Ephesians 2 is not preaching faith alone.

[ATG]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works; Which some say is justification by faith apart from any works that we may be doing at the time, whether good or evil. So what does the Scripture say?

Other than James 2 declaring that faith alone without works is dead, and can save no man; Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

By grace, the gift of God is that faith in Jesus Christ, by which we can do the works of God that please Him, and not ourselves alone. We no more do our own works by our own faith, which we can temporarily boast of:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

But now by grace through Jesus' gift of faith, we cease doing our own works of faith, and instead can by God's faith, do His good will forever:

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1Co 15:10
t by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

 

[ATG]

The faith that does not save us, aside from having dead faith alone without works, is our own faith to do our own will, by which we boast. That is not the faith of God by grace, but is that proud faith of man, that trusts in himself, and has something to glory in:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

The faith we have in our own selves, is to do our own will and claim the temporary crown and glory thereof.

While it's not wrong in itself to have faith in things we do to achieve success, except we boast, that's not the faith that is only given by God to serve Him, and obtain the resurrection unto life:

Collosians{3:23}
And whatsoever ye do, do [it] heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men; {3:24} Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ. {3:25} But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.

And so, preaching faith alone without works, is not only a dead faith that cannot save, it's also not any faith preached in Eph 2. It’s certainly not preached by God to man for man’s good, since God in James 2 concludes it is dead being alone.

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?...Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

The gospel of salvation by grace is only through that one faith of God, that is the gift of Jesus Christ in Eph 2, whereby we do His will and not our will:

Heb 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

2Pe 1:1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

This is the only precious faith of Christ toward God, that is given by grace to them that repent unto the saving of the soul:

Mark{1:15}
The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Neither man's own faith in himself, with the works that he has done to boast of, nor any faith that dead without works, can save the soul from the sin and trespass of our own will alone:

Titus{3:4}
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, {3:5} Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?...Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

 

[Aaron56]

Two different salvations

Faith alone = placed into the Body of Christ by the Holy Spirit. This saves you from the second death.
Works through Faith = activity of righteousness defined by being led by the Spirit of God. This saves you from the corruption of the world.

Adam is responsible for the sin in the flesh. Therefore a new identity, not in Adam, is required to escape the second death. Here, faith is required.

Satan is responsible for the corruption of the world. He is the god of the air. The systems he created are designed to entrap men within them through messages of self-reliance and fear. Only people who are in Christ may accomplish works of faith that "deliver them from evil". By these works they are saved, not to go to heaven (that is already accomplished), but from the ways of the wicked one.

 

[wattie]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works; Which some say is justification by faith apart from any works that we may be doing at the time, whether good or evil. So what does the Scripture say?

Other than James 2 declaring that faith alone without works is dead, and can save no man; Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

By grace, the gift of God is that faith in Jesus Christ, by which we can do the works of God that please Him, and not ourselves alone. We no more do our own works by our own faith, which we can temporarily boast of:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

But now by grace through Jesus' gift of faith, we cease doing our own works of faith, and instead can by God's faith, do His good will forever:

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1Co 15:10
t by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

Regarding James 2,

The context is of what people who already have faith do to for the profit of others. The type of faith mainly talked about in James, is the reasonable response to having been given the free gift of eternal life.

Why? Because compare James' writing with Romans 5 and 10 and John 5,6 and 8.

They don't contradict, but write on different aspects of the faith.

John is on salvation itself alot, initially given.. free gift, not by works, eternal life.

Paul compares following the law with the free gift of salvation, similar to John but more emphasis on justification by grace for those who think they are justified by works.

James is on the reasonable response to having the free gift... how we work out our faith..but isn't saying ..if you don't have works you don't have eternal life.

Salvation vs service

Justification vs sanctification

Free gift of salvation vs reasonable response to Jesus for having been given salvation.

 

[tablet123]

Paul said that charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith.

And faith works by love.

No charity then no faith.

Paul said without charity he is nothing, and they have erred from the faith.

James said without charity their faith is dead.

And Abraham was justified by works which made his faith perfect.

For a person is justified by works and not faith alone.

John said without charity the love of God does not dwell in them.

So do not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed, works, and in truth.

Which love is valid in works.

So Paul, James, and John say the same thing.

Without works of love then faith is invalid.

Because love is greater than faith.

And faith works by love.

How can faith be there without love if faith works by love.

So we have to have works.

Not works motivated by the flesh which will not measure up to perfect but will fall short.

But works of the Spirit that can be perfect in love.

If anyone preaches godliness is gain withdraw yourselves from them.

Having food and clothing be content.

For the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy, and love is the fulfilling of the law.

Millions of people claiming Christ are enjoying their wants and not helping people with their needs like they should.

Therefore their faith is invalid.

And it is not a partial thing but must be works of love all the time.

We are saved by faith and not by works when we first confess Christ for that is all we can do.

But then we have to allow the Spirit to lead us having works of the Spirit to have faith valid.

For perfect faith has the right perspective of God's kingdom which is love.

If you are enjoying your wants you violate love.

 

[NightTwister]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works,

This is not what many Christians preach. Hyper-grace is preached by very few, in fact. Yes, most Christians preach that salvation and justification is by faith alone, not by a faith that is alone. Works will always follow a true living faith, not because of effort, but because our desires have been changed.

 

[Dino246]

Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

You see an essay where there is a clause. There is no "faith of man" spoken of in Ephesians 2; the only faith addressed is the gift from God. It is clearly stated that this is not the faith of/from men.

 

[Dino246]

The faith that does not save us, aside from having dead faith alone without works, is our own faith to do our own will, by which we boast. That is not the faith of God by grace, but is that proud faith of man, that trusts in himself, and has something to glory in

It appears that you've mixed up two related but distinct concepts.

One is "faith vs works", and another is "faith from God vs faith in self".

Let's get these straightened out.

James brings harmony to the faith vs works tension. He makes it clear that they operate as though hand in hand. There is no mention of the faith of men in themselves, but the context is always about faith in God. What James is refuting is the idea that we can simply believe that God will save us while we sit on our behinds doing nothing. In contrast, genuine saving faith results in action ("works") consistent with God's character. We "work" because we love God and neighbour.

Scripture doesn't use the concept of "faith in self" (that I'm aware) but it does talk about vain striving, making clear that no amount of effort is enough to attain the righteousness that God requires of us. We cannot be saved by "works" alone; we must have faith in Christ. Further, our "works" add nothing to our salvation.

So let's not muddy the waters further.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

Ephesians 2 is not preaching "faith Alone"?:
Amen! Correct!!

For The Body Of Christ, Christ Gave One apostle, Paul, Plain and Clear!:

"For By Grace Are ye Saved Through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is The​

Gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9 AV)​

​

In God's "Revelation Of The Mystery" By Christ, From Heaven, Salvation Is
By "Grace Through faith" Alone! (Also cp Romans 3-5, 11:6 and Titus 3:4-7 AV)

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 AV) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

Christ, on the earth, To Israel, 12 apostles, Under The Law/covenants
/Prophecy, He Plainly and Clearly Taught them "faith PLUS works!" - ie.:

1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!") or perish
(Mark 1:4; Luke 13:3, 5, 24:47)
+
2) believe the gospel of the kingdom (Matthew 4:23, 9:35, 24:14; Mark 1:14-15)
+
3) be water baptized "For the remission of sin" (Mark 1:4 Luke 3:3, 7:29-30, 24:47;
Act 2:38)
+
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Matthew 3:8), because,
+
5) "to the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead!!"
(James 1:1, 2:17, 26)
+
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Matthew 19:17)
+
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus"
(Mark 10:17-23)

-----------
More Rightly Divided study:

Agreement With The Gospel?
+
UnScriptural or UNdispensational?

Amen.

 

[posthuman]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works; Which some say is justification by faith apart from any works that we may be doing at the time, whether good or evil. So what does the Scripture say?

Other than James 2 declaring that faith alone without works is dead, and can save no man; Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

By grace, the gift of God is that faith in Jesus Christ, by which we can do the works of God that please Him, and not ourselves alone. We no more do our own works by our own faith, which we can temporarily boast of:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

But now by grace through Jesus' gift of faith, we cease doing our own works of faith, and instead can by God's faith, do His good will forever:

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1Co 15:10
t by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

interested to read how you find salvation through human will and works in Ephesians 1

 

[DavidLamb]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works; Which some say is justification by faith apart from any works that we may be doing at the time, whether good or evil. So what does the Scripture say?

Other than James 2 declaring that faith alone without works is dead, and can save no man; Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

By grace, the gift of God is that faith in Jesus Christ, by which we can do the works of God that please Him, and not ourselves alone. We no more do our own works by our own faith, which we can temporarily boast of:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

But now by grace through Jesus' gift of faith, we cease doing our own works of faith, and instead can by God's faith, do His good will forever:

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1Co 15:10
t by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

However, if we look at Ephesians 2:10, we see that works are important, not in order to be saved, but as a result of having been saved:

“For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.” (Eph 2:10 NKJV)

 

[homwardbound]

Eph 2:8 is used by many Christians to preach a gospel of salvation and justification by faith alone without works; Which some say is justification by faith apart from any works that we may be doing at the time, whether good or evil. So what does the Scripture say?

Other than James 2 declaring that faith alone without works is dead, and can save no man; Eph 2 isn't talking about faith alone without works. Rather Eph2 is making the difference between the faith of God with works of grace, vs the faith of man with works to brag about.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

That not of ourselves, is that faith that is of God, and not of ourselves. And so we see the division made between the two. The same faith is not being spoken of throughout this verse of Scripture.

Only that faith by grace is the gift of God, but that faith of man is by his own will alone.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

By grace, the gift of God is that faith in Jesus Christ, by which we can do the works of God that please Him, and not ourselves alone. We no more do our own works by our own faith, which we can temporarily boast of:

Rom 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

1Co 9:24
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

But now by grace through Jesus' gift of faith, we cease doing our own works of faith, and instead can by God's faith, do His good will forever:

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1Co 15:10
t by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

The work that follows Faith in Father and Son as won for me are the den works of Son Jesus, to reveal this love and mercy to all
John13:34 thanks Brother

 

[ATG]

Two different salvations

No Scripture.

There is one faith, one salvation, one sanctification, one justification in Christ Jesus.

Eph 4:2
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Faith alone = placed into the Body of Christ by the Holy Spirit.

Faith alone = Dead

Jas 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

This saves you from the second death.

Resurrection from the dead unto life saves us from the second death.

Rev 20:5
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power,

Mark 13: 13
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Adam is responsible for the sin in the flesh.

There is no sin in natural flesh and blood, only dust of the earth.

Gen 2:5
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,

The sin is lust in the heart.

Jas 1:14
But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Everyone is responsible to care for their body. Everyone that sins with the body, is responsible for their own sinning.

Therefore a new identity, not in Adam,

The natural bodies of all men and women are defined by the forms of Adam and Eve, which are different from the bodies of animals. Christ the Creator is responsible for the shape and natural mortality of our bodies.

Gen 2:5
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,

Every person is responsible for the manner of our own lives, not our parents, and especially not by mean and women that lived thousands of years ago.

Rom 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Rom 3:23
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Satan is responsible for the corruption of the world.

Lucifer is responsible for the first sin by lust:

Isa 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:

People are responsible for their own lusting with Satan and corrupting the world.

1Jo 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

People make themselves children of the devil, by adopting him through their own lust.

He is the god of the air. The systems he created are designed to entrap men within them

Lucifer first created lust in his own heart. Likewise, people create their own lust by his example. Through lusting for the world, the world is corrupted by all people that sin with the god of this world:

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Only people who are in Christ may accomplish works of faith that "deliver them from evil".

Correct.

Jesus Christ delivers us from our own lust and corrupting of the world:

2Pe 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue. Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Jesus takes away our lust of heart, and we are made free with Christ to sanctify ourselves from sins and trespasses of the world.

2Co 6:17
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

1 Thess{5:22}
Abstain from all appearance of evil. {5:23} And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

By these works they are saved, not to go to heaven (that is already accomplished), but from the ways of the wicked one.

If we're not being saved from the corruption of the world, we're not saved from our own lust. If we're not saved from our own lust, we're not saved from death by sin, nor the second death by judgment.

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?...Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Having faith alone saves no one.

Eph 2 has nothing to do with having faith alone. Only James 2 has to do with faith alone, which is dead without works.

 

[NightTwister]

No Scripture.

There is one faith, one salvation, one sanctification, one justification in Christ Jesus.

Eph 4:2
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.


Faith alone = Dead

Jas 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.


Resurrection from the dead unto life saves us from the second death.

Rev 20:5
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power,

Mark 13: 13
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.



There is no sin in natural flesh and blood, only dust of the earth.

Gen 2:5
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,

The sin is lust in the heart.

Jas 1:14
But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Everyone is responsible to care for their body. Everyone that sins with the body, is responsible for their own sinning.



The natural bodies of all men and women are defined by the forms of Adam and Eve, which are different from the bodies of animals. Christ the Creator is responsible for the shape and natural mortality of our bodies.

Gen 2:5
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,

Every person is responsible for the manner of our own lives, not our parents, and especially not by mean and women that lived thousands of years ago.

Rom 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Rom 3:23
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;



Lucifer is responsible for the first sin by lust:

Isa 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:

People are responsible for their own lusting with Satan and corrupting the world.

1Jo 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

People make themselves children of the devil, by adopting him through their own lust.



Lucifer first created lust in his own heart. Likewise, people create their own lust by his example. Through lusting for the world, the world is corrupted by all people that sin with the god of this world:

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.




Correct.

Jesus Christ delivers us from our own lust and corrupting of the world:

2Pe 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue. Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Jesus takes away our lust of heart, and we are made free with Christ to sanctify ourselves from sins and trespasses of the world.

2Co 6:17
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

1 Thess{5:22}
Abstain from all appearance of evil. {5:23} And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.



If we're not being saved from the corruption of the world, we're not saved from our own lust. If we're not saved from our own lust, we're not saved from death by sin, nor the second death by judgment.

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?...Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Having faith alone saves no one.

Eph 2 has nothing to do with having faith alone. Only James 2 has to do with faith alone, which is dead without works.

A dead faith is no faith at all. Works always follow a true, living faith. Works are the result and proof of a living faith.

 

[ATG]

Regarding James 2,

The context is of what people who already have faith do to for the profit of others. The type of faith mainly talked about in James, is the reasonable response to having been given the free gift of eternal life.

The context of faith in James 2 is faith that saves.

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

And that faith is not dead faith alone.

Jas 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

The context of faith in Eph 2 is the faith toward God that saves, vs the faith in ourselves to boast of. That's why Eph 2 and James 2 do not contradict God's teaching on faith that saves, and faith that does not.

Why? Because compare James' writing with Romans 5 and 10 and John 5,6 and 8. They don't contradict

That's because the faith given by Jesus Christ in Eph 2 is the same faith in Rom 5, 10, etc...

Rom 5:1
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

That faith by grace toward God, is not the faith of man toward himself, and especially not the faith alone, that's dead toward God and man.

James 2:15
If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

but write on different aspects of the faith.

There are no different aspects of faith in Christ. His faith is one:

Eph 4:2
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

There are different faiths in the world: The faith that is of God. The faith that is of man. And the faith that is dead.

John is on salvation itself alot, initially given.. free gift, not by works, eternal life.

If the faith of God is not saving us from our own dead works, then His faith is not given us at all, initially or otherwise.

Paul compares following the law with the free gift of salvation, similar to John but more emphasis on justification by grace for those who think they are justified by works.

Only those that repent of their dead works, and receive the gift of faith toward God are justified by works.

The same as Abraham and Rahab were justified by works of faith toward God:

James{2:21}
Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only…Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent [them] out another way?

Works of the law that do not justify, are by faith toward oneself to boast of.

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

Eph 2 separates the faith of God, from the faith of man. James 2 separates the faith of God from the faith that's dead.

James is on the reasonable response to having the free gift... how we work out our faith..

James 2 is on the only works that justify by faith toward God, vs the faith without works that neither save nor justify.

By doing the works of God's faith, we work out our salvation.

Phl 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

but isn't saying ..if you don't have works you don't have eternal life.

Correct. James 2 says if we don't have works, we don't have the faith that saves from death.

James{2:14}
What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?...Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

It's John 3, that says if we don't have the faith of God, we don't have the eternal life of God.

Jhn 3:15
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

If we're not doing the works of God, we don't have the faith and eternal life of God.

Salvation vs service

Salvation and service. Without one there is not the other.

Rom 12:1
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

If we're not doing the good will of God, we don't abide forever, because we don't have the faith of God.

1Jo 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

Justification vs sanctification

Justification vs sanctification is of man's own faith.

Jer 3:8
And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also…And yet for all this her treacherous sister Judah hath not turned unto me with her whole heart, but feignedly, saith the LORD.

Justification and sanctification is of God's own faith.

1 Cor 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

There is no sanctification of God without being washed by God. There is no justification by God, without being sanctified with God.

 

[ATG]

Ephesians 2 is not preaching "faith Alone"?:
Amen! Correct!!
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Matthew 3:8), because,
5) "to the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead!!"
(James 1:1, 2:17, 26)
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Matthew 19:17)
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus"
(Mark 10:17-23)
Amen.

Amen.

Most all raging debate about Scripture can be traced to sloppiness, or willful mishandling of the words.

Eph 2:8
For by grace are ye saved through faith (of God); it is the gift of God. And is not that (faith) of yourselves: nor of works, that any man should boast.

Eph 2 is preaching on faith with works. Only James 2 is of faith without works.

Only the faith with works of God by grace, saves. The faith with our own works to boast of, does not save.

Heb 4:9
There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Phl 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

James{1:22}
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

 

[ATG]

Paul said that charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith.

And faith works by love. No charity then no faith. James said without charity their faith is dead. So do not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed, works, and in truth. Without works of love then faith is invalid. How can faith be there without love if faith works by love.

Because love is greater than faith.

Excellent.

'Faith Alone' is an ideology in the minds of some Christians, who put all their trust in their faith alone. And so, faith is greater than love.

For those who declare they are saved by their faith alone without works. They will not say they also have the love of God without works.

'Faith Alone' is become an idol to many Christians, that believe their salvation stands high alone and apart from what they are doing, whether good or evil.

'Faith Alone' is the definition of religious hypocrisy. They always have their religion on the inside, including when not on the outside.

James{1:22}
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

Mat 15:8
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

So we have to have works.

Not works motivated by the flesh which will not measure up to perfect but will fall short.

Correct again. Eph 2 separates the faith of God with works of His grace, vs the faith of man with works of their own to boast of.

The first is faith with grace, God's faith. The latter is faith with pride, proud faith.

 

[ATG]

This is not what many Christians preach. Hyper-grace is preached by very few, in fact. Yes, most Christians preach that salvation and justification is by faith alone, not by a faith that is alone. Works will always follow a true living faith, not because of effort, but because our desires have been changed.

True. That's why I say 'many', not all.

Many Christians that believe in salvation by faith alone, are not preaching salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone. The two are made far apart by works.

The gospel of salvation by faith alone without works, is false. Those who preach it say plainly that their faith alone saves them, always apart and separate from any works they are doing. That is open religious hypocrisy. The trust in themselves, that their faith alone saves them, even if doing evil. And their most used and abused Scripture for it, is Eph 2:8-9.

The proper teaching of Eph 2 does not include any faith alone without works. Eph 2 preaches only on faith with works.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The Scripture is not saying, that we are saved by grace through faith, that is not with works. The Scripture is saying the faith that saves, is not of works that we can boast of: We are not saved by faith with works of pride. We are only saved by faith with works of grace.

Eph 2 is making difference between two faiths: The faith of God by grace, and proud faith of man.

James 2 is the similar by making difference between faith with works that justify, vs faith without works that do not save nor justify.

 

[NightTwister]

True. That's why I say 'many', not all.

Many Christians that believe in salvation by faith alone, are not preaching salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone. The two are made far apart by works.

The gospel of salvation by faith alone without works, is false. Those who preach it say plainly that their faith alone saves them, always apart and separate from any works they are doing. That is open religious hypocrisy. The trust in themselves, that their faith alone saves them, even if doing evil. And their most used and abused Scripture for it, is Eph 2:8-9.

The proper teaching of Eph 2 does not include any faith alone without works. Eph 2 preaches only on faith with works.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The Scripture is not saying, that we are saved by grace through faith, that is not with works. The Scripture is saying the faith that saves, is not of works that we can boast of: We are not saved by faith with works of pride. We are only saved by faith with works of grace.

Eph 2 is making difference between two faiths: The faith of God by grace, and proud faith of man.

James 2 is the similar by making difference between faith with works that justify, vs faith without works that do not save nor justify.

Salvation is by Grace Alone, through Faith Alone, in Christ Alone.

What it's not is Faith + Works = Salvation.
What it is, is Faith -> Works.

 

[ATG]

You see an essay where there is a clause. There is no "faith of man" spoken of in Ephesians 2; the only faith addressed is the gift from God. It is clearly stated that this is not the faith of/from men.

There is no "faith of man" spoken of in Ephesians 2; because the faith of God is stated not to be the faith of man?

By Eph 2 stating that the faith of God is not the faith of man, the 'faith of man' is left unspoken, but understood.

Is there no 'faith of God', because Eph 2 states faith is the gift of God? By it being the gift of God, we understand it is the faith of God, though left unspoken. So also is the 'faith of man' understood, and that faith is of works to boast of.

And of course, no Scripture is understood in isolation from other Scriptures, where the faith of man is also understood as vain:

Psa 146:3
Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

There is no 'faith alone' nor 'without works' spoken of nor understood in Eph 2. That faith is only spoken of and condemned as dead in James 2.

Eph 2 is the rallying cry of a false gospel and trust in our faith alone without works, saving and justifying us with God. The teaching of Eph 2 rejects it, by not even speaking of 'faith without works'. Nor, having any understanding that such 'faith alone' has anything to do with being saved through that one faith of God, that is only given by grace.

Eph 4:2
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.