was to tell you: “It’s always been on. It’s been lit like this and burning like this forever.”

Hunh? Would you believe that? Of course not. There’s a problem with that isn’t there?

Batteries with a finite amount of energy (seen in the fact that they are steadily running out of energy) could never have kept the light burning for an eternal amount of time. It would have run out of batteries trillions of years ago!! So it is with the universe. The amount of useable energy is steadily decreasing, thus proving it impossible that it has been burning for all eternity. So, it is scientific discoveries like…

1. The Motion of the Galaxies
2. The Second Law of Thermodynamics (and other discoveries like the background radiation echo discovered by Penzias and Wilson) ...that have blown the Steady State Theory into smithereens.

Now, if my premises are all true:
1. Something exists.
2. Nothing does not produce something.
3. Something must have always existed.
4. The universe has not always existed
...then a conclusion can be validly drawn from these premises.

5. There must be an eternal power beyond the universe that caused the universe to come into existence.

Do you think this is a sound argument thus far? I believe it is! The whole argument could come crashing down, if even just one of the premises could be proven to be false. Causing the argument to crash wouldn’t prove that God doesn’t exist, it would just prove that the argument is not valid. Let’s take it a bit further.

6. Intelligent life exists in the universe.

I take that to be self-evident. This also seems to be undeniable. Anybody who would say that there is not intelligent life in the universe would be uttering an intelligent statement from an intelligent being.

To understand any of this study this far (even if you disagreed with what I was saying) would prove that this sixth premise is true...for it has taken a great degree of intelligence to understand the thousands of combinations of syllables that I have been uttering.

So this premise is undeniably true as well.
Let’s take it further.

7. It takes an intelligent living being to create an intelligent living being.

How could a material, inanimate, unintelligent, unconscious force produce on intelligent living, breathing being? It takes a living, intelligent being to create a living, intelligent being. Non-life does not produce life. You could leave the barren side of a mountain exposed to...

--wind
--rain
--the forces of nature
--chance
--and millions of years of time and you would never get a Mount Rushmore, let alone a living, breathing human being. Why? It takes intelligence. You need intelligent intervention.

It would take great intelligence to create a robot that operates like a human, and even more so, it takes intelligence to create a real human being.

8. Therefore there must be an intelligent, living, eternal power, beyond the universe, that created the universe.

That intelligent, living, eternal power, beyond the universe that created the universe is God.

If the universe has not always existed, and something must have always existed, then something or someone outside of the universe must have always existed, I propose to you that that person is an intelligent, living, powerful being, i.e. God.

CONCLUSION

For me it is more reasonable to believe, based on the laws of logic as well as the observable scientific evidence that God exists, rather than to believe what the atheist believes that nothing, times nobody, equals everything we see in the universe.

Throw in the fact that we also have the testimony of our conscience and the revelation of God in the scriptures and I believe we are standing on solid ground when we affirm:

“In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” (Genesis 1:1)

[Charlie H. Campbell adopted major premises from a debate heard on the existence of God by Norman Geisler]

A Logical Argument For God's Existence

Many of these are assumptions

1. What do you mean by "something"? If you mean, through our limited modes of observation we assume the world around us is likely in existence then yes. Is this evidence for your god? No.

2. This is the paradox of faith and non-faith in my opinion. I'm not an adherent to string theory. Both sides say, if something must be created from something were did god/the universe come from. We can spin in circles on that or go with what seems more feasible along the line. Is this evidence for a god? No.

3. On what evidence do you base your assumption that EVERYTHING must have some sort of creator? This goes back to question 2, and the paradox.

4. What backs your assumption that because the universe likely expanded from a single point it must have a creator? What is the overwhelming scientific evidence that there is a creator?

Creatonists love the second law of thermodynamics, but it only applies to a closed system. Not everything.

5. Just a straight up unbacked assumption.

6. How do you define intelligent?

7. Abiogenesis theory. If you are asserting that an intelligent "living" being is necessary to create other living beings, and god is that living being, then god was born and will also die, as all living things have a point of origin and death.

8 another un-backed assumption.

Conclusion: theoretically lets say there is some sort of supernatural power, now all you have to do is chose from the thousands of religions which are quite similar in some cases each having their own equally "likely" creation stories, good luck picking the right one out. What religion you are is a result of what family you are born into.
 
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MatthewMichael

Guest
Very good post... tons of interesting facts. Thank you Pahu. My take on evolution:
Evolution of one kind of creature into another is silly. It is a bunch of guesses and assumptions that only someone with an agenda of disproving God would entertain. Period. Natural selection is obvious. If you are weak, you die; if you are strong, you live, etc, like the giraffe neck thing, but animals changing into different animals is a joke... As for evolution from a common ancestor... Yea.. His name is God. Doi. not a tadpole. not primordial sludge. not a big bang.

The creation of Earth is a historical question, and the Bible is the most accurate historical document that exists.

Romans 1:20

[SUP]20 [/SUP]For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse...

 
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didymos

Guest
So, I am supposed to trust what you say about your own opinions? Are you really going to stick with that line of reasoning? Keep in mind I have already stated that some Buddhists incorporate other beliefs into their buddhism. So you have not proved your point nor have you proved mine wrong.
What you presented as FACTS were just those two internet articles, it's your choice to base YOUR opinion on that. My comment that not SOME buddhists incorporate other beliefs into their faith, but MOST of them is based on an extensive study of the different kinds of buddhism. You can do with THAT opinion as you will.
 
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Grey

Guest
Very good post... tons of interesting facts. Thank you Pahu. My take on evolution:
Evolution of one kind of creature into another is silly. It is a bunch of guesses and assumptions that only someone with an agenda of disproving God would entertain. Period. Natural selection is obvious. If you are weak, you die; if you are strong, you live, etc, like the giraffe neck thing, but animals changing into different animals is a joke... As for evolution from a common ancestor... Yea.. His name is God. Doi. not a tadpole. not primordial sludge. not a big bang.

The creation of Earth is a historical question, and the Bible is the most accurate historical document that exists.

Romans 1:20

[SUP]20 [/SUP]For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse...

Evolution is observed and provable.
 
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prodigal

Guest
we can say anything is proved if we're not willing to look at the facts. Some go on anothers say so, some like to see the evidence for themselves
 

Pahu

Senior Member
Jul 5, 2011
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Conclusion: theoretically lets say there is some sort of supernatural power, now all you have to do is chose from the thousands of religions which are quite similar in some cases each having their own equally "likely" creation stories, good luck picking the right one out. What religion you are is a result of what family you are born into.
Bible Accuracy



1. Archaeology has confirmed the historical accuracy of the Bible:

The Rocks Cry Out
In what ways have the discoveries of archaeology verified the reliability of the Bible? • ChristianAnswers.Net
Archaeology and the Bible Archaeology and the Bible - ChristianAnswers.Net

2. The Bible is not a science book, yet is scientifically accurate:

Science and the Bible

3. The Bible is filled with hundreds of accurately fulfilled prophecies:

About Bible Prophecy
100 fulfilled Bible prophecies
Bible Prophecies Fulfilled
Reasons To Believe : Fulfilled Prophecy: Evidence for the Reliability of the Bible
Bible Prophecy

No other book, religious or secular, comes close to those requirements.
 
May 3, 2013
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I wish there were more Qumran scroll to help unbelievers compare the actual copies of former originals. According to what it is said, differences are tiny.
 
C

Christabel

Guest
Bible Accuracy



1. Archaeology has confirmed the historical accuracy of the Bible:

The Rocks Cry Out
In what ways have the discoveries of archaeology verified the reliability of the Bible? • ChristianAnswers.Net
Archaeology and the Bible Archaeology and the Bible - ChristianAnswers.Net

2. The Bible is not a science book, yet is scientifically accurate:

Science and the Bible

3. The Bible is filled with hundreds of accurately fulfilled prophecies:

About Bible Prophecy
100 fulfilled Bible prophecies
Bible Prophecies Fulfilled
Reasons To Believe : Fulfilled Prophecy: Evidence for the Reliability of the Bible
Bible Prophecy

No other book, religious or secular, comes close to those requirements.
Thank you Paru, and God bless you! What a wonderful, informative post! :D
 

Pahu

Senior Member
Jul 5, 2011
684
6
0
Evolution is observed and provable.
SCIENTISTS SPEAK ABOUT EVOLUTION: 1


Top-flight scientists have something to tell you about evolution. Such statements will never be found in the popular magazines, alongside gorgeous paintings of ape-man and Big Bangs and solemn pronouncements about millions of years for this rock and that fish. Instead they are generally reserved only for professional books and journals.

Most scientists are working in very narrow fields; they do not see the overall picture, and assume, even though their field does not prove evolution, that perhaps other areas of science probably vindicate it. They are well-meaning men. The biologists and geneticists know their facts, and research does not prove evolution, but assume that geology does. The geologists know their field does not prove evolution, but hope that the biologists and geneticists have proven it. Those who do know the facts, fear to disclose them to the general public, lest they be fired. But they do write articles in their own professional journals and books, condemning evolutionary theory.

Included below are a number of admissions by leading evolutionists of earlier decades, such as *Charles Darwin, *Austin Clark, or *Fred Hoyle. The truth is that evolutionists cannot make scientific facts fit the theory.

An asterisk ( * ) by a name indicates that person is not known to be a creationist. Of over 4,000 quotations in the set of books this Encyclopedia is based on, only 164 statements are by creationists.

"The Darwinian theory of descent has not a single fact to confirm it in the realm of nature. It is not the result of scientific research, but purely the product of imagination."—*Dr. Fleischman [Erlangen zoologist].

"It is almost invariably assumed that animals with bodies composed of a single cell represent the primitive animals from which all others derived. They are commonly supposed to have preceded all other animal types in their appearance. There is not the slightest basis for this assumption."—*Austin Clark, The New Evolution (1930), pp. 235-236.

"The hypothesis that life has developed from inorganic matter is, at present, still an article of faith."—*J.W.N. Sullivan, The Limitations of Science (1933), p. 95.

"Where are we when presented with the mystery of life? We find ourselves facing a granite wall which we have not even chipped . . We know virtually nothing of growth, nothing of life."—*W. Kaempffert, "The Greatest Mystery of All: The Secret of Life," New York Times.

" `The theory of evolution is totally inadequate to explain the origin and manifestation of the inorganic world.' "—Sir John Ambrose Fleming, F.R.S., quoted in H. Enoch, Evolution or Creation (1966), p. 91 [discoverer of the thermionic valve].

"I think, however, that we must go further than this and admit that the only acceptable explanation is creation. I know that this is anathema to physicists, as indeed it is to me, but we must not reject a theory that we do not like if the experimental evidence supports it."—*H. Lipson, "A Physicist Looks at Evolution," Physics Bulletin, 31 (1980), p. 138.

"I am not satisfied that Darwin proved his point or that his influence in scientific and public thinking has been beneficial . . the success of Darwinism was accomplished by a decline in scientific integrity."—*W.R. Thompson, Introduction to *Charles Darwin's, Origin of the Species [Canadian scientist].

"One of the determining forces of scientism was a fantastic accidental imagination which could explain every irregularity in the solar system without explanation, leap the gaps in the atomic series without evidence [a gap required by the Big Bang theory], postulate the discovery of fossils which have never been discovered, and prophesy the success of breeding experiments which have never succeeded. Of this kind of science it might truly be said that it was `knowledge falsely so called.' "—*David C.C. Watson, The Great Brain Robbery (1976).

"The hold of the evolutionary paradigm [theoretical system] is so powerful that an idea which is more like a principle of medieval astrology than a serious twentieth century scientific theory has become a reality for evolutionary biologists."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985), p. 306 [Australian molecular biologist].

"The particular truth is simply that we have no reliable evidence as to the evolutionary sequence . . One can find qualified professional arguments for any group being the descendant of almost any other."—J. Bonner, "Book Review," American Scientist, 49:1961, p. 240.

"It was because Darwinian theory broke man's link with God and set him adrift in a cosmos without purpose or end that its impact was so fundamental. No other intellectual revolution in modern times . . so profoundly affected the way men viewed themselves and their place in the universe."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985), p. 67 [Australian molecular biologist].

"I had motives for not wanting the world to have meaning, consequently assumed it had none, and was able without any difficulty to find satisfying reasons for this assumption . . The philosopher who finds no meaning in the world is not concerned exclusively with a problem in pure metaphysics; he is also concerned to prove there is no valid reason why he personally should not do as he wants to do . . For myself, as no doubt for most of my contemporaries, the philosophy of meaninglessness was essentially an instrument of liberation. The liberation we desired was simultaneously liberation from a certain political and economic system and liberation from a certain system of morality. We objected to the morality because it interfered with our sexual freedom."—*Aldous Huxley, "Confessions of a Professed Atheist," Report: Perspective on the News, Vol. 3, June 1966, p. 19 [grandson of evolutionist Thomas Huxley, Darwin's closest friend and promoter, and brother of evolutionist Julian Huxley. Aldous Huxley was one of the most influential liberal writers of the 20th century].

"Evolutionism is a fairy tale for grown-ups. This theory has helped nothing in the progress of science. It is useless."—*Bounoure, Le Monde Et La Vie (October 1963) [Director of Research at the National center of Scientific Research in France].

"As by this theory, innumerable transitional forms must have existed. Why do we not find them embedded in the crust of the earth? Why is not all nature in confusion [of halfway species] instead of being, as we see them, well-defined species?"—*Charles Darwin, quoted in H. Enoch, Evolution or Creation (1966), p. 139.

" `Creation,' in the ordinary sense of the word, is perfectly conceivable. I find no difficulty in conceiving that, at some former period, this universe was not in existence; and that it made its appearance in six days . . in consequence of the volition of some pre-existing Being."—*Thomas Huxley, quoted in *Leonard Huxley, Life and Letters of Thomas Henry Huxley, Vol. II (1903), p. 429.

"The theory of evolution suffers from grave defects, which are more and more apparent as time advances. It can no longer square with practical scientific knowledge."—*Albert Fleishmann, Zoologist.

"I argue that the `theory of evolution' does not take predictions, so far as ecology is concerned, but is instead a logical formula which can be used only to classify empiricisms [theories] and to show the relationships which such a classification implies . . these theories are actually tautologies and, as such, cannot make empirically testable predictions. They are not scientific theories at all."—*R.H. Peters, "Tautology in Evolution and Ecology," American Naturalist (1976), Vol. 110, No. 1, p. 1 [emphasis his].

"Scientists have no proof that life was not the result of an act of creation."—*Robert Jastrow, The Enchanted Loom: Mind in the Universe (1981), p. 19.

"In fact, evolution became in a sense a scientific religion; almost all scientists have accepted it and many are prepared to `bend' their observations to fit in with it."—*H. Lipson, "A Physicist Looks at Evolution," Physics Bulletin, 31 (1980), p. 138.

"When Darwin presented a paper [with Alfred Wallace] to the Linnean Society in 1858, a Professor Haugton of Dublin remarked, `All that was new was false, and what was true was old.' This, we think, will be the final verdict on the matter, the epitaph on Darwinism."—*Fred Hoyle and N. Chandra Wickramasinghe, Evolution from Space (1981), p. 159.

"Creation and evolution, between them, exhaust the possible explanations for the origin of living things. Organisms either appeared on the earth fully developed or they did not. If they did not, they must have developed from pre-existing species by some process of modification. If they did appear in a fully developed state, they must have been created by some omnipotent intelligence."—*D.J. Futuyma, Science on Trial (1983), p. 197.

"With the failure of these many efforts, science was left in the somewhat embarrassing position of having to postulate theories of living origins which it could not demonstrate. After having chided the theologian for his reliance on myth and miracle, science found itself in the unenviable position of having to create a mythology of its own: namely, the assumption that what, after long effort, could not be proved to take place today had, in truth, taken place in the primeval past."—*Loren Eisley, The Immense Journey, (1957), p. 199.

"The over-riding supremacy of the myth has created a widespread illusion that the theory of evolution was all but proved one hundred years ago and that all subsequent biological research—paleontological, zoological, and in the newer branches of genetics and molecular biology—has provided ever-increasing evidence for Darwinian ideas."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985), p. 327.

"The irony is devastating. The main purpose of Darwinism was to drive every last trace of an incredible God from biology. But the theory replaces God with an even more incredible deity—omnipotent chance."—*T. Rosazak, Unfinished Animal (1975), pp. 101-102.

"Today our duty is to destroy the myth of evolution, considered as a simple, understood and explained phenomenon which keeps rapidly unfolding before us. Biologists must be encouraged to think about the weaknesses and extrapolations that the theoreticians put forward or lay down as established truths. The deceit is sometimes unconscious, but not always, since some people, owing to their sectarianism, purposely overlook reality and refuse to acknowledge the inadequacies and falsity of their beliefs."—*Pierre-Paul de Grasse, Evolution of Living Organisms (1977), p. 8.

"The evolution theory can by no means be regarded as an innocuous natural philosophy, but that it is a serious obstruction to biological research. It obstructs—as has been repeatedly shown—the attainment of consistent results, even from uniform experimental material. For everything must ultimately be forced to fit this theory. An exact biology cannot, therefore, be built up."—*H. Neilsson, Synthetische Artbuilding, 1954, p. 11.

"It is therefore of immediate concern to both biologists and layman that Darwinism is under attack. The theory of life that undermined nineteenth-century religion has virtually become a religion itself and, in its turn, is being threatened by fresh ideas. The attacks are certainly not limited to those of the creationists and religious fundamentalists who deny Darwinism for political and moral reason. The main thrust of the criticism comes from within science itself. The doubts about Darwinism represent a political revolt from within rather than a siege from without."—*B. Leith, The Descent of Darwin: A Handbook of Doubts about Darwinism (1982), p. 11.

"My attempts to demonstrate evolution by an experiment carried on for more than 40 years have completely failed. At least I should hardly be accused of having started from any preconceived anti-evolutionary standpoint."—*H. Nilsson, Synthetic Speciation (1953), p. 31.

"Just as pre-Darwinian biology was carried out by people whose faith was in the Creator and His plan, post-Darwinian biology is being carried out by people whose faith is in, almost, the deity of Darwin. They've seen their task as to elaborate his theory and to fill the gaps in it, to fill the trunk and twigs of the tree. But it seems to me that the theoretical framework has very little impact on the actual progress of the work in biological research. In a way some aspects of Darwinism and of neo-Darwinism seem to me to have held back the progress of science."—Colin Patterson, The Listener [senior paleontologist at the British Museum of Natural History, London].

"Throughout the past century there has always existed a significant minority of first-rate biologists who have never been able to bring themselves to accept the validity of Darwinian claims. In fact, the number of biologists who have expressed some degree of disillusionment is practically endless."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1986), p. 327.

"I personally hold the evolutionary position, but yet lament the fact that the majority of our Ph.D. graduates are frightfully ignorant of many of the serious problems of the evolution theory. These problems will not be solved unless we bring them to the attention of students. Most students assume evolution is proved, the missing link is found, and all we have left is a few rough edges to smooth out. Actually, quite the contrary is true; and many recent discoveries . . have forced us to re-evaluate our basic assumptions."—*Director of a large graduate program in biology, quoted in Creation: The Cutting Edge (1982), p. 26.

"The creation account in Genesis and the theory of evolution could not be reconciled. One must be right and the other wrong. The story of the fossils agreed with the account of Genesis. In the oldest rocks we did not find a series of fossils covering the gradual changes from the most primitive creatures to developed forms, but rather in the oldest rocks developed species suddenly appeared. Between every species there was a complete absence of intermediate fossils."—*D.B. Gower, "Scientist Rejects Evolution," Kentish Times, England, December 11, 1975, p. 4 [biochemist].

"From the almost total absence of fossil evidence relative to the origin of the phyla, it follows that any explanation of the mechanism in the creative evolution of the fundamental structural plans is heavily burdened with hypothesis. This should appear as an epigraph to every book on evolution. The lack of direct evidence leads to the formulation of pure conjecture as to the genesis of the phyla; we do not even have a basis to determine the extent to which these opinions are correct."—*Pierre-Paul de Grasse, Evolution of Living Organisms (1977), p. 31.

"We still do not know the mechanics of evolution in spite of the over-confident claims in some quarters, nor are we likely to make further progress in this by the classical methods of paleontology or biology; and we shall certainly not advance matters by jumping up and down shrilling, `Darwin is god and I, So-and-so, am his prophet.' "—*Errol White, Proceedings of the Linnean Society, London, 177:8 (1966).

"I feel that the effect of hypotheses of common ancestry in systematics has not been merely boring, not just a lack of knowledge; I think it has been positively anti-knowledge . . Well, what about evolution? It certainly has the function of knowledge, but does it convey any? Well, we are back to the question I have been putting to people, `Is there one thing you can tell me about?' The absence of answers seems to suggest that it is true, evolution does not convey any knowledge."—*Colin Patterson, Director AMNH, Address at the American Museum of Natural History (November 5, 1981).

"What is it [evolution] based upon? Upon nothing whatever but faith, upon belief in the reality of the unseen—belief in the fossils that cannot be produced, belief in the embryological experiments that refuse to come off. It is faith unjustified by works."—*Arthur N. Field.

Scientists Speak About Evolution
 
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Bible Accuracy



1. Archaeology has confirmed the historical accuracy of the Bible:

The Rocks Cry Out
In what ways have the discoveries of archaeology verified the reliability of the Bible? • ChristianAnswers.Net
Archaeology and the Bible Archaeology and the Bible - ChristianAnswers.Net

2. The Bible is not a science book, yet is scientifically accurate:

Science and the Bible

3. The Bible is filled with hundreds of accurately fulfilled prophecies:

About Bible Prophecy
100 fulfilled Bible prophecies
Bible Prophecies Fulfilled
Reasons To Believe : Fulfilled Prophecy: Evidence for the Reliability of the Bible
Bible Prophecy

No other book, religious or secular, comes close to those requirements.
1. Theres real places in the bible? What a suprise, theres real places mentioned to in Hinduism, and greek mythology! I guess they're all valid!

2.No, humans and what you believe to be dinosaurs did not coexist. The vast majority of the scientist community disagrees, so the bible is not scientifically accurate.

3. The bible is filled with hundreds of failed prophecies

Failed biblical prophecies - RationalWiki
 
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Wow what a well educated copy paste you made there. Notice the dates on essentially all of those posts, most if not all of them lacked the ability at the time to examine in detail the human genome and gene sequences and the simmilarities between humans and other species. In fact one modern scientist said, "humans carry about 900 genes that are no longer active but were active in our ancestors at some point". Dr. SEAN B. CARROLL (Professor of Genetics, University of Wisconsin)

Some even say the genetic similarities are so detailed that even without ANY fossil record you would be able to accurately deduce that humans and other high level mammals are related genetically.
 
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Would you prefer it if all my posts were just copy pastes? I think its important to think for yourself rather than just accept things that fit with what you want to argue.
 
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Would you prefer it if all my posts were just copy pastes? I think its important to think for yourself rather than just accept things that fit with what you want to argue.
Nope, and I agree. :) With all due respect, that has nothing to do with being condescending. This and its sister thread are wrought with audacity, and considering both are more an exchange of evidence and research rather than opinion, I don't think the attitude should be in so much circulation.
 

Pahu

Senior Member
Jul 5, 2011
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1. Theres real places in the bible? What a suprise, theres real places mentioned to in Hinduism, and greek mythology! I guess they're all valid!

That is just one piece of evidence proving the Bible to be valid.

2.No, humans and what you believe to be dinosaurs did not coexist. The vast majority of the scientist community disagrees, so the bible is not scientifically accurate.

Proof Man and Dinosaurs lived together


Various Indian drawings on rock walls tell us the Indians actually saw living dinosaurs. They drew on rock walls what they saw with their eyes. The Anasazi Indians of the American southwest made pictures on rocks showing dinosaurs and men. A thick coat of “desert varnish” on these images proves that these pictures were created many hundreds of years ago. Desert varnish (windblown pollen and dust) slowly accumulates on rocks in the desert; the varnish on the Anasazi pictures is so thick that they must have been drawn many hundreds of years ago. Therefore, these art works are not frauds perpetrated by mischievous European newcomers (who had no motive for such a fraud), but were made by natives long ago, showing men and dinosaurs living together. In the ancient city of Angkor in Cambodia, we can see a stegosaurus carved in one of the temple walls. In Mexico, many hundreds ancient dinosaur figurines have been unearthed, some even with men riding them! (see below)

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This is not just accidental similarity between the Indian artwork and what we believe the edmontosaurus looked like!
This remarkable pictograph can be seen etched into the canyon walls of the Grand Canyon. Other animals show the same clarity. The people living there not too long ago saw reptiles that we only see in books. They painted what they observed. Dinosaurs did not become extinct 65 million years before the "evolution" of man. They were obviously created at the same time!
Cave drawing to the right of a long neck dragon. Bottom picture is outlined in white to show it's shape better.

Ica Stone, found in the Ica valley in Peru. The people lived there about 3,000 years ago. How did they know what dinosaurs looked like?
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More Indian artwork from Canada. The evolutionary time-table has been proved entirely wrong.
This carving was found on a Cambodian temple wall. It is an excellent depiction of a stegosaurus, many hundreds of years old. How could they have known about stegosaurs if they had never seen one?[HR][/HR]
Thousands of Indian clay figurines have been unearthed in Acambaro, Mexico.
This pottery is several thousand years old. Remember we aren't supposed to know what dinosaurs looked like until the late 1800's really the mid 1900's. This Pottery is dated back to between 800BC and 200 AD.
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Many irrefutable proofs Dinosaurs and Man coexisted
Proof Dinosaurs Lived With Man

Many Examples
(www.toptenproofs.com)

Stegosaur in Cambodia


Footprints in the sand

There are many dinosaur footprints being found worldwide. Some have been found with human footprints. Evolutionists do everything they can to discredit these finds. You - the reader - must decide for yourself. We try to gather as much archaeological information as possible to help you know how much evidence is being kept from you in the school textbooks - information the evolutionists don't want you to know about.​


The Alvis Delk Track

This spectacular fossil footprint was found in July of 2000 by amateur archaeologist, Alvis Delk of Stephenville, Texas and is now on display at the Creation Evidence Museum, Glen Rose, TX. Mr. Delk found the loose slab against the bank of the Paluxy River, about one mile north of Dinosaur Valley State Park. He flipped over the rock and saw an excellent dinosaur track, so he took it home where it sat in his living room for years, with hundreds of other fossils.

Early in 2008 he had a devastating accident. He fell off of a roof incurring damage that required months of hospitalization. He still has a dangerous blood clot in his brain. When he returned to his home, he decided he would sell the dinosaur track, thinking Dr. Carl Baugh of the nearby Creation Evidence Museum would pay a few hundred dollars for it. He began to clean the rock, and that was when he discovered the fossil human footprint underneath the dried clay! The human footprint had been made first, and shortly thereafter (before the mud turned to stone), a dinosaur stepped in the mud with its middle toe stepping on top of the human track. You can actually see the displaced mud from the dinosaur's middle toe inside the human footprint. Spiral CT scans are used to generate images of the inside of an object from a large series of two-dimensional X-ray images taken around a single axis of rotation. This technology provides an effective means of analyzing fossil footprints without physically destroying them. It allows us to see inside the rock, specifically, under the footprint.



The slab was taken to the Glen Rose medical center where spiral CT scans were performed on the rock. Over 800 X-ray images document density changes within the rock that correspond precisely with the fossil footprints. Of course, carvings would show no corresponding structures beneath them. The existence of following contours beneath the fossil footprints dramatically demonstrate the authenticity of both tracks.According to evolutionary theory, the dinosaur tracks at Glen Rose, TX were made at least 100 million years before humans were supposed to have evolved. Of course dinosaurs and humans cannot be stepping in each other's footprint if they are millions of years apart. These footprints provide profound evidence refuting the evolutionary myth. Of course, evolutionists do everything they can to refute findings like these, I guess simply because it doesn't agree with their religion. How much better would their time be spent seriously looking into all of the archaeological finds around them, instead of discounting them!

Precambrian Trilobites are supposed to be separated from man by millions of years, yet fossils appear in "recent" strata and even within a fossil sandal print. There are thousands of fossils that are "out of order" and even sophisticated man-made artifacts in "ancient" rock. There are fossil clams on the highest mountains and human tracks in supposed ancient layers of volcanic ash.

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A fossil footprint was discovered in June 1968 by William J. Meister on an expedition to Antelope Spring, 43 miles west of Delta, Utah. The sandal that seems to have crushed a living trilobite was 10 1/4 inches long and 3 1/2 inches wide; the heel is indented slightly more than the sole, as a human shoe print would be.[/TD]
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This photo was taken by the late Dr. Cecil Daugherty, in the 1970's. It shows a human footprint within a trail of dinosaur tracks in the bed of the Paluxy River in Glen Rose, Texas.[/TD]
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http://www.6000years.org/frame.php?page=dinosaurs
3. The bible is filled with hundreds of failed prophecies

Failed biblical prophecies - RationalWiki
What are failed are the list of "Failed biblical prophecies"!
For example:

Fulfilled Prophecy: City Of Tyre

ARTICLE INDEX




THIS HAS BEEN CLIPPED FROM JOSH McDOWELL'S "A READY DEFENSE":


1. Tyre
Ezekiel 26 (592-570 B.C.)
Therefore, thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am against you, O Tyre, and I will bring up many nations against you, as the sea brings up its waves. "And they will destroy the walls of Tyre and break down her towers; and I will scrape her debris from her and make her a bare rock"(verses 3,4 ).


For thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I will bring upon Tyre from the north Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, king of kings, with horses, chariots, cavalry, and a great army. He will slay your daughters on the mainland with the sword; and he will make siege walls against you, cast up a mound against you, and raise up a large shield against you (verses 7,8 ).


"Also they will make a spoil of your riches and a prey of your merchandise, break down your walls and destroy your pleasant houses, and throw your stones and your timbers and your debris into the water (verse 12 ).


"And I will make you a bare rock; you will be a place for the spreading of nets. You will be built no more, for I the LORD have spoken, "declares the Lord GOD (verse 14 ).


"I shall bring terrors on you, and you will be no more; though you will be sought, you will never be found again,"declares the Lord GOD (verse 21 ).


Predictions


1. Nebuchadnezzar will destroy the mainland city of Tyre (26:8 ).
2. Many nations will come against Tyre (26:3 ).
3. She will be made a bare rock; flat like the top of a rock (26:4 ).
4. Fishermen will spread nets over the site (26:5 ).
5. The debris will be thrown into the water (26:12 ).
6. She will never be rebuilt (26:14 ).
7. She will never be found again (26:21 ).


NEBUCHADNEZZAR


Nevuchadnezzar laid siege to mainland Tyre three years after the prophecy. The Encylopedia Britannica says: "After a 13-year siege (585-573 B.C.) by Nebuchadnezzar II, Tyre made terms and acknowledged Babylonians suzerainty."


When Nebuchadnezzar broke the gates down, he found the city almost empty. The majority of the people had moved by ship to an island about one-half mile off the coast and fortified a city there. The mainland city was destroyed in 573 (prediction #1), but the city of Tyre on the island remained a powerful city for several hundred years.


ALEXANDER THE GREAT


The next incident was with Alexander the Great.


"In his war on the Persians," writes the Encyclopaedia Britannica, "Alezander III, after defeating Darius III at the Battle of Issus (333), marched southward toward Egypt, calling upon the Phoenician cities to open their gates, as it was part of his general plan to deny their use to the Persian fleet. The citizens of Tyre refused to do so, and Alexander laid siege to the city, Possessing no fleet, he demolished old Tyre, on the mainland, and with the debris built a mole 200 ft. (60m.) wide acriss the straits separating the old and new towns, erecting towers and war engines at the farther end. (Prediction #5).


The Tyrians countered here with a full-scale raid on the whole operation, which was very successful; they made use of fireships to start the towers burning and then swarmed over the mole after the Greeks were routed. General destruction of the mole was made to as great an extent as the raiding party was capable. Arrian progressed to the sea struggle. Alexander realized he needed ships. He began pressuring and mustering conquered subjects to make ships available for this operation. Alexander's navy grew from cities and areas as follows: Sidon, Aradus, Byblus (these contributed about 80 sails), 10 from Rhodes, 3 from Soli and Mallos, 10 from Lycia, a big one from Macedon, and 120 from Cyprus. (Prediction #2.)


With this now superior naval force at Alexander's disposal, the conquest of Tyre through completion of the land bridge was simply a question of time. How long would this take? Darius III, Alexander's Persian enemy, was not standing idle at this time, but finally the causeway was completed, the walls were battered down, and mop-up operations began.


"The causeway still remains," writes Philip Myers, "uniting the rock with the mainland. When at last the city was taken after a siege of seven months, eight thousand of the inhabitants were slain and thirty thousand sold into slavery."


Philip Myers made an interesting observation here; he is a secular historian (not a theologian), and this is found in a history textbook:


Alexander the Great...reduced [Tyre] to runs (332 B.C.). She recovered in a measure from this blow, but never regained the place she had previously held in the world. The larger part of the site of the once great city is now bare as the top of a rock [prediction #3]-a place where the fisherman that still frequent the spot spread their nets to dry. 99/55 (Prediction #4.)


John C. Beck keeps the history of the island city of Tyre in the proper perspective:
The history of Tyre does not stop after the conquest of Alexander. Men continue to rebuild her and armies continue to besiege her walls until finally, after sixteen hundred years, she falls never to be rebuilt again.


[HR][/HR]

Citings:
21. Beck, John Clark, Jr. The Fall of Tyre According to Ezekiel's Prophecy. Unpublished master's thesis, Dallas Theological Seminary, 1971.
43. Encyclopedia Britannica. 1970.
99. Myers, Philip Van Ness. General History for Colleges and High Schools. Boston: Ginn and Company, 1889.



McDowell, Josh. The Best of Josh McDowell : a ready defense/compiled by Bill Wilson. San Bernardino, CA : Here's Life Publishers, 1990.
[HR][/HR]You can pick up a copy of "The Best of Josh McDowell : A Ready Defence" at a bookstore near you.

Fulfilled Prophecy of the City Tyre - Bible Truth Vs. Church Doctrine


 
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Nope, and I agree. :) With all due respect, that has nothing to do with being condescending. This and its sister thread are wrought with audacity, and considering both are more an exchange of evidence and research rather than opinion, I don't think the attitude should be in so much circulation.
Not much evidence in this thread.
 

Pahu

Senior Member
Jul 5, 2011
684
6
0
Wow what a well educated copy paste you made there. Notice the dates on essentially all of those posts, most if not all of them lacked the ability at the time to examine in detail the human genome and gene sequences and the simmilarities between humans and other species. In fact one modern scientist said, "humans carry about 900 genes that are no longer active but were active in our ancestors at some point". Dr. SEAN B. CARROLL (Professor of Genetics, University of Wisconsin)

Some even say the genetic similarities are so detailed that even without ANY fossil record you would be able to accurately deduce that humans and other high level mammals are related genetically.
SCIENTISTS SPEAK ABOUT SIMILARITIES


Careful scientists wish to tell you that the concept of "similarities" (also called "homology"), as an evidence that evolution has occurred, is without foundation. Evolutionary theory is a myth. This is science vs. evolution—a Creation-Evolution Encyclopedia, brought to you by Creation Science Facts.

CONTENTS: Scientists Speak about Similarities

Introduction
: All we have are theories without evidence
The Amino Acid "Similarities": Forget about similar number of arm bones; look at the other "similarities"
Hemoglobin "Similarities": We descended from lampreys?
Genetic "Similarities": We should find the similarities in the genetic codes
Circular Reasoning: The similarities argument is based on reasoning in a circle
Conclusion: The similarities, even though logically required, do not exist

Page numbers without book references refer to the book, SIMILARITIES, from which these facts are summarized. An asterisk ( * ) by a name indicates that person is not known to be a creationist. Of over 4,000 quotations in the set of books this Encyclopedia is based on
, only 164 statements are by creationists.

INTRODUCTION


"The fact of evolution is the backbone of biology, and biology is thus in the peculiar position of being a science founded on an unproved theory—is it then a science or faith?"—*L.H. Matthews, "Introduction" to *Charles Darwin's, Origin of Species, pp. x-xi (1971 edition).

"I think, however, that we must go further than this and admit that the only acceptable explanation is Creation. I know that this is anathema to physicists, as indeed it is to me, but we must not reject a theory that we do not like if the experimental evidence supports it."—*H. Lipson, "A Physicist Looks at Evolution," Physics Bulletin 31 (1980), p. 138.

THE AMINO ACID "SIMILARITIES"


"When it comes to comparing similarities among amino acids in alpha hemoglobin sequences, crocodiles have much more in common with chickens (17.5%) than with vipers (5.6%), their fellow reptiles. Myoglobin sequences do show one reptile / reptile pair (lizard / crocodile) with greater similarity (10.5% to 8.5%) than the reptile / bird (crocodile / chicken) pair, but it also puts the lizard as close to the chicken (10.5%) as to its fellow reptile . . The greatest similarity is between the crocodiles and chickens."—Henry M. Morris and Gary Parker, What Is Creation Science? (1987), pp. 59-60.

"The difference between turtles and rattlesnakes of 21 amino acid residues per 100 codons is notable larger than many differences between representatives of widely separated classes, for example, 17 between chicken and lamprey, or 16 between horse and dogfish, or even 15 between dog and screw worm fly in two different phyla."—*T. Jukes and *R. Holmquist, "Evolutionary Clock: Nonconsistency of Rate in Different Species," in Science, 177 (1972), p. 530.

"It is hard to see a common line of descent snaking in so unsystematic a way through so many different phyla."—*Richard E. Dickerson and *Irving Geis, The Structure and Action of Proteins, 1969."There is simply no way of explaining how a uniform rate of evolution could have occurred in any family of homologousproteins by either chance or selection; and even if we could advance an explanation for one particular protein family, we would still be left with the mystifying problem of explaining why other protein families should have evolved at different rates."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985), p. 305.

"The difficulties associated with attempting to explain how a family of homologous proteins could have evolved at constant rates has created chaos in evolutionary thought . . [As a result] the credibility of the molecular clock hypothesis is severely strained and with it the whole paradigm of evolution itself is endangered."—*Op. cit., p. 306.

"However, as more protein sequences began to accumulate during the 1960s, it became increasingly apparent that the molecules were not going to provide any evidence of sequential arrangements in nature [from amoeba through its "descendants" on to man] but were going to reaffirm the view that the system of nature conforms fundamentally to a highly ordered hierarchic scheme from which all direct evidence of evolution is emphatically absent. Moreover, the divisions turned out to be more mathematically perfect than even most die-hard typologists would have predicted."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985), chapter entitled, "A Bio-chemical Echo of Typology."

HEMOGLOBIN "SIMILARITIES"


*There is not a trace, at a molecular level, of the traditional evolutionary series: fish to amphibian to reptile to mammal. Incredible, man is closer to lamprey [in his hemoglobin] than are fish!"—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985).It is of interest that chlorophyll in plants and human hemoglobin differ in chemical makeup by only one molecule. The difference being one magnesium molecule exchanged for one iron molecule. This does not imply that our ancestors were trees.

GENETIC "SIMILARITIES"


"It is now clear that the pride with which it was assumed that the inheritance of homologous structures from a common ancestor explained homology was misplaced; for such inheritancecannot be ascribed to identity of genes. The attempt to find `homologous genes, except in closely related species, has been given up as hopeless."—*Sir Gavin de Beer, Homology, An Unsolved Problem (1971).

"But if it is true that through the genetic code, gene code for enzymes that synthesize proteins are responsible (in a manner still unknown in embryology) for the differentiation of the various parts in their normal manner,—what mechanism can it be that results in the production of homologous organs, the same `patterns,' in spite of their not being controlled by the same genes? I asked that question in 1938, and it has not yet been answered."—*Op. cit., p. 16.

"The older textbooks on evolution make much of the idea of homology, pointing out the obvious resemblances between the skeletons of the limbs of different animals. Thus the `pentadactyl' [five bone] limb pattern is found in the arm of a man, the wing of a bird, and flipper of a whale, and this is held to indicate their common origin."Now if these various structures were transmitted by the same gene couples, varied from time to time by mutations and acted upon by environmental selection, the theory would make good sense. Unfortunately this is not the case. Homologous organs are now known to be produced by totally different gene complexes in the different species. The concept of homology in terms of similar genes handed on from a common ancestor has broken down."—*Randall, quoted in *William Fix, The Bone Peddlers, p. 189.

CIRCULAR REASONING


"When Professor Simpson says that homology is determined by ancestry and concludes that homology is evidence of ancestry, he is using the circular argument so characteristic of evolutionary reasoning. When he adds that evolutionary developments can be described without paleontological evidence, he is attempting to revive the facile and irresponsible speculation which through so many years, under the influence of the Darwinian mythology, has impeded the advance of biology."—*"Evolution and Taxonomy," Studia Entomologica, Vol. 5, October 1962, p. 567.

CONCLUSION


"Taxonomists [those who classify plants and animals according to their appearance] have never had an objective basis for homology . . they cannot at present give it any objective basis, even though it is a logical necessity in the evolution of animals."—*R.E. Blackwalder, Taxonomy: A Text and Reference Book (1967)."A great darkness had settled on the majority of British zoologists in the early decades of this century."—*G.P. Wells, quoted in Perspectives in Experiential Biology (1976).

"If, then, it can be established beyond dispute that similarity or even identity of the same character in different species is not always to be interpreted to mean that both have arisen from a common ancestor, the whole argument from comparative anatomy seems to tumble in ruins."—*Thomas Hunt Morgan, The Bearing of Mendelism on the Origin of the Species," in Scientific Monthly 16(3):237 (1923).

"Despite the fact that no convincing explanation of how random evolutionary processes could have resulted insuch an ordered pattern of diversity, the [totally opposite] idea of uniform rates of evolution is presented in the literatureas if it were anempirical discovery. The hold of every evolutionary paradigm is so powerful that an idea which is more like a principle of medieval astrology than a serious twentieth-century scientific theory has become a reality for evolutionary biologists . . Yet in the face of this extraordinary discovery [of structures so totally diverse], the biological community seems content to offer explanations which are no more than apologetic tautologies."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (1985).

"The concept of homology is fundamental to what we are talking about when we speak of evolution, yet in truth we cannot explain it at all in terms of present-day biological theory."—*Sir A. Hardy, The Living Stream (1965), p. 211.

"By this we have also proved that a morphological similarity between organisms cannot be used as proof of a phylogenetic [evolutionary] relationship . . it is unscientific to maintain that the morphology may be used to prove relationships and evolution of the higher categories of units."—*N. Heribert Nilsson, Sysnthetische Artbildung (1953), p. 1143.

SCIENTISTS SPEAK ABOUT SIMILARITIES
 
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A copy paste does not evidence make.

But according to your own evidence


"6. She will never be rebuilt (26:14 ).
7. She will never be found again (
26:21 )"

There is a modern city of Tyre, inhabiated, we clearly know where it is, even some of the ruins are still there.