The Sin Nature is spiritual lust, not flesh and blood.

[ATG]

Surprised, in myself, and hear truth flow through you, thank you
I am seeing new in this truth you posted of. Thank you, taking all to Daddy, PaPa, Father in charge.
I hear this: When Adam and Eve sinned, Chose to not believe God they would die if ate from that one particular tree. Rather as said by the Serpent to them, they would be like God, aware of good and bad, yet saw they are as good as dead as soon as Adam the first ate with Eve. So the temptation was to be God themselves as Satan wanted in Isaiah 14:12. yet, satan did not see, man would be as if God themselves and not choose Satan who wanted to lead.

Then and now, Being a God themselves, ourselves (like God, yet not God) to choose right or wrong to themselves, above God. Therefore, whatever they choose to do is righteous to themselves.
Lord God, Father of risen Son Jesus for me, you take it all, have and use from men whatever you want, I am listening to your voice over the world crowd.
Now listening, thank you

Several years ago, someone convinced me of Jesus' natural body, by a simple question: How can Jesus be an example to us, if He did not have the same flesh and blood as us. He came in the flesh of a superman, not of man. Demigods may be an example of great deeds, but not an example to people of natural bodies to do the same...

God did not send a superChrist to the world, in order to show how to do great things with a supernatural body:

Heb 2:16
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Heb 2:17
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

Jesus came in the same natural flesh of the seed of David and Abraham, by the womb of Mary. He is therefore more than able to help us also overcome sinning with the flesh as He did.

Jhn 17:2
As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Jesus was not a benevolent superhero with power over all natural flesh, by a body of supernatural making...That would indeed be justification for people with natural bodies not to walk as He walked. Otherwise, it's only a lie with built in excuse to continue walking after the flesh.

 

[Dino246]

I guess he liked the comaraderie. Just can't let go.

ATG probably has me on Ignore so he doesn’t see my comment.

 

[Dino246]

It's called lust of the heart. The soul lusts for the flesh, not the flesh against the soul. All the flesh longs for is natural food, drink, work, rest, and sleep.

The body only obeys the spirit whether to do good or evil.

The natural seed has no lust in it to sin. The natural tongue has no lust in it to sin. The third middle finger has no lust in it to sin.

As you questioned my rationale, I’m clarifying.

Where do you get these ideas:

- The body only obeys the spirit
- the natural seed has no lust in it
- The soul lists for the flesh

???

 

[ATG]

Thanks for posting His word .. but so many of these scriptures have nothing to do with sin nature is spiritual lust, not flesh and blood. Its called out of context.
.

Na-ah is meaningless. If you can show how the comments are wrong, I'd be glad to look at it. Otherwise, they're good.

 

[ATG]

So if we have a new spirit .. you saying that new spirit can sin can fall..again?

God's warning that we die to Him by transgression, has not changed.

Mal 3:6
For I am the LORD, I change not:

Eze 18:20
The soul that sinneth, it shall die.

The soul that is sinning still dies, whether naming Christ or not.

Eze 3:20
Again, When a righteous man doth turn from his righteousness, and commit iniquity, and I lay a stumblingblock before him, he shall die: because thou hast not given him warning, he shall die in his sin, and his righteousness which he hath done shall not be remembered;

Eze 18:21
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

Even as the old life of sin is forgotten by God, by turning to His goodness, so is our life of righteousness forgotten by God, if we turn to the world's evil.

All Christians most certainly are willing to believe the former, but some refuse to believe the latter.

2Pe 2:20
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

Heb 10:35
Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward. For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.

1 Cor 9: 26
I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

 

[pinebeach]

As you questioned my rationale, I’m clarifying.

Where do you get these ideas:

- The body only obeys the spirit
- the natural seed has no lust in it
- The soul lists for the flesh

???

Still, anyone can see when someone is banned, so..... Posts are getting a little strange even from him

 

[ATG]

Were born again born from above. As Paul or the sweet holy Spirit in us forever said..

If we walk after the Spirit, and not after the flesh.

The Holy Spirit is the seal of our inheritance, not held captive by us, while doing evil.

Once again, all Christians are more than willing to receive the Spirit by faith all at once, and yet refuse the Spirit is free to depart from us just as quickly by transgression.

The Spirit of grace is not a bound house slave, who must continually clean up after filthy hearts.

Rev 3:20
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

If we repent of our unrighteousness and open the door to Jesus' knocking, He enters immediately to sup with us. He also exits immediately to leave us to our own sinning alone.

Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Gal 6:7
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting…For there is no respect of persons with God.

He comes and goes by the same door, whether for the good within, or because of the evil being done.

 

[ATG]

its no longer I that sin but sin that is in me.

Romans 7 double heartedness toward God, is not a Christian instruction manual on how to do good and evil for life.

The Holy Spirit does not dwell in any heart of lust and sin. No man can have both Jesus and sin in them. Even has Jesus has no sin in Him nor His body:

1Jo 3:5
And ye know that He was manifested to take away our sins; and in Him is no sin.

Rom 11:16
For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.

No it cannot sin fall again. It is not (us) from this world. This world is no longer our home.

He that is sinning with the world is servant of the world and enemy of God.

Jhn 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever is committing sin is the servant of sin.

1Jo 3:8
He that is committing sin is of the devil; for the devil is sinning from the beginning.

No one is committing sin of the devil and also serving Jesus Christ:

Mat 6:24
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and sin.

This world is no person's home: After this life we are all judged by our works, whether having done good unto life, or evil unto death.

Rom 2:3
And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?...For there is no respect of persons with God.

1 Peter {1:15}
Be ye holy, for I am holy. And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judges according to every man’s work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

 

[homwardbound]

Several years ago, someone convinced me of Jesus' natural body, by a simple question: How can Jesus be an example to us, if He did not have the same flesh and blood as us. He came in the flesh of a superman, not of man. Demigods may be an example of great deeds, but not an example to people of natural bodies to do the same...

God did not send a superChrist to the world, in order to show how to do great things with a supernatural body:

Heb 2:16
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Heb 2:17
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

Jesus came in the same natural flesh of the seed of David and Abraham, by the womb of Mary. He is therefore more than able to help us also overcome sinning with the flesh as He did.

Jhn 17:2
As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Jesus was not a benevolent superhero with power over all natural flesh, by a body of supernatural making...That would indeed be justification for people with natural bodies not to walk as He walked. Otherwise, it's only a lie with built in excuse to continue walking after the flesh.

He humbled himself to not be better than anyone else. He only did as led to do by Father for us to get that and do the same in the same love, mercy and Truth John 13:34. time to respond in the same love, mercy and truth given you to all. If you sincerely believe God over any human flesh, including yourself, which I see you do, thanking g God not me

 

[ATG]

If we are to believe the word of God then "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me." "surely I was brought forth in iniquity. I was sinful when my mother conceived me"

If we are willing to believe that Jesus Christ is the Maker of sinful people, then all people would have excuse for sinning against God.

Jhn 1:2
The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made…That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Rev 4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Hebrews{13:8}
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

But those who do believe the Scripture, that Jesus Christ has not changed, and continues the same creating all men good with His light. Then the Scripture by David, says that after the transgression and unrepentance of Adam and Eve, all men created good by Christ, are now born into a world of sin and iniquity, rather than the garden of Eden.

Not because Jesus Christ makes the world sinful, but because men that repent not, make the world sinful by their own continued sinning...Especially them that are sinning in the name of Christ.

2Ti 2:19
Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

We can all make Gods word say what we want when we put many scripturas together from different books/letters and tada..

True. Such as I was born in sin, and so I am living in sin. Not because I am evil, but the evil Christ that made me this way: "It's not my fault God made me this way..."

And some just say what they want without Scripture.

Then if someone questions it.. yeah its not the the person posting.... no no.. they right the one that simply questions it.

Anyone can question anything. But without showing error in what is said from Scripture, then it's just empty questioning.

Blade said:
Thanks for posting His word .. but so many of these scriptures have nothing to do with sin nature is spiritual lust, not flesh and blood. Its called out of context.

And if someone says another is wrong, then it's an accusation not a question. The thanks for posting Scripture is good. The accusation is no good, but a meaningless na-ah.

So if we make a statement like this and just post this verse that verse.. explain how each of those verses show what your saying they show. Because many of them have nothing to do with this.

The how is already shown in the Scriptures and comments. The conclusion they have nothing to do with each other, is a meaningless comment.

 

[ATG]

Yeah, you wouldn't want to let what God says in His Word to get in the way of what you believe.

You're way to putting things is so simple, that even the unbelievers know what your talking about. At least the ones taking responsibility for their actions and lives.

Only by a Faith Alone ideology, can anyone naming Christ argue that "It's may body's fault" and "God made me this way" .

IN Rev 17, I believe John was looking at all the abundant supplemental lies, that go along with justifying oneself by their Faith Alone. And that he was just in awe of how anyone could possibly believe, that they got all that stuff from him and the other prophets and apostles.

...and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

justifying oneself by their Faith Alone.

Funny how you put that into the same sentence. Faith alone is rather the exact opposite of one justifying oneself. Faith alone is faith in being justified by His works and not our own. You’re the one justifying yourself with your own works.

 

[pinebeach]

DallasMan said:
Yeah, you wouldn't want to let what God says in His Word to get in the way of what you believe.

ATG
You're way to putting things is so simple, that even the unbelievers know what your talking about. At least the ones taking responsibility for their actions and lives.

SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ATG HE IS TALKING TO A PERSON THAT HAS BEEN BANNED.

 

[ATG]

You seem to assume a lot about what others think.

It's not about what you think, but about what you believe. Unless of course what you believe, is only what you think. Which is what Faith Alone Christians do: They only believe what they think.

And likewise, only someone that believes what they think, would assume everyone else does the same.

I never mentioned the word angel and you went straight to assuming I believed He was born of an angel or something.

And again, what you fail to understand is what God says about certain beliefs. And, If someone has such a belief, then God reveals what they are ignorantly thinking.

Heb 2:16
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren.

Heb 1-2 rebukes the lie that Jesus Christ came in the supernatural flesh of angels, and not the same flesh of Abraham and his brothers by Mary and Joseph. Anyone that believes He came in any other kind of supernatural flesh, then God says they think He came in the flesh of angels.

Heb 1-2 is specifically rebuking an old Jewish fable about Messiah only coming in supernatural flesh and pure blood.

The pagans believed the same thing of their own god-born heroes and demigods. Their works were so powerful, that their bodies must have been supernatural, and not the same as other 'low-born' men and women. Such as Herakles and Achilles.

Which is likewise the same for the Christian fable; That Jesus Christ did not come as other men with 'lowlier bodies', than that of angels.

Psa 8:4
What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels,

But rather because His works were so great of God, and especially that He sinned not, He must have come in a supernatural body of heroes, demigods, and angels.

And yet, Jesus Christ did come in the same lowly natural flesh and blood of all men on earth:

Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Just because someone is ignorant of the nature of what they want to believe, they are still believing in old Jewish fables and pagan deism: Christ comes in a heavenly body with nature of angels, not in any earthy natural body of all other men and women.

And in this case, having quoted the Scriptures several times, someone must ignore what God says, in order to continue believing in an old amazing lie of fabulous demigods and false christs...

 

[ATG]

It’s kinda the same way you assume anyone who says they are saved by their faith alone believes they can live however they want.

Right. This is where Faith Aloners are not giving a 'license' to sin, just because they have a Faith Alone that justifies them, apart from their works. Which includes doing unrighteousness.

Honest answers to honest questions will show whether this is publicity or not: You can be justified by your Faith Alone apart from your unrighteous works, but it's not a license to sin.

1. Does anyone who says they are saved by their faith alone, believe they can live righteously at all times? Or, do they believe they will also do unrighteousness?

2. If the latter, do they also say they are saved by their Faith Alone, while they do unrighteousness? Or, not while sinning?

If the former, then what's the difference between being saved by Faith Alone while doing unrighteousness, and being saved by Faith Alone while living the way you want?

 

[Just_A__Follower]

It's not about what you think, but about what you believe. Unless of course what you believe, is only what you think. Which is what Faith Alone Christians do: They only believe what they think.

And likewise, only someone that believes what they think, would assume everyone else does the same.



And again, what you fail to understand is what God says about certain beliefs. And, If someone has such a belief, then God reveals what they are ignorantly thinking.

Heb 2:16
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren.

Heb 1-2 rebukes the lie that Jesus Christ came in the supernatural flesh of angels, and not the same flesh of Abraham and his brothers by Mary and Joseph. Anyone that believes He came in any other kind of supernatural flesh, then God says they think He came in the flesh of angels.

Heb 1-2 is specifically rebuking an old Jewish fable about Messiah only coming in supernatural flesh and pure blood.

The pagans believed the same thing of their own god-born heroes and demigods. Their works were so powerful, that their bodies must have been supernatural, and not the same as other 'low-born' men and women. Such as Herakles and Achilles.

Which is likewise the same for the Christian fable; That Jesus Christ did not come as other men with 'lowlier bodies', than that of angels.

Psa 8:4
What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels,

But rather because His works were so great of God, and especially that He sinned not, He must have come in a supernatural body of heroes, demigods, and angels.

And yet, Jesus Christ did come in the same lowly natural flesh and blood of all men on earth:

Heb 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Just because someone is ignorant of the nature of what they want to believe, they are still believing in old Jewish fables and pagan deism: Christ comes in a heavenly body with nature of angels, not in any earthy natural body of all other men and women.

And in this case, having quoted the Scriptures several times, someone must ignore what God says, in order to continue believing in an old amazing lie of fabulous demigods and false christs...

Welcome back. I missed you. Did you figure out that the Dallas man got banned yet?

Did you know that one must think before they believe? How is one to believe what they have never thought? Either way you assume to know what everyone BELIEVES.

Did you want to answer the question of: do you believe that Jesus being born of a virgin was only to provide a sign that He was the Messiah?

 

[Toknow]

Where do you get these ideas (because it’s certainly not from the Bible)?

@ATG happens to be correct for two reasons....

1. If we want to understand the flesh as skin...then, yes, the skin cannot sin....
it is the SOUL that CAUSES the skin to sin...skin is dead and is not alive as the soul is and as the spirit is.

2. In the NT by flesh Paul means that which makes us sin...IOW,,,Paul is referring it to the SIN NATURE of man but he's just calling it flesh.

There are different words for this:
CONCUPISCENSE
FLESH
SIN NATURE


It all means the same. that which causes us to sin.
And what causes us to sin?
The sin nature.

Colossians 3:12-15
12 So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and [k]patience; 13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. 14 Beyond all these things put on love, which is [l]the perfect bond of unity. 15 Let the peace of Christ [m]rule in your hearts,



Our "heart" which would actually be our soul,,,affected by our spirit,,,which causes us to be pleasing to God.

Our soul affects our body.
Our spirit affects our soul.

 

[ATG]

Do you believe that the fact He was born of a virgin was only to show a sign that He was the Messiah?

Isa 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Do you require the Lord to say 'only' a sign, in order to mean a sign? And yet, although it's 'only' a sign, it's a truly great and wonderful sign given by the Lord Himself.

Heb 10:5
Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

The Spirit of the Lord prepares a body of flesh from a virgin's natural womb (Like as from a man's natural rib), and the Lord Himself comes down from heaven to dwell therein on earth: God in the flesh of man, dwelling with man.

Jhn 1:14
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Supernatural heroes and demigods do not dwell among men, but only apart and above all men and women of lowly natural bodies.

Like as that great Faith Alone idol, that stands Alone apart and above all works done in the lowly natural body of men and women...

How is it that some Christian mythographers say, that the Second Adam's body was made of supernatural stuff, like as the first Adam, and yet Adam's body was made of the dust of the earth?

Gen 2:5
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Was it heavenly dust? Was his blood also made of that heavenly dew, that King Fu Panda got tired of? Or, perhaps their 'pure' blood was the ichor of the immortal gods?

I personally prefer to stick to classical mythology, and even Marvel's Superhero comics, than to mix it into Jesus Christ come in the flesh of man, and dwelt among men and women full of grace and truth of God. (Not so exciting though to Christian sinners, who prefer to think and imagine by their Faith Alone...)

 

[Dino246]

@ATG happens to be correct for two reasons....

1. If we want to understand the flesh as skin...then, yes, the skin cannot sin....
it is the SOUL that CAUSES the skin to sin...skin is dead and is not alive as the soul is and as the spirit is.

2. In the NT by flesh Paul means that which makes us sin...IOW,,,Paul is referring it to the SIN NATURE of man but he's just calling it flesh.

There are different words for this:
CONCUPISCENSE
FLESH
SIN NATURE


It all means the same. that which causes us to sin.
And what causes us to sin?
The sin nature.

Colossians 3:12-15
12 So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and [k]patience; 13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. 14 Beyond all these things put on love, which is [l]the perfect bond of unity. 15 Let the peace of Christ [m]rule in your hearts,



Our "heart" which would actually be our soul,,,affected by our spirit,,,which causes us to be pleasing to God.

Our soul affects our body.
Our spirit affects our soul.

See my post #63, and ignore the keying error.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

1. Does anyone who says they are saved by their faith alone, believe they can live righteously at all times? Or, do they believe they will also do unrighteousness?

I unlike you don’t assume what millions of other people believe. I will answer for myself. I do not believe a person can become perfectly sinless in this lifetime. And if they tell themselves they are perfectly sinless, they are simply proving themselves to be a liar that is full of pride. If God does not audibly tell you everyday that you are perfect, then that is self righteousness which is pride. Only God can assess one to be perfectly righteous.

Everyone I know that says they are saved by faith alone do not just live however they want. They have put their faith in Christ and their desires have changed to do good. Are there those that claim to be Christians and live however they want? Of course. They are called hypocrites. I personally prefer the phrase love but to each his own.

I would be very interested in your definition of sin.