Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Cameron143]

We don't have free will to turn to God unless He acts first and frees the will. This has been stated by all of us who side with free will throughout this thread.

No it hasn't. Only by those who believe in prevenient grace. That is only 3 by my count.

 

[Blain]

We don't have free will to turn to God unless He acts first and frees the will. This has been stated by all of us who side with free will throughout this thread.

So am I to understand correctly in that free will involves him calling us and then and only then can we freely choose to accept or deny him?

 

[Rufus]

We don't have free will to turn to God unless He [ineffectually] acts first and [ineffectually] frees the will. This has been stated by all of us who side with free will throughout this thread.

FTFY!

Try really hard to be honest when you post. Don't you know that God HATES liars!?

 

[sawdust]

RF

Com'on Cameron, you're better than that. If you have nothing to say stop wasting space with things most of us have no idea what you are saying. For all we know, you could be swearing.

 

[lrs68]

Well we seem to be in agreement here then the only difference is the free will thing, if we had free will we could freely choose salvation at any point no drawing required but since it require that he draws us or calls us first I do not see free will in that situation

But in all of my posts I have presented 2 Verse examples from Paul about the example in Romans 1 and faith comes by hearing the Gospel preached.

But both examples show God manifesting Himself in multiple ways first before men believe.

But Paul did claim that God made man able to seek God in the Book of Acts. And we also know that even though man has the ability to seek God they don't.

But my position in the entire debate is once God initiates the first move then man has the ability through his will to either accept God or to reject God (Romans 1).

 

[sawdust]

No it hasn't. Only by those who believe in prevenient grace. That is only 3 by my count.

Well considering you think regeneration isn't being saved from death, I'm not about to believe your understanding of others in this thread.

 

[sawdust]

So am I to understand correctly in that free will involves him calling us and then and only then can we freely choose to accept or deny him?

We are born in the dark and bound by sin. The Lord takes the initiative Rom.5:8 and comes to us with grace and truth Jn.1:14 . His grace is real power to set us in a position to be free to accept or deny the truth He presents. Those who desire the light come to the light. If the Lord never acted first, we would remain without hope, without life and without Christ.

 

[cv5]

the key point is that they were first called by God had he never called them they never would seek him man does not seek salvation of their own accord we live by the flesh in that way. many are called few are chosen

Time to up your game young man. There are plenty of resources available.

***************************************

In Matthew 22:14, Jesus concludes the parable of the wedding banquet with the statement, “For many are called, but few are chosen.” To understand who does the calling and choosing in this parable, we need to consider the context, the specific words Jesus uses, and the implications of the original Greek.

1. Who Does the Calling?

The King in the parable clearly represents God, who extends the initial invitation to the wedding banquet. The verb κεκλημένους (perfect passive participle) indicates that the guests were already invited long before the banquet was ready. This implies that God had extended His invitation to His chosen people (the Israelites) throughout history. The perfect tense emphasizes a completed action with ongoing relevance — they were invited in the past, and that invitation still stands.

2. Who Does the Choosing?

The phrase “few are chosen” does not imply that God is selectively choosing a few from among the invited. Instead, it reflects the response of the invitees themselves. The Greek phrase ὀλίγοι ἐκλεκτοί (“few are chosen”) consists of two adjectives functioning as nouns, emphasizing the number of those who actually responded properly to the invitation.

Thus, the “choosing” in this context refers to those who chose to attend the banquet with the proper heart and preparation. The parable emphasizes that being called or invited by God does not automatically grant entrance to the Kingdom; it requires a willing and appropriate response from those invited.

 

[Cameron143]

Well considering you think regeneration isn't being saved from death, I'm not about to believe your understanding of others in this thread.

Just try paying closer attention to what people say. Other than you, Bible_Highlighter, and Genez, the rest believe the fallen natural man has the capacity to pursue God and freely choose Him apart from any activity of God.

Regeneration is simply being made alive. A very necessary thing in order to understand spiritual truth.

 

[Watchman22]

Time to up your game young man. There are plenty of resources available.

***************************************

In Matthew 22:14, Jesus concludes the parable of the wedding banquet with the statement, “For many are called, but few are chosen.” To understand who does the calling and choosing in this parable, we need to consider the context, the specific words Jesus uses, and the implications of the original Greek.

1. Who Does the Calling?

The King in the parable clearly represents God, who extends the initial invitation to the wedding banquet. The verb κεκλημένους (perfect passive participle) indicates that the guests were already invited long before the banquet was ready. This implies that God had extended His invitation to His chosen people (the Israelites) throughout history. The perfect tense emphasizes a completed action with ongoing relevance — they were invited in the past, and that invitation still stands.

2. Who Does the Choosing?

The phrase “few are chosen” does not imply that God is selectively choosing a few from among the invited. Instead, it reflects the response of the invitees themselves. The Greek phrase ὀλίγοι ἐκλεκτοί (“few are chosen”) consists of two adjectives functioning as nouns, emphasizing the number of those who actually responded properly to the invitation.

Thus, the “choosing” in this context refers to those who chose to attend the banquet with the proper heart and preparation. The parable emphasizes that being called or invited by God does not automatically grant entrance to the Kingdom; it requires a willing and appropriate response from those invited.

Jesus spoke in parables to make sure some didn't understand, and He would have to save them. Mt. 13:10-17 , Mk. 4:10-12, Lk. 8:9-10.

 

[Rufus]

Time to up your game young man. There are plenty of resources available.

***************************************

In Matthew 22:14, Jesus concludes the parable of the wedding banquet with the statement, “For many are called, but few are chosen.” To understand who does the calling and choosing in this parable, we need to consider the context, the specific words Jesus uses, and the implications of the original Greek.

1. Who Does the Calling?

The King in the parable clearly represents God, who extends the initial invitation to the wedding banquet. The verb κεκλημένους (perfect passive participle) indicates that the guests were already invited long before the banquet was ready. This implies that God had extended His invitation to His chosen people (the Israelites) throughout history. The perfect tense emphasizes a completed action with ongoing relevance — they were invited in the past, and that invitation still stands.

2. Who Does the Choosing?

The phrase “few are chosen” does not imply that God is selectively choosing a few from among the invited. Instead, it reflects the response of the invitees themselves. The Greek phrase ὀλίγοι ἐκλεκτοί (“few are chosen”) consists of two adjectives functioning as nouns, emphasizing the number of those who actually responded properly to the invitation.

Thus, the “choosing” in this context refers to those who chose to attend the banquet with the proper heart and preparation. The parable emphasizes that being called or invited by God does not automatically grant entrance to the Kingdom; it requires a willing and appropriate response from those invited.

Did God choose to make Israel his covenant people or did Israel choose God? Did the apostles choose Christ or did He choose them?

 

[Jordon]

It is not always an easy job you get a lot of people to babysit but it is an important job

Really tho I think a mod can make there life easier by setting rules, I have a lot of racing budies on the GT planet car racing forum, I'm sure you can imagine with car racers you get a lot of hot heads, with ego issues, the mods there are brilliant, if they see any racist behaviour there quick to stomp on it, they have an infraction system for any kind of name calling of ill manners and nobody is allowed to get away with one ill remark. Everyone chats there with respect. Which is pretty good considering we get so many hot heads coming through the door, there always complaining coz they cant win, they think where cheats. People are just bonkers

 

[sawdust]

Just try paying closer attention to what people say. Other than you, Bible_Highlighter, and Genez, the rest believe the fallen natural man has the capacity to pursue God and freely choose Him apart from any activity of God.

Regeneration is simply being made alive. A very necessary thing in order to understand spiritual truth.

Being made alive means we were dead ergo, saved from death. Dead in our sin, then made alive to God. Sounds like salvation to me.

Like I said, I don't trust your understanding. You get things wrong.

 

[sawdust]

Jesus spoke in parables to make sure some didn't understand, and He would have to save them. Mt. 13:10-17 , Mk. 4:10-12, Lk. 8:9-10.

It wasn't because He would have to save them, it is because they could never appreciate the salvation they would be given. Their heart is all wrong.

 

[Cameron143]

Being made alive means we were dead ergo, saved from death. Dead in our sin, then made alive to God. Sounds like salvation to me.

Like I said, I don't trust your understanding. You get things wrong.

Salvation comes through faith. Being spiritually quickened is what allows one to engage with spiritual things.

Adam was spiritually alive and not saved before sin.

 

[Blain]

We are born in the dark and bound by sin. The Lord takes the initiative Rom.5:8 and comes to us with grace and truth Jn.1:14 . His grace is real power to set us in a position to be free to accept or deny the truth He presents. Those who desire the light come to the light. If the Lord never acted first, we would remain without hope, without life and without Christ.

Yes this absolutely the case

 

[Watchman22]

It wasn't because He would have to save them, it is because they could never appreciate the salvation they would be given. Their heart is all wrong.

My point is that Jesus recognizes they could have chosen it.

 

[Blain]

Time to up your game young man. There are plenty of resources available.

***************************************

In Matthew 22:14, Jesus concludes the parable of the wedding banquet with the statement, “For many are called, but few are chosen.” To understand who does the calling and choosing in this parable, we need to consider the context, the specific words Jesus uses, and the implications of the original Greek.

1. Who Does the Calling?

The King in the parable clearly represents God, who extends the initial invitation to the wedding banquet. The verb κεκλημένους (perfect passive participle) indicates that the guests were already invited long before the banquet was ready. This implies that God had extended His invitation to His chosen people (the Israelites) throughout history. The perfect tense emphasizes a completed action with ongoing relevance — they were invited in the past, and that invitation still stands.

2. Who Does the Choosing?

The phrase “few are chosen” does not imply that God is selectively choosing a few from among the invited. Instead, it reflects the response of the invitees themselves. The Greek phrase ὀλίγοι ἐκλεκτοί (“few are chosen”) consists of two adjectives functioning as nouns, emphasizing the number of those who actually responded properly to the invitation.

Thus, the “choosing” in this context refers to those who chose to attend the banquet with the proper heart and preparation. The parable emphasizes that being called or invited by God does not automatically grant entrance to the Kingdom; it requires a willing and appropriate response from those invited.

I see nothing wrong with this it is indeed the case

 

[Blain]

Really tho I think a mod can make there life easier by setting rules, I have a lot of racing budies on the GT planet car racing forum, I'm sure you can imagine with car racers you get a lot of hot heads, with ego issues, the mods there are brilliant, if they see any racist behaviour there quick to stomp on it, they have an infraction system for any kind of name calling of ill manners and nobody is allowed to get away with one ill remark. Everyone chats there with respect. Which is pretty good considering we get so many hot heads coming through the door, there always complaining coz they cant win, they think where cheats. People are just bonkers

This is also how we run things on Christian forum.net not even the slightest rude or ill mannered remarks are allowed we keep a tight ship. and you know @Lafftur is also a mod on there she does a great job and she would make a good mod on here. But that forum you speak of seems like a lot to handle you need expert level modding for something like that

 

[sawdust]

Salvation comes through faith. Being spiritually quickened is what allows one to engage with spiritual things.

Adam was spiritually alive and not saved before sin.

Adam didn't need saving before he died. He was very much spiritually alive and in communion with the Lord God. Being made alive is salvation from death.

I'm not going through this with you again. You're understanding is wrong and therefore I do not trust you to understand what others say.

grace and peace