The Vines Greek dictionaries definition of saving faith.

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GWH said:
This is what is said about faith in Matthew:

Matt. 8:10,13,26, 9:22, 29, 14:31, 15:28, 16:8, 13-18, 17:17, 20, 18:6, 21:21-22, 32, 22:37-40, 42, 24:10-14, 45, 26:13, 28:16-20.
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Mt. 8: 26, 9:22, 29, 14:31, 15:28, 16:8, are all pistis, a noun, meaning a firm conviction.

Mt. 8:13, 18:6, 21:22, 32, are all pisteuo. Mistranslated when they used the words believe, believer, and believing. Pisteuo is defined in the Vines Expository dictionary for NT words as, "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender," depending on the context. 248 times.

The other verses you put up have neither pistis or pisteuo. 25: 45 uses "faithful", which is a different word. 4103 pistos, meaning trustful or trustworthy.
 
Watchman22 said:
Mt. 8: 26, 9:22, 29, 14:31, 15:28, 16:8, are all pistis, a noun, meaning a firm conviction.

Mt. 8:13, 18:6, 21:22, 32, are all pisteuo. Mistranslated when they used the words believe, believer, and believing. Pisteuo is defined in the Vines Expository dictionary for NT words as, "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender," depending on the context. 248 times.

The other verses you put up have neither pistis or pisteuo. 25: 45 uses "faithful", which is a different word. 4103 pistos, meaning trustful or trustworthy.
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Vines should publish an expository translation of the NT.
In the meantime, we need to understand the definition of "synonym".
 
GWH said:
Vines should publish an expository translation of the NT.
In the meantime, we need to understand the definition of "synonym".
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And there's always that little pesky building and entirely new path on the back of the "synonym" thing we need to watch out for. Someone was sleeping.
 
Watchman22 said:
And there's always that little pesky building and entirely new path on the back of the "synonym" thing we need to watch out for. Someone was sleeping.
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Synonyms add nuance and meaning to words as does context.
Surely Vines must consider synonyms and context when arriving at a definition!
 
GWH said:
Synonyms add nuance and meaning to words as does context.
Surely Vines must consider synonyms and context when arriving at a definition!
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There's always one option your not considering. Having the experience. That trumps context.
 
FlyingDove said:
We all have heard the warnings of judging others
Matt 7:1-4
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The word "judge" in Mt.7:1-4 is krino in the Greek. And krino is an eternal condemnation judgment. 2919 in your Strongs. I hope you can see I'm not making an eternal condemnation judgment of you or anyone else.

The judgment that I'm doing is "anakrino" 350 in your Strongs. It means investigate, interrogate, and determine. Best understood in 1Cor. 2:15.
 
Watchman22 said:
I make sure every i is dotted and every t is crossed. Every fact is just that a fact.

But that statement was just my opinion.
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Okay, well you know my opinion has a holistic hermeneutic (harmonization/both-and synthesis)
that takes into account original languages, context, synonyms and experience to arrive at the best meaning of a passage.
 
GWH said:
Okay, well you know my opinion has a holistic hermeneutic (harmonization/both-and synthesis)
that takes into account original languages, context, synonyms and experience to arrive at the best meaning of a passage.
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I think the most important word there is experience, but with the word "the" in front of it. Without "the experience" it will always just remain an opinion. Even if it's an educated one.
 
Watchman22 said:
I think the most important word there is experience, but with the word "the" in front of it. Without "the experience" it will always just remain an opinion. Even if it's an educated one.
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There is no way to avoid it being an opinion, no matter how it is modified.
We all walk by faith; no one is an infallible pope, but that is okay--sufficient for salvation.
Yay!
 
GWH said:
There is no way to avoid it being an opinion, no matter how it is modified.
We all walk by faith; no one is an infallible pope, but that is okay--sufficient for salvation.
Yay!
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Do we all walk by faith?

Do we all walk by a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender?
 
GWH said:
There is no way to avoid it being an opinion, no matter how it is modified.
We all walk by faith; no one is an infallible pope, but that is okay--sufficient for salvation.
Yay!
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I pulled this off another thread. This is a common understanding of what called out ones think is faith.

"because we who believe in Jesus Christ for salvation have the Holy Spirit within us."
 
Watchman22 said:
I pulled this off another thread. This is a common understanding of what called out ones think is faith.

"because we who believe in Jesus Christ for salvation have the Holy Spirit within us."
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Yes, that appears to be based on Rom. 8:1-14, which teaches that surrendering to Jesus as Messiah and Lord (Acts 16:31)
begins the walk by faith (2Cor. 5:7).

Both-and, Watchman; think synonymously.
Rightly dividing GW promotes one faith/unity.
 
GWH said:
Yes, that appears to be based on Rom. 8:1-14, which teaches that surrendering to Jesus as Messiah and Lord (Acts 16:31)
begins the walk by faith (2Cor. 5:7).

Both-and, Watchman; think synonymously.
Rightly dividing GW promotes one faith/unity.
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Look at how ive been treated in here GHW. It's been that way for 25 years in sites like this.
Does that look synonymous to you?

Pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT. There's only 3 possible choices or elements to define Pisteuo.
1) a firm conviction.
2) a personal surrender to Him.
3) a life inspired by such surrender.

None of these choices are just "believing" in Jesus Christ.

Because once they make "believing" their foundational principle, they quickly make Gods word their object of faith, instead of God Himself.

And then , because "believing" is simply a mental ascent, they double and triple down that any work or effort associated with faith or pisteuo is works salvation. Insinuating "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender " is a works base salvation.

They say these works are acceptable after they supposedly receive His Spirit. But to fulfill pisteuo in its purest form before that infilling is heresy. Jumping back to believing only to receive the Holy spirit.

It's a mess, I've never been able to figure out if this is Gods mess, keeping people out, or satans mess, creating the false sense of complacency. Aka, the wide path.
 
Watchman22 said:
Look at how ive been treated in here GHW. It's been that way for 25 years in sites like this.
Does that look synonymous to you?

Pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT. There's only 3 possible choices or elements to define Pisteuo.
1) a firm conviction.
2) a personal surrender to Him.
3) a life inspired by such surrender.

None of these choices are just "believing" in Jesus Christ.

Because once they make "believing" their foundational principle, they quickly make Gods word their object of faith, instead of God Himself.

And then , because "believing" is simply a mental ascent, they double and triple down that any work or effort associated with faith or pisteuo is works salvation. Insinuating "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender " is a works base salvation.

They say these works are acceptable after they supposedly receive His Spirit. But to fulfill pisteuo in its purest form before that infilling is heresy. Jumping back to believing only to receive the Holy spirit.

It's a mess, I've never been able to figure out if this is Gods mess, keeping people out, or satans mess, creating the false sense of complacency. Aka, the wide path.
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Hey W-man, I have been treated a lot worse on CC than you have.
I was even kicked out of one site and threatened with being kicked out of this one.

I affirm your input to understanding Scripture by citing Vine's, and I also affirm other input,
viewing my gift and task as that of harmonizing various inputs to learn the best/whole meaning.

I agree the best understanding of pisteuo combines commitment at conversion with lifelong faithfulness.
I also agree it's a mess to get folks to agree.
(Peace out emoji)
 
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GWH said:
Hey W-man, I have been treated a lot worse on CC than you have.
I was even kicked out of one site and threatened with being kicked out of this one.

I affirm your input to understanding Scripture by citing Vine's, and I also affirm other input,
viewing my gift and task as that of harmonizing various inputs to learn the best/whole meaning.

I agree the best understanding of pisteuo combines commitment at conversion with lifelong faithfulness.
I also agree it's a mess to get folks to agree.
(Peace out emoji)
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Lol. Then that means you've probably crossed paths with marraine and rosemary. Back around 2000 they were like human buzzsaws. I went round and round with them until they put me in the false doctrine forum.

I ran into rosemary around 2013 and she apologized for how they treated me. But I learned alot about how to navigate these kinds of sites from them. Trial by fire. They seem to have gone underground. Marraine went by the nick graphanny back then.

I don't agree with much of their understandings, but props to being what I think are some of the pioneers of Christian discussion forums.
 
Watchman22 said:
Lol. Then that means you've probably crossed paths with marraine and rosemary. Back around 2000 they were like human buzzsaws. I went round and round with them until they put me in the false doctrine forum.

I ran into rosemary around 2013 and she apologized for how they treated me. But I learned alot about how to navigate these kinds of sites from them. Trial by fire. They seem to have gone underground. Marraine went by the nick graphanny back then.

I don't agree with much of their understandings, but props to being what I think are some of the pioneers of Christian discussion forums.
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No, not them--I don't even see them listed as members.
My buzzsaws have been since joining in October of 2024,
and I also learned how to handle animosity from tulipists, etal,
mainly by considering the source, but I amend the way I word things,
most recently by defining karma as reaping the just consequence of sin
with reference to Romans 2:5-15, because some were offended by use of the Hindu term,
despite me pointing out that it can be a bridge to witnessing to Hindus,
comparable to how Paul witnessed to the polytheist Athenians in Acts 17:22-31.
 
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