The Freemasons!

[alienx7587]

Much has been said about them, little has been validated. Many men have been part of their fraternity- including Christians (some say Billy Graham is a 33rd degree Mason, though Team Graham denies it- shocking).

At some point in history a writer and known fraud angry with the Catholic church, began writing about how Mason's worshipped Lucifer. Eventually the writer confessed that it was all a rouse to scare Catholics.

The Catholic Church has essentially banished them anyway (and in turn began their own alternative: Knights of Columbus) and many Protestants are wary of them.

After the Civil War, a Confederate Officer, Albert Pike, wrote another book about Masonry (which was also apparently false) stating the group worshipped the devil. (It says in the intro that all statements in the book are to be believed at the readers discretion.)

Freemasonry was heavily involved in the American Revolution (like the Boston Tea Party). Even today Washington D.C. ("Masonic City") is full of symbols and the city was named after a mason- George Washington (also a Christian).

In order to become a Freemason one must believe in a Divine, Supreme Being- or "Grand Architect of the Universe". However, this doesn't necessarily have to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Joseph, because, in fact, Freemasonry is not a religious group at all- it's a fraternity.

What do you think of the freemason's? Cite concrete evidence to support your argument!

Do not simply list out-of-context, vague Bible verses. Extrapolate!

One more thing: If you're considering using John Ankerberg/John Weldon or John MacArthur in your response, please read the following prior to submitting

Small Town Texas Masons: An Open Letter To Dr. John Ankerberg, Dr. John Weldon Part II

Getting Understanding: John MacArthur preaches a false sermon

 

[Anonimous]

did no one see National Treasure? It is a conspiracy. It was on TV...it must be true!

 

[Elizabeth619]

In order to become a Freemason one must believe in a Divine, Supreme Being- or "Grand Architect of the Universe". However, this doesn't necessarily have to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Joseph, because, in fact, Freemasonry is not a religious group at all- it's a fraternity.

Why would you want to be in an organization that doesn't recognize God as the divine creator. All they require is you believe in some type of supernatural occurances. This could also mean the occult. We are forbidden to associate with things like that.
If an organization or fraternity does not put God first then why be in it?

The bible tells us our closest relationships should be with fellow Christians. This fraternity is not a Christian organization.

There are plently more organizations that help with veterans, children, charities and so on that put God first.

You can worship any God you choose at the same alter in the Masonic Lodge...... that is a HUGE NO NO!

 

[kenisyes]

Morals and Dogma Index contains absolute proof Masons are taught and encouraged to practice the occult and pagan religions.

 

[alienx7587]

Why would you want to be in an organization that doesn't recognize God as the divine creator. All they require is you believe in some type of supernatural occurances. This could also mean the occult. We are forbidden to associate with things like that.
If an organization or fraternity does not put God first then why be in it?

The bible tells us our closest relationships should be with fellow Christians. This fraternity is not a Christian organization.

There are plently more organizations that help with veterans, children, charities and so on that put God first.

You can worship any God you choose at the same alter in the Masonic Lodge...... that is a HUGE NO NO!

Interesting, however, I think you're overlooking a couple of things.
1) The Holy Bible is sitting on the altar in the center of the room at every Masonic Lodge.

2) The Mason's aren't a religious organization, that is to say, they don't "worship" together at their meetings nor do they hold worship services like a church.

3) It does put God first, hence why the first requirement is that one believes in a Grand Architect of the Universe in order to be a member. For example, if an Islamic person were to be a Mason (rare) he would worship Allah, but if a Christian man were to be a member he would worship God.

4) Are you dismissing the Christian members of the Freemasons as fraudulent? Members like Ronald Reagan, George Washington and even the lesser known people like the two people who wrote the links I posted in the OP:
Here - Small Town Texas Masons: An Open Letter To Dr. John Ankerberg, Dr. John Weldon Part II
And Here - Getting Understanding: John MacArthur preaches a false sermon

The United States is seemingly a direct reflection of the way the Masonic Lodges operate. People are free to worship whatever god they want, whenever they want- but in the United States most (if not all) freemason's worship the One and only God- the God who gave Solomon his wisdom and David his courage.

Morals and Dogma Index contains absolute proof Masons are taught and encouraged to practice the occult and pagan religions.

Did you even read the link you posted? It specifically says:

"So it would be a mistake to use this work as an authoritative source without additional research and critical thinking." [sic]

Furthermore, Morals and Dogma was written by Albert Pike, whom I mentioned in the intro to this thread. Please re-read the OP.

 

[Elizabeth619]

1) The Holy Bible is sitting on the altar in the center of the room at every Masonic Lodge.

The bible is referred to as a "piece of furniture". The bible is NOT apiece of furniture, andno God fearing Christian would consider it to be.

2) The Mason's aren't a religious organization, that is to say, they don't "worship" together at their meetings nor do they hold worship services like a church

.
Any organization that does not recognize God as our only God and Jesus as Savior is wrong.

3) It does put God first, hence why the first requirement is that one believes in a Grand Architect of the Universe in order to be a member. For example, if an Islamic person were to be a Mason (rare) he would worship Allah, but if a Christian man were to be a member he would worship God.

Believing in a Grand Architect is not putting God first, and yet Jesus and is sacrifice is obviously not mentioned. This organization does not support Christianity on any level.
The bible warns us about mixed with bad company, and how it can corrupt ones mind. To worship at the same alter as other religions can be seen as an abomination.

4)

Are you dismissing the Christian members of the Freemasons as fraudulent? Members like Ronald Reagan, George Washington and even the lesser known people like the two people who wrote the links I posted in the OP:

It was just as wrong then as a Christian to be a mason as it is now. Just because famous people are part of a club doesn't make it cool.

The United States is seemingly a direct reflection of the way the Masonic Lodges operate. People are free to worship whatever god they want, whenever they want- but in the United States most (if not all) freemason's worship the One and only God- the God who gave Solomon his wisdom and David his courage.

Yet again, no mention of Jesus.
Yet there is plenty mention of the occult, Legends. the use of tarot and the acknowledgement of Greek and Egyptian gods.

There is also the Masonic prayer. If you acknowledge all religions then what God are you praying to? Or are oyu praying to God at all?
If you're a Christian then you know God does not accept other religions. The bible says "no one can come to the father except through me." Who do you pray to? How do you pray the same prayer that is meant for other religions/gods?

 

[Elizabeth619]

BTW, this information does come from the Masons and not from some conspiracy theory I have seen on youtube.

the Masons are demonic enough without mention of the illuminati or other conspiracies.

 

[kenisyes]

"So it would be a mistake to use this work as an authoritative source without additional research and critical thinking." [sic]

Furthermore, Morals and Dogma was written by Albert Pike, whom I mentioned in the intro to this thread. Please re-read the OP.

I not only read the link, but most of the book. My problem is that sacred-texts is one of the best reasearched sites for comparative religion in the world. If he says the book was given to every Mason, it was. The reason you must do the additional research, is that nothing about the book proves the Masons did what is covered in the book. It only proves they studied it. In other words, it is not authoratative for Masonic practice, only for Masonic interests. My point is, that although churches today have experience with paganism and deliverance from witchcraft, churches back then had very little. There were almost no programs set up to counteract this type of reading matter. That meant that thoughtful readership of the book was enough to inspire people to follow it without thinking.

I provided the link so each person can draw their own conclusion.

 

[alienx7587]

BTW, this information does come from the Masons and not from some conspiracy theory I have seen on youtube.

the Masons are demonic enough without mention of the illuminati or other conspiracies.

Please replace the word "you" with "one" in your future posts as I am not a Freemason. I'm simply playing the role of devil's advocate in this thread.

I would appreciate it if you answered point #4 from my last point. Your comment in regards to it was fallacious because it was a yes or no question. Are you dismissing Born-Again Christians whom also claim to be Freemasons as fraudulent?

Ties between the Illumaniti and the Freemasons are questionable. It seems the only concrete linkage between the two are of the P2 lodge scandal in Italy. A Masonic lodge was taken over by Illumanti thugs (Licio Gelli and his elite buddies) via blackmail and other deceitful behavior then they pushed for a political takeover of Italy. P2 - Propaganda Due

Please use references!

 

[Donkeyfish07]

I contacted a lodge once when I was younger. I wasn't a believer at the time but was interested in the occult and was curious about masonry in general. The lodge leader responded to my call and invited me to dinner to meet the families of everyone at the lodge. He told me that the number one requirement is that you had to believe in God and that they didn't care if it was Allah, Buddha, or anything like that.....you just had to believe in a supreme being. He also said that there is a saying that states "Masonry makes good men better". I had an opportunity to join the lodge but I had a bad feeling about it and decided against it.

I also had the opportunity to meet an esoteric Mason I met through a mutual friend in California. He was probably the most intelligent person I've ever met in my life and I don't meet people smarter than me very often. We had a lot of interesting conversations about different religious/spiritual topics. He was a practicing wiccan that also dabbled in Kabballa. He had a weird pyramid type thing over his bed and his room was littered with occult material. Kabbalistic books like the Sefer Yetzirah and stuff like that.

He hinted that he wanted me to join a lodge but still something told me it would be a bad idea. I wasn't a true believer in Christ at that point so i'm very lucky I listened to that feeling. About a year or two after that I read Morals and Dogma (like KenisYes referred to in an above post) and wasn't really surprised when he mentioned the Luciferian doctrine that was present. I have no doubt there is an underlying Luciferian philosophy at the core of the organization. It's really easy to discern if you just have an average understanding of the practices and literature.........Without even getting into the initiation rituals and vows you have to make.

 

[Nautilus]

Why would you want to be in an organization that doesn't recognize God as the divine creator. All they require is you believe in some type of supernatural occurances. This could also mean the occult. We are forbidden to associate with things like that.
If an organization or fraternity does not put God first then why be in it?

The bible tells us our closest relationships should be with fellow Christians. This fraternity is not a Christian organization.

There are plently more organizations that help with veterans, children, charities and so on that put God first.

You can worship any God you choose at the same alter in the Masonic Lodge...... that is a HUGE NO NO!

This doesnt really hold water when you apply it to other organizations...what if i wanted to play in a football league? should i not play because the league doesnt hold christianity as number one and there may be muslims or even satanists on my team?

 

[Donkeyfish07]

This doesnt really hold water when you apply it to other organizations...what if i wanted to play in a football league? should i not play because the league doesnt hold christianity as number one and there may be muslims or even satanists on my team?

lol, true....but in football the players don't call the coach "worshipful master" and engage in religious rituals.

 

[Nautilus]

actually praying for a game is quite common beforehand...and i do believe most teams still have chaplains for when they travel. But if everyone is praying to someone different, who are you reallypraying too. Im just showing that elizabeths justification of they dont recognize God as the one true God is a load of bull. Plenty of places dont do that and they arent any better or worse off than anyone else. do you choose where you shop by the religious statements of its owners and employess?

 

[libertygirl]

He told me that the number one requirement is that you had to believe in God and that they didn't care if it was Allah, Buddha, or anything like that.....you just had to believe in a supreme being.

lol, true....but in football the players don't call the coach "worshipful master" and engage in religious rituals.

Good point.

~~~​

I'm not sure why people think freemasonry is okay. It's wrong to perform religious ritual with people who follow different gods.


"Take heed to yourself, lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land where you are going, lest it be a snare in your midst. But you shall destroy their altars, break their sacred pillars, and cut down their wooden images (for you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God), lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and they play the harlot with their gods and make sacrifice to their gods, and one of them invites you and you eat of his sacrifice, and you take of his daughters for your sons, and his daughters play the harlot with their gods and make your sons play the harlot with their gods." Exodus 34:12-16


A Christian's priority should be God's Kingdom. To preach salvation through Christ alone.

 

[alienx7587]

I also had the opportunity to meet an esoteric Mason I met through a mutual friend in California. He was probably the most intelligent person I've ever met in my life and I don't meet people smarter than me very often. We had a lot of interesting conversations about different religious/spiritual topics. He was a practicing wiccan that also dabbled in Kabballa. He had a weird pyramid type thing over his bed and his room was littered with occult material. Kabbalistic books like the Sefer Yetzirah and stuff like that.

He hinted that he wanted me to join a lodge but still something told me it would be a bad idea. I wasn't a true believer in Christ at that point so i'm very lucky I listened to that feeling. About a year or two after that I read Morals and Dogma (like KenisYes referred to in an above post) and wasn't really surprised when he mentioned the Luciferian doctrine that was present. I have no doubt there is an underlying Luciferian philosophy at the core of the organization. It's really easy to discern if you just have an average understanding of the practices and literature.........Without even getting into the initiation rituals and vows you have to make.

Hmmm.... I didn't think the wiccan people could be a part of Freemasonry because they subscribe to duotheism.

This doesnt really hold water when you apply it to other organizations...what if i wanted to play in a football league? should i not play because the league doesnt hold christianity as number one and there may be muslims or even satanists on my team?

Yes, this is basically what I was saying when I used the United States as an example. Each citizen is a "member" of this country yet we are able to worship whoever and however we please.

Good point.

~~~​

I'm not sure why people think freemasonry is okay. It's wrong to perform religious ritual with people who follow different gods.

The only real ritual-like event I can think of that take place are the reenactment of the death of Hiram Abiff (the chief architect of King Solomon's temple) and other reenactments related to historical events. The Hiram Abiff reenactment is to teach initiates the Christian ties behind freemasonry. Claimed biblical references: Hiram (or Huram) is mentioned in 1 Kings 7:13-14, 2 Chronicles 2:13 (Huram-Abi) NIV

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Hmmm.... I didn't think the wiccan people could be a part of Freemasonry because they subscribe to duotheism.

There are a lot of people with different belief systems in Masonry. Just about every religion you can think of actually. There are many esoteric masons that get into masculine/feminine perspective on deity. They aren't secretive about it either. The only requirement is belief in a supreme being and no one is ever interrogated about their religion as a pre-requisite. If you want proof of that I can provide it

 

[danschance]

The Holy Bible is sitting on the altar in the center of the room at every Masonic Lodge.

Well now, we have a bonifide lie here. You claim the bible is in every lodge??


From "

Masonic Altar: The Masonic altar holds a Holy Book (or several Holy Books, depending upon the personal religions of its members). It is around this Holy book that Freemasons circumambulate in their attempts to perform acts pleasing to the Creator.
From: http://www.masonic-lodge-of-education.com/freemasonry-and-the-bible.html

It seems to me that you are very excited about being a freemason and are willing to defend it with zeal, but you also do not seem to know much about it. The bible is not in every lodge. The Koran and other "holy books" can be displayed alone or even next to the bible. That to me is blatant blasphemy as the bible is lowered to the standards of other pagan "holy books".

 

[MrHonest]

I just watched uhmmm There Will Be Blood and ... I feel gross... its a bad movie... it feels like when I jumped a look at the morals and dogmas of the masons link. I don't see an interest in learning things I don't need to learn to be Christian. What God guides me through I feel better being there then letting my mind wander. I know we all like having opinions and hearts and minds and imaginations but its hurting me to think so much as you guys do.

Its not complicated to realize what is good what is bad and what is grey. You know very well that the Bible is good and the fact that you guys pushed me so far towards the edge of a gray area of thinking helped me remember that I'm in an awesome spot in my life where I stopped asking a lot of questions because they don't relate to my every day life and if they do and if they are bad I know God will keep me safe.

Whatever the world holds in knowledge its useless when you're heart is filled with The Word of God. I know I should have read The Bible instead of watching that movie and I know I should be praying instead of looking for opinions to feel better but my mind tends to think I can solve my own problems on my own. Lord forgive me.

I'm happy that for all the questions and all the topics on this world God has made Christians who can handle these things whether psychology, geology, science, religions, politics no matter what we are all made as a community to support each other. Thanks guys.

God bless you guys, in Christ.

 

[Tintin]

Danschance, good grief! Why does someone have to be seen as promoting Freemasonary, if they're merely interested in asking questions/discussing it. Some of you people think that it's evil to learn of other religions, it's not, it's the practising said religions that's wrong. God's Word should be our focus but get your heads out of the sand and realise it's good to know the Enemy's ways in it's many guises!

 

[Ugly]

OP, you yourself admit this is an organization that allows you to worship any deity of your choosing. What more do i need to know? This is an 'all paths lead to the same destination' mindset. Which is clearly not what the bible states.
Only time i see people playing 'devils advocate' is when they support the viewpoint to some degree and are trying to validate it, without taking heat by admitting that they are actually in support of it. It makes zero sense, otherwise, to try to play 'devils advocate' in favor of a clearly non-Christian organization whose teachings, according to you, are the very same teachings that will be spread in the end times as part of the acceptable world religion... 'all paths lead to god'.


Also, Elizabeth, i agree with everything you posted, and in some cases i went to say some things and realized you beat me to it, haha.