Loss of salvation???

[Genez]

Therefore consider carefully how you listen.
Whoever has will be given more;
whoever does not have,
even what they think they have
will be taken from them.”

Luke 8:18​

 

[Cameron143]

When you want to tell stories back them up with HIS word.

For instance, I will say sins are remitted in the water.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

See how that works?

That way you can see what I am saying line us with HIS word.

If you want be to believe what comes out of your mouth prove it's true with HIS WORD.

I have given you scripture and based what I posted on it.

There is no remission of sin apart from the shedding of blood...Hebrews 9:22. Sin was paid for at the cross. The purpose of God sending the gospel is to make this known. Repentance is the acknowledgement of this reality. It is the realization of what God has done in Christ on one's behalf and changing one's mind. In verse 37, when the individuals say...what shall we do... they have already changed their minds about Christ. This is what leads to asking the question. Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place.

Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly.

No doubt you believe that the gift of the Spirit is the indwelling of the Spirit. It is not. It is what Joel spoke of in Joel 2:28, and what Jesus spoke of in Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-5. This is the baptism with the Spirit spoken of Jesus in Matthew 3:11...He will baptize with the Spirit...

You mistake this with the indwelling of the Spirit, which is altogether different. And this is why you don't recognize Acts 2:37 as the work of the indwelling Spirit.

 

[Genez]

No one who stands before the Lord, who will be condemned to the Lake of Fire, will have their sins mentioned.

Why?

Because sin stopped being an issue concerning eternal condemnation once Jesus completed the Cross.

Therefore,, unbelievers can not be condemned because of their sins.

Unbelievers will face evaluation and condemnation according to their *works*. Not sins.

And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. ​

And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged ​

according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. Rev 20:12​

That is why it says...

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift ​

of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. Eph 2:8-9​

Will you people please stop arguing?

For there are believers whom God calls "stupid."
They are not dumb.
These ones willfully refuse correction!
They love the sense of power they get from resisting the truth and seeing the reactions of others they cause.

Here we go! We need to face it.

Some believers choose to be stupid!

Whoever loves instruction loves knowledge,​

But he who hates correction is stupid. Proverbs 12:1​

They do not like you.
If anything, they are jealous.
They wish to wear you out with arguing.

They are stupid.
Not dumb.

​

"Dumb".... can't get it.​

​

"Stupid" .... will not get it. ​

​

There is the difference!

grace and peace .............

 

[JimiSurvivor]

If it can be lost, it's not eternal.

Jesus defined what "ETERNAL LIFE" is when He was in the garden:
…2For You granted Him authority over all people, so that He may give eternal life to all those You have given Him. 3Now THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE, that they may know You, the only TRUE God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

Notice that Jesus did not say it was merely an endless extension of our kind of life. Instead Jesus defined ETERNAL LIFE as "knowing Him" The word for "knowing" is to know by experience or personal acquaintance. Read my references to the words of the original Greek text. Does that even matter or are you going to stick with your traditions no matter what the text actually says? This passage is about our relationship with the Vine not just our loyalty to a tradition or doctrine. I understand your belief because I used to be a Baptist but the idea that the promise of eternal life is obtained by a single decision and does not require us to ABIDE, REMAIN, CONTINUE in Him and in His TEACHING is simply false.

…23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father, but whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well.
24As for you, let what you have heard from the beginning remain in you. IF IT DOES, you will also remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is the promise that He Himself made to us: eternal life.…(1 John 2:24)
Continuing to abide in the Son and the Father, continuing to believe in His teaching is ETERNAL LIFE.
What if we abandon the faith and turn back to serving the world, the flesh and the Devil as we once did? Do we STILL have eternal life even then? No, because our possession of eternal life is CONDITIONED upon our continuing to abide, stay, remain in Him. Do we still have eternal life?

You do not seem to accept the idea that we CAN turn away from Him even though the Apostles repeatedly warn us not to do it. Do you think they would warn us about the dangers of turning away if we were UNABLE to do so. God does not warn us about impossibilities.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

I have given you scripture and based what I posted on it.

There is no remission of sin apart from the shedding of blood...Hebrews 9:22. Sin was paid for at the cross. The purpose of God sending the gospel is to make this known. Repentance is the acknowledgement of this reality. It is the realization of what God has done in Christ on one's behalf and changing one's mind. In verse 37, when the individuals say...what shall we do... they have already changed their minds about Christ. This is what leads to asking the question. Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place.

Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly.

No doubt you believe that the gift of the Spirit is the indwelling of the Spirit. It is not. It is what Joel spoke of in Joel 2:28, and what Jesus spoke of in Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-5. This is the baptism with the Spirit spoken of Jesus in Matthew 3:11...He will baptize with the Spirit...

You mistake this with the indwelling of the Spirit, which is altogether different. And this is why you don't recognize Acts 2:37 as the work of the indwelling Spirit.

Repenting itself is a work of the Spirit that brings about conviction of sin. We do not readily change our mind but stubbornly persist in our old life until we are absolutely convinced there is no other way.

 

[Cameron143]

Repenting itself is a work of the Spirit that brings about conviction of sin. We do not readily change our mind but stubbornly persist in our old life until we are absolutely convinced there is no other way.

I don't disagree. My point is when in Acts 2:37-38 does this occur and what is its cause?
Care to share concerning this?

 

[NightTwister]

Jesus defined what "ETERNAL LIFE" is when He was in the garden:
…2For You granted Him authority over all people, so that He may give eternal life to all those You have given Him. 3Now THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE, that they may know You, the only TRUE God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

Notice that Jesus did not say it was merely an endless extension of our kind of life. Instead Jesus defined ETERNAL LIFE as "knowing Him" The word for "knowing" is to know by experience or personal acquaintance. Read my references to the words of the original Greek text. Does that even matter or are you going to stick with your traditions no matter what the text actually says? This passage is about our relationship with the Vine not just our loyalty to a tradition or doctrine. I understand your belief because I used to be a Baptist but the idea that the promise of eternal life is obtained by a single decision and does not require us to ABIDE, REMAIN, CONTINUE in Him and in His TEACHING is simply false.

…23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father, but whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well.
24As for you, let what you have heard from the beginning remain in you. IF IT DOES, you will also remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is the promise that He Himself made to us: eternal life.…(1 John 2:24)
Continuing to abide in the Son and the Father, continuing to believe in His teaching is ETERNAL LIFE.
What if we abandon the faith and turn back to serving the world, the flesh and the Devil as we once did? Do we STILL have eternal life even then? No, because our possession of eternal life is CONDITIONED upon our continuing to abide, stay, remain in Him. Do we still have eternal life?

You do not seem to accept the idea that we CAN turn away from Him even though the Apostles repeatedly warn us not to do it. Do you think they would warn us about the dangers of turning away if we were UNABLE to do so. God does not warn us about impossibilities.

And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. I John 5:11-13 ESV

 

[Genez]

Peter was surrounded by "awe overload."

Everything that was going on was strange and new!

People were raised from their graves and were walking around Jerusalem, etc.
You think that was not throwing Peter for a loop?

Then after the resurrection, Jesus appeared to the disciples and gave them this message
concerning the beginning of what was to become known as "the Church."

​

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: ​

“Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you ​

have heard me speak about. For John baptized with water, but in a few days you ​

will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” Acts 1:4-5​

It went in one ear and out the other!
Peter quickly forgot what Jesus had said about Spirit baptism.

Why was Peter so quick to resort to water baptisms in the very beginning of his evangelistic phase?
It had become? Second nature to him!

For, before that time?
Peter and the disciples had been water baptizing more people than even John the Baptist had been doing!

Now Jesus learned that the Pharisees had heard that he was gaining and baptizing more ​

disciples than John— although in fact it was not Jesus who baptized, but his disciples. John 4:1-2​

Peter's mind had become set on doing what they had been doing when Christ had been still teaching them.
Peter was impulsive and went into autopilot when first starting out.

Then it finally happened.
Peter began to become adjusted to this revolutionizing way of life.
He stabilized...

Then…

After having many water baptisms performed after his evangelization crusades? It finally hit home with Peter!
Then he finally recalled the words of Jesus which were spoken to him and the disciples in Acts 1:4-5, - about water
baptism being replaced by Spirit baptism!

Finally, Peter remembered!
(for he had forgotten)

“As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. ​

Then I remembered what the Lord had said: ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized ​

with the Holy Spirit.’ Acts 11:15-16​

Then he remembered!

That is why Peter had been water baptizing everyone who were getting saved!
For he had temporarily forgotten Jesus' words, and continued carrying on as how he did things prior to the Cross.
Only later to recall what he had been instructed concerning the ceasing of water baptism in Acts 1:4-5.

So, as Peter had done?
Many today, are making the same mistake...

 

[Ouch]

The hearing part of your brain is only half working.
You do not hear what is being said....
You argue with half a thought only.

IGNORE! bye.

So gald insults don't bother me.

Just in the seed bussines, my job is done it's JESUS who gives the increase.

I would never ignore you.

 

[Ouch]

I have given you scripture and based what I posted on it.

There is no remission of sin apart from the shedding of blood...Hebrews 9:22. Sin was paid for at the cross. The purpose of God sending the gospel is to make this known. Repentance is the acknowledgement of this reality. It is the realization of what God has done in Christ on one's behalf and changing one's mind. In verse 37, when the individuals say...what shall we do... they have already changed their minds about Christ. This is what leads to asking the question. Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place.

Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly.

No doubt you believe that the gift of the Spirit is the indwelling of the Spirit. It is not. It is what Joel spoke of in Joel 2:28, and what Jesus spoke of in Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-5. This is the baptism with the Spirit spoken of Jesus in Matthew 3:11...He will baptize with the Spirit...

You mistake this with the indwelling of the Spirit, which is altogether different. And this is why you don't recognize Acts 2:37 as the work of the indwelling Spirit.

Have you?

First I do agree with some things you say BUT.

You make statements like this,

"Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place"

"Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly"

The reason I don't recognize Acts 2:37 not being saved IS BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT, THEY WERE GIVEN INSTURCTIOS ON WHAT THEY MUST DO.

THEY OBEYED THOSE INSTUCRIONS THEN WAS SAVED!!!!

Ok, I try again.

I will make a statement.

In order to be saved we have to be reborn.

How to be reborn, belive, repent, get baptized in JESUS name for remission of our sins and pray for the Holy Ghost.

1 Believe, John 3:16 plus many more.

2. Repent, Matthew 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Since we are born in sin we need to get rid of it, we are born in sin right?

JESUS is John 3:5 says,
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

EVIDENCE ACTS 2:37 WAS NOT REBORN, were they born of water and of the spirit? NO!!!

He is clear we have to be born OF WATER and OF SPIRIT, right?

So according to HIS word how do we get rid of our sins?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Now how does JESUS fill us with HIS spirit?

Acts 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Acts 10,
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

How do I know the above scripture is evidence that ones speaks in tongues when they are filled???

Because Peter says it,

Acts 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

AND BECAUSE JESUS says it,

Mark 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

See I did not tell any stories, just FACTS.

Can you backup your comments with HIS WORD????

"Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place"

"Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly"

 

[Genez]

…23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father, but whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well.
24As for you, let what you have heard from the beginning remain in you. IF IT DOES, you will also remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is the promise that He Himself made to us: eternal life.…(1 John 2:24)
Continuing to abide in the Son and the Father, continuing to believe in His teaching is ETERNAL LIFE.
What if we abandon the faith and turn back to serving the world, the flesh and the Devil as we once did? Do we STILL have eternal life even then? No, because our possession of eternal life is CONDITIONED upon our continuing to abide, stay, remain in Him. Do we still have eternal life?

You are confusing everlasting life with eternal life.
It is easy to do until it is explained.

God is eternal.
He had no beginning, and has no end.

In salvation, we have been given everlasting life!
Not yet, eternal life.
For we have a beginning, but no end.

To walk in the Spirit and sound doctrine? Is to experience walking in God's life.
That is how we gain "eternal" life.
For God's life is eternal! Outside of time.

The habitually carnal Christian? He still has everlasting life.
But in his stupidity and stubbornness?
He is failing to gain eternal life...

There is a difference.

 

[sawdust]

Satan know's HIS word and knows what happens in the water!!

Yeah, nothing happens which is why he wants you waterlogged. The baptism of Christ does not involve water.

 

[Cameron143]

Have you?

First I do agree with some things you say BUT.

You make statements like this,

"Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place"

"Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly"

The reason I don't recognize Acts 2:37 not being saved IS BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT, THEY WERE GIVEN INSTURCTIOS ON WHAT THEY MUST DO.

THEY OBEYED THOSE INSTUCRIONS THEN WAS SAVED!!!!

Ok, I try again.

I will make a statement.

In order to be saved we have to be reborn.

How to be reborn, belive, repent, get baptized in JESUS name for remission of our sins and pray for the Holy Ghost.

1 Believe, John 3:16 plus many more.

2. Repent, Matthew 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Since we are born in sin we need to get rid of it, we are born in sin right?

JESUS is John 3:5 says,
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

EVIDENCE ACTS 2:37 WAS NOT REBORN, were they born of water and of the spirit? NO!!!

He is clear we have to be born OF WATER and OF SPIRIT, right?

So according to HIS word how do we get rid of our sins?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Now how does JESUS fill us with HIS spirit?

Acts 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Acts 10,
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

How do I know the above scripture is evidence that ones speaks in tongues when they are filled???

Because Peter says it,

Acts 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

AND BECAUSE JESUS says it,

Mark 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

See I did not tell any stories, just FACTS.

Can you backup your comments with HIS WORD????

"Verbally saying they repent merely acknowledges the internal change that has taken place"

"Salvation takes place internally, and is witnessed outwardly"

We are saved when we believe...believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved...Acts 16:31. This is all that is necessary to be saved.

The remission of sin is dependent upon the shedding of blood...Hebrews 9:22. All the sin that is remitted was remitted on the cross.

When the gospel is shared and the Spirit gives hearing and perception...when they heard this, and circumcises the heart...were pricked in the heart, it alters the will of those the Spirit is engaging with...what shall we do? Those who responded this way were made partakers of the divine nature and began responding accordingly. Those who were not acted upon by the Spirit did not respond this way. It is similar to what happened to the two men on the road to Emmaus where Jesus opened their understanding or where He speaks in Matthew 13:11 that his disciples were given to understand the mysteries of the kingdom while others were not.

Do you believe only 3,000 people heard Peter and everyone was saved?

 

[sawdust]

And you can't understand that both water and Spirit refer to born again. Neither do you see that water is reference to the word of God.
Grace and peace.

And you can't understand water refers to the physical. I know water is a reference to the word, also reference to salvation Is.55:1 and the Spirit Jn.7:37-39 but I read in context of the passage not what other passages are saying about water.

 

[Genez]

And you can't understand water refers to the physical. I know water is a reference to the word, also reference to salvation Is.55:1 and the Spirit Jn.7:37-39 but I read in context of the passage not what other passages are saying about water.

1 Corinthians 12:13

For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks,
whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.


.​

 

[Cameron143]

And you can't understand water refers to the physical. I know water is a reference to the word, also reference to salvation Is.55:1 and the Spirit Jn.7:37-39 but I read in context of the passage not what other passages are saying about water.

The context is being born again; not being born. Jesus never speaks concerning natural birth.

 

[Genez]

Ephesians 4:5


One Lord, one faith, one baptism.

Some of you here have "two" baptisms.
And, stay that way, because you are double minded.

.​

 

[Genez]

The context is being born again; not being born. Jesus never speaks concerning natural birth.

You are not smart...
You are actually sadistic.
For you play stupid to torment and wear people down.

You have proven it over and over again.
You deny the Rapture. (But claim your own version of a rapture.)
You deny the Millennium. (Claiming it has been ongoing from the first century.)

And, you now deny this.

John 3:6-7

Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’
​

You do not torment me.

I simply see you as you are.
God says you are stupid.

Proverbs 12:1

Whoever loves discipline loves knowledge,
but whoever hates correction is stupid. ​

And, you are proud of it.

 

[Genez]

The context is being born again; not being born. Jesus never speaks concerning natural birth.

To be born again, one must be born a first time.
Hence? "Born again."

... Please tell me you are on medication.
It would make it much easier to forgive your nonsense in that case.

What ever you are?
You have an affinity for doing evil.
For this is not rocket science.
Elementary school kids grasp it easily.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

You are confusing everlasting life with eternal life.
It is easy to do until it is explained.

God is eternal.
He had no beginning, and has no end.

In salvation, we have been given everlasting life!
Not yet, eternal life.
For we have a beginning, but no end.

To walk in the Spirit and sound doctrine? Is to experience walking in God's life.
That is how we gain "eternal" life.
For God's life is eternal! Outside of time.

The habitually carnal Christian? He still has everlasting life.
But in his stupidity and stubbornness?
He is failing to gain eternal life...

There is a difference.