jesus is not God

[AnandaHya]

hi im new.....thus was JESUS IN FRENCH SAYS I AM.....GOD SAID TO MOSES I AM WHO I AM OR WAS IT A SILENT H CONSIDERING THE FRENCH..thus i am woud say hiam who=he in hebrew or is it she thus it mixed cuz gods both he and she as for formality reason..74 is the number of chist . i do numerology and after the same results in different area and reason 74 is the number of christ..75 is the passage of creator 72 are the islands we live 76 is the spirit of man and god 7 and 6...7 and nine are taken for birth and gog....thus we have 74 for christ and his color is yellow....he is the golden son of god it was for he christ god made this planet we live....we are not where everyone thinks we are as planet 7 and 4 are mars and uranus.. the 10 /10 planet of earth is also uranus the 4 is mars and its 10?10 connect is saturn thus we must be near satern...go look at the son tommorow it is larger and you can almost see into it in late afternoon...roulette...add all numbers from 1 to 36 in this # box the center will be 74 and if you ad up each row you get 4 rows at 222=74+74+74=222..thus 2 croses t+x=1776..thus 2010 was the end of the cycle eleninin X1 1X OR X 11 X =11:00=GAME OVER 00 ARE THE EGGS OF BIRTH WHEN 11 CALLS IN THE EGGS GAMES COME TO A CLOSE THUS 7+4=11...SAM SPIRIT ANGEL MAN =33 ANOTHER NUMBER OF CHRIST....GOD IS ONE HE WON ONE WINS WON AND IS ONE YO ELEV.....

Hey Iamsoandso you have a ..... buddy for your ,,,,

lol that made me smile. God bless both of you welcome to cc chat, Mrtacpans

though I have to admit not to be a big fan of numerology

 

[truthfull]

I don't get what you're trying to get at with this. What does Moses saying "Here I am" have to do with it?

Jesus was saying "Before Abraham was, I existed."

because God said; I AM THAT I AM''.
today people say I AM is the name of God

and because Jesus said : before Abraham was born, I am''. some people say this means he is God because he used the (name) I AM .

when moses said ;'' Here I AM ''. (is the meaning of I AM in this phrase the name of God or not) ?

I agree with you that Jesus ment that he existed before Abraham.

 

[AnandaHya]

As everyone is well aware, we have cult member's among us.

Their tactic's are simple, they attempt to discredit Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is God. Jesus Christ is the only way a person can be Saved.

Another tactic they use is to discredit the Bible. The Bible and the Bible alone in it's entirety is the Word of God.
The Bible is complete and does not require any augmentation. No teaching's outside of the Bible (period).

Cult member's, like wolves operate in pack's. They realize that if they can separate a person from Jesus Christ and the Bible, that they can deceive them.
Once a person is deceived sufficiently, they will indoctrinate the person with distortions found in other books.

I applaud Christian Chat.com for allowing these wolves to roam freely because this is exactly how the world operates. If Believer's are sheltered, they become weak. Notice Jesus did not destroy the scribe's and pharisee's. In Jesus day the scribes and pharisee's were part of the landscape, an integral part of everyday life.

So Brother's and Sister's who know the Truth, don't ever become weary of defending the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We were born for this.

Rule 1 in the cult handbook: when opposed preach "acceptance" and "tolerance" as fake variance of Christian charity and "love" affirm post modern beliefs in affirming nothing and accepting everything.

I was listening to Luther's book on "the Bondage of the Will" and this quote comes to mind.

I consider, (as in courtesy bound,) that these things are asserted by you from a benevolent mind, as being a lover of peace. But if any one else had asserted them, I should, perhaps, have attacked him in my accustomed manner. But, however, I must not even allow you, though so very good in your intentions, to err in this opinion. For not to delight in assertions, is not the character of the Christian mind: nay, he must delight in assertions, or he is not a Christian. But, (that we may not be mistaken in terms) by assertion, I mean a constant adhering, affirming, confessing, defending, and invincibly persevering. Nor do I believe the term signifies any thing else, either among the Latins, or as it is used by us at this day. And moreover, I speak concerning the asserting of those things, which are delivered to us from above in the Holy Scriptures. Were it not so, we should want neither Erasmus nor any other instructor to teach us, that, in things doubtful, useless, or unnecessary; assertions, contentions, and strivings, would be not only absurd, but impious: and Paul condemns such in more places than one. Nor do you, I believe, speak of these things, unless, as a ridiculous orator, you wish to take up one subject, and go on with another, as the Roman Emperor did with his Turbot; or, with the madness of a wicked writer, you wish to contend, that the article concerning "Free-will" is doubtful, or not necessary.

Be skeptics and academics far from us Christians; but be there with us assertors twofold more determined than the stoics themselves. How often does the apostle Paul require that assurance of faith; that is, that most certain, and most firm assertion of Conscience, calling it (Rom. x. 10), confession, "With the mouth confession is made unto salvation?" And Christ also saith, "Whosoever confesseth Me before men, him will I confess before My Father." (Matt. x. 32.) Peter commands us to "give a reason of the hope" that is in us. (1 Pet. iii. 15.) But why should I dwell upon this; nothing is more known and more general among Christians than assertions. Take away assertions, and you take away Christianity. Nay, the Holy Spirit is given unto them from heaven, that He may glorify Christ, and confess Him even unto death; unless this be not to assert—to die for confession and assertion. In a word, the Spirit so asserts, that He comes upon the whole world and reproves them of sin (John xvi. 8) thus, as it were, provoking to battle. And Paul enjoins Timothy to reprove, and to be instant out of season. (2 Tim. iv. 2.) But how ludicrous to me would be that reprover, who should neither really believe that himself, of which he reproved, nor constantly assert it!—

Martin Luther

The Bondage of the Will

 

[TheAristocat]

Jesus Christ prayed to God, his father, who Jesus plainly said was superior to him.

Even that you could address through philosophy. What we do know is that Jesus was with God in the beginning and that he was God. We know he called himself one with God, we know he was perfect, we know he was the only begotten of God (and the word "only" here implies a single occurrence - never before applying to another man), there is evidence that his spirit is God's spirit, we know he allowed others to worship him rather than correcting them, we know he was called God or at least some form of Elohim, we know that God walked in the Garden of Eden (a human action, so we can assume that he had a form resembling human form), we know that his form is the form of man and that we were in fact made in his image, we know that he visited Abraham in the form of a man and we know that Christ is our husband even though God is also said to be our husband. And to address the issue in this post directly:

God is greater than a small whisper, God is greater than a dove (the form chosen by the Holy Spirit), God is greater than a pillar of cloud or fire, etc. But all of those manifestations of God represented God's being and were more closely tied to him than any human being has ever been. When Christ said that God was greater than him, he could have easily been saying that God was greater than his flesh - which would be true. But I believe Christ's spirit was God.

 

[truthfull]

Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

the

 

[truthfull]

the prophet said what people will call him

 

[truthfull]

We know he called himself one with God.

if we read further we know that Jesus said let the people be one as we are one (this must be one in unity or one in mission).

we know that Jesus said : let me be in them as You are in me. for you this probably means that jesus is in you?

we know that its written in Ezechial , that God will put his spirit in the people of the new covenant, but this doesnt make you God
people call this spirit Holy Ghost, but its the spirit of God

do you remeber that Gods spirit went over the earth and saw that it was good in Genesis?
do you remember that God spirit was blew in the nose of Adam the first man?

for what I have read this is my conclussion

 

[shroom2]

Even that you could address through philosophy. What we do know is that Jesus was with God in the beginning

In foreknowledge only. His beginning was in the womb of Mary, as the bible states (Matt 1:18, "birth" is gennēsis, or beginning).

and that he was God.

No, he was, and still is, the Son of God.

We know he called himself one with God, we know he was perfect, we know he was the only begotten of God (and the word "only" here implies a single occurrence - never before applying to another man), there is evidence that his spirit is God's spirit,

All true

we know he allowed others to worship him rather than correcting them, we know he was called God or at least some form of Elohim,

Yes, but he was never called God, as in the creator.

we know that God walked in the Garden of Eden (a human action, so we can assume that he had a form resembling human form),

Yes, God, who is spirit, came into concretion. he did that several times in the OT.

we know that his form is the form of man

If you are referring to God, He is spirit. When he came into concretion, it was as a man. If you are referring to Christ, he was a man. And still is.

and that we were in fact made in his image,

God is spirit. He can come into concretion in a human form. The image of God we are created in is the ability to think, to reason, to express emotion, to love, to make decisions.

we know that he visited Abraham in the form of a man and we know that Christ is our husband even though God is also said to be our husband. And to address the issue in this post directly:

God is greater than a small whisper, God is greater than a dove (the form chosen by the Holy Spirit), God is greater than a pillar of cloud or fire, etc. But all of those manifestations of God represented God's being and were more closely tied to him than any human being has ever been. When Christ said that God was greater than him, he could have easily been saying that God was greater than his flesh - which would be true. But I believe Christ's spirit was God.

The bible does not say "Christ's spirit was God". Holy spirit -from- God descended on Jesus when he was baptized. When we act on Romans 10:9, we also receive holy spirit from God. Holy spirit is spiritual power from God. It is not the "third person of the trinity", a non-scriptural phrase.

 

[truthfull]

When Christ said that God was greater than him, he could have easily been saying that God was greater than his flesh - which would be true. But I believe Christ's spirit was God.

a dangerous idea (christ spirit was God) lets ask the Gospel:

math 27:46
Around the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, saying "Eli Eli lama sabachthani?" which is, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

luke 23:46
And speaking in a loud voice, Jesus said, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit".

luke 23:34
Then Jesus said, "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".


every one who wants to think logical can see why I dissagree with Thearistocat

everything in the creation we know is logical thats why we can research everything because our creator has made it logical

 

[TheAristocat]

a dangerous idea (christ spirit was God) lets ask the Gospel:

math 27:46
Around the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, saying "Eli Eli lama sabachthani?" which is, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

luke 23:46
And speaking in a loud voice, Jesus said, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit".

luke 23:34
Then Jesus said, "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".


every one who wants to think logical can see why I dissagree with Thearistocat

everything in the creation we know is logical thats why we can research everything because our creator has made it logical

If Christ is said to be with God and is said to be God, I don't think it is dangerous to conclude that his spirit is God. Let's look at John 14:26:

But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Here God seems to be sending God. Cannot Jesus (God) then send God? Of course you could conclude that the Holy Spirit is not God then, but I think such a position would only multiply errors.

 

[truthfull]

The books written by Paul are as authoritative as the gospels, and more relevant to Christians than the gospels are.

first there is only one Gospel of Jesus, and this is written by 4 people According to John,Math etc..

romans 2:16
paul said: according to my gospel.

"Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission,. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church. 1 corint 14:34

when Jesus was on earth he did not told the asking woman to go and ask youre husband.

example: the woman asking for living water and the right place to worship
the canaanite woman asking for help

 

[truthfull]

Here God seems to be sending God. Cannot Jesus (God) then send God? Of course you could conclude that the Holy Spirit is not God then, but I think such a position would only multiply errors.

Gods spirit is greater than our spirit and His spirit is Holy
in ezechiel it is written that God said that He would pour out his spirit unto His people, this doesnt mean people will be God, or do you think otherwise?

I will look up the exact verse and citation and put it here

 

[TheAristocat]

Gods spirit is greater than our spirit and His spirit is Holy
in ezechiel it is written that God said that He would pour out his spirit unto His people, this doesnt mean people will be God, or do you think otherwise?

I will look up the exact verse and citation and put it here

I think that particular passage would then bolster my point of view, because it talks about God pouring out his spirit again. My post was about God being able to dispense his spirit - not about the differences between our spirits and God's spirit. I think we both agree that God's spirit is probably greater than our spirits, and we can receive the Holy Spirit. Think of it this way: when there was a temple I think God was still pouring out his spirit upon people. He was thought to live in the temple, and yet he lived in and with other individuals too.

And to finish with the original point of my post, God can send God, he can pour out God, and so it would follow that he could also commend God to God. I don't see this as polytheism. I see it as a complex nature, but as the most logical conclusion. I don't necessarily believe in the Trinity, but I do believe Christ's spirit is the Holy Spirit and that the Holy Spirit is God.

Also of interest is that one of the names Jesus was going to be known by was "Counselor". I think Jesus called the Holy Spirit the Counselor.

 

[TheAristocat]

I think that particular passage would then bolster my point of view, because it talks about God pouring out his spirit again. My post was about God being able to dispense his spirit - not about the differences between our spirits and God's spirit. I think we both agree that God's spirit is probably greater than our spirits, and we can receive the Holy Spirit. Think of it this way: when there was a temple I think God was still pouring out his spirit upon people. He was thought to live in the temple, and yet he lived in and with other individuals too.

And to finish with the original point of my post, God can send God, he can pour out God, and so it would follow that he could also commend God to God. I don't see this as polytheism. I see it as a complex nature, but as the most logical conclusion. I don't necessarily believe in the Trinity, but I do believe Christ's spirit is the Holy Spirit and that the Holy Spirit is God.

Also of interest is that one of the names Jesus was going to be known by was "Counselor". I think Jesus called the Holy Spirit the Counselor.

To add one more thing to this post, compare John 14:16 and 1 John 2:1.

John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever

1 John 2:1 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.

The word advocate is the same word used of the Holy Spirit as is used of Christ, and it is also sometimes translated as counselor and sometimes as comforter. If one is a counselor then the other is a counselor. If one is a comforter then the other is a comforter. And I believe that in spirit they are one and the same.

The only difference between them seems to be the flesh.

 

[AnandaHya]

ah it is a stumbling block and foolish to those who are perishing but for the brethren who still read this here are the verses that have been twisted and mangled so horribly. read the whole BIBLE in CONTEXT and you will see that the SPIRIT of GOD that is sent out to the world is the SPIRIT of the SON JESUS CHRIST because JESUS IS GOD. He is called MIGHTY GOD, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace, Immanuel because HE is GOD among us. GOD incarnate. The WORD made Flesh to dwell among men.

We on the other hand are NOT, though we may be annointed by the Holy Spirit. OUR Spirit is NOT the Holy Spirit but JESUS is and was even when He was incarnated Man. He showed us what it was to live an acceptable Year to the Lord. We are to proclaim ourselves the CHILDREN of GOD not GODS ourselves. that is why JESUS said HE is the SON of God though He is and was GOD clothed in HUMAN Flesh.

what's that quote about in season and out of season....sigh....


Ezekiel 11:19
Then I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within them, and take the stony heart out of their flesh, and give them a heart of flesh,

Ezekiel 18:31
Cast away from you all the transgressions which you have committed, and get yourselves a new heart and a new spirit. For why should you die, O house of Israel?

Ezekiel 36:26
I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.

Acts 2:17
‘ And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams.

Galatians 4:6
And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!”

Though Solomon and Adam might have been called son by God they were not Christ, do you know why?

They were created in the IMAGE of God. JESUS on the other hand is the WORD made Flesh.

In Heaven they are ONE, on Earth they agree as ONE. If you can not understand Earthly things how can you hope to understand spiritual and Heavenly things?

Did you not know that God breathed life into animals as well? Read Genesis and see for yourself. However Plants did not get the breathe of the Life.

1 John 5:6-8
New King James Version (NKJV)
6 This is He who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ; not only by water, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness on earth:[a] the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.

so an little English question: what is the difference between the verbs ARE and AGREE?

 

[truthfull]

I only follow and trust on the Gospel of Jesus.
I read the letters of paul and john and peter but I dont see them as the Gospel of Jesus our Lord and Saviour

Ezekiel 11:19

Then I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within them, and take the stony heart out of their flesh, and give them a heart of flesh,

choose to take this litteral or symbolical, but what you choose have to be considerd for the following verses.

thearistocat you have a strong argument, but if I understand you that God is sending God (holy spirit) to live in us ?

do you really believe that God is inside those rapists within the catholic church ? these priest were al baptised, not?
do you really think witch-burning, the inquisition was inspired by the holy ghost?

taking this litteral will confuse with youre reality, not?

there are many verses where God and Jesus spoke symbolical for the children so that they could understand. ( in those days people werent so educated with vocabulary/words as today).

if Jesus says : I am the branch you are the vine. are you not intelligent enough to know this is symbolical?

 

[AnandaHya]

I only follow and trust on the Gospel of Jesus. no you don't for they testify of His divinity which you deny.

I read the letters of paul and john and peter but I dont see them as the Gospel of Jesus our Lord and Saviour

and that would be why you are in your situation, you pick and choose scripture that fit your taste and reject those you do not like. You have built your own "god" whom you worship, who is NOT Jesus, who is NOT the God of the Bible but of your own creation.

Jesus is the WORD, in HEAVEN the Father, the WORD and the Spirit ARE one.

why would you accept the Gospel of John and not the Letter of John?

1 John 5:7
For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. 4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend[a] it.

by your words you have shown you accept neither but are in darkness still.

 

[truthfull]

the gospel is not of john but according to john, I follow the God told about in the Gospel, this is not my own creation


the letters are indeed of John spoken by john

if God Himself would have told you that not al scripture are to trust, would you believe Him?

jeremia 8:8


john 15:4 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

john 17: 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

now you can read in full context, are all christians ONE in person or in mission?

 

[truthfull]

I will stop debating now, the point has been made

my advice to my brothers and sisters in faith, do not ignore the clear and simple things Jesus told.
and read the bible as the way it is written not the way you want it to be, let the letters of Paul be the letters and words of Paul and let the Gospel of Jesus be of Jesus


math 24:14 and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world and then the end shall come''

mark 1:1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

 

[AnandaHya]

the gospel is not of john but according to john, I follow the God told about in the Gospel, this is not my own creation


the letters are indeed of John spoken by john

if God Himself would have told you that not al scripture are to trust, would you believe Him?

jeremia 8:8


john 15:4 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

john 17: 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

now you can read in full context, are all christians ONE in person or in mission?

One in Person because we are the body of Christ and we each have a different mission with different spiritual gifts to fulfill those missions. Some are teachers, some evangelist, some pastors, some helpers, some administration, some are called to care for the young, some have placed on their heart concern for the elderly, some are lead to study and scholarship, some are given extraordinary faith, some are given gifts of prophecy, some healing both spiritual and physical. These are all various and differing missions but all are done for the glory of God.

Christ mission involved dying on the cross for the remission of sins, can you say yours is the same?

Christ is the HEAD.

Ephesians 4:14-16
New King James Version (NKJV)
14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.

we (who are in Christ) are the body and are to grow and edify one another in love. However false doctrine will sever certain members from the Head by deny Jesus Christ is God incarnate.

Satan always attacks the children and the babes who are still upon the milk by deny certain passages and starving their souls for EVERY WORD spoken by God through His prophets are useful. not just the ones that fit into a manmade construct of false holiness. no matter how many Bible terms or verses Satan and his minions quote, it does not change the WORD or God's Truth.

2 Timothy 3
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

oh wait I forgot you cut that part out of your faith in your made up god that you would worship.