God's design for relationship is arranged marriage, incompatible with modern society

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I have no disrespect or fear for women, I just don't know anybody in real life with whom I can freely talk about these issues in English.

I completely understand.

I am often in life situations where I'm pretty much isolated as well.

But you are meeting several people right here in this thread who speak English. :)

I truly hope that you will keep writing, keep putting up threads, keep posting -- get to know us and help us get to know you, and I pray that talking to us will be a comfort and a blessing to you. 🙏
 
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I enjoy both. I'm married now and I look forward to the marriage in heaven. I can't cling to the heavenly marriage because it is yet to happen. I don't why this is so hard to understand. Marriage is as normal as eating and drinking. That too will be better in heaven. But I do not intend to starve to death waiting for that day.
Not from what I know. Marriage is a privilege, especially christian marraige, it's not available for all, taking it "as normal as eating and drinking" is an entitlement mentality. It might be that much normal in the 50s where marriage rates was above 90%, but that was a historical anomoly, and believe it or not, it produced a horde of desperate, lonely housewives in the suburbs, which directly contributed to the 60s feminist movement, the 70s divorce wave, the 80s female participation in the workforce and all the rest that slowly but surely snowballed into the mess we are living in the middle of.

Yes, the heavenly marriage with Jesus is yet to happen, but at least we can cling to a preview of that, and this preview is Matt. 22:30 - if you believe in bodily and earthly resurrection, instead of a disembodied "soul" floating up the clouds.
 
I have no disrespect or fear for women, I just don't know anybody in real life with whom I can freely talk about these issues in English.

For whatever it's worth, I was raised in a "radical purity" culture as well. I was once called to task in my late teens by a church leader who saw me shake a man's hand after a business transaction. It was a normal businesses-like handshake, nothing weird or salacious. Apparently I "should have held back, looked really annoyed and then reluctantly shook his hand if I HAD to, but without making eye contact". 😑

I feel like our whole teen years in the church we are taught how dangerous the opposite sex is, so much so that we shouldn't even make eye contact..... then expected to immediately pivot in adulthood to seeking them out and quickly marrying because "That's God's plan for us".

Anyways..... you are definitely not alone in your frustrations with modern Churchianity. If you hang around and have some conversations I think you will find that a lot of us agree with some of what you are saying, I know that I do.... and of course I disagree with ya on plenty as well but that's life.

Best, and I hope stick around and get your questions answered!
 
Wow... Y'all really got busy after I went to bed last night. I missed all the fun!
 
Not from what I know. Marriage is a privilege, especially christian marraige, it's not available for all, taking it "as normal as eating and drinking" is an entitlement mentality. It might be that much normal in the 50s where marriage rates was above 90%, but that was a historical anomoly, and believe it or not, it produced a horde of desperate, lonely housewives in the suburbs, which directly contributed to the 60s feminist movement, the 70s divorce wave, the 80s female participation in the workforce and all the rest that slowly but surely snowballed into the mess we are living in the middle of.

Yes, the heavenly marriage with Jesus is yet to happen, but at least we can cling to a preview of that, and this preview is Matt. 22:30 - if you believe in bodily and earthly resurrection, instead of a disembodied "soul" floating up the clouds.
I do not take the world as my pattern for marriage. Anyhow, I know plenty of unbelievers who have made marriage work.

Your attitude to marriage stinks, to be blunt. I do not believe that marriage is entitlement. It was ordained by God from the creation of Adam and Eve. It is the individual's choice. And it is none of your business.
 
To start over, plz read the OP first, especially the PS, all explained there. To sum it up, "God wants us to marry" "sex is within marriage" "be fruitful and multiply" are all true biblical teachings, I'm not here to challenge any of these, but they are all meaningless without an explanation of how you meet your own "helper" and get married in the first place. The biblical explanation is arranged marriage, so is the norm in the historical context of the whole bible, but it's out of the picture in modern society, and the church doesn't have an answer for that, so instead of promoting singleness or reviving arranged marriage, most churches preach this "sexual prosperity gospel" to singles. My personal story is to have recognized it as a scam taking the Lord's name in vain.
Yes, it's much clearer now.

Either you can't find a girl OR a girl hurt you and you decided you don't want nothing to do with girls now. That's understandable.

Your mistake is in making it a matter of pride. To help yourself deal with the situation, you have elevated single above married and convinced yourself that it somehow makes you more holy than married people. This way you can feel good about being single, and feel like you're better than other people.

That is a mistake.

Going around bragging about how holy you are, and how much better you are than they, that is going to generate a lot of resentment - even if it's true. Remember Joseph's brothers? :p

Stop trying to make yourself feel like you're better than other people. Start working on finding things you can be enthusiastic about. That is what makes life worth living. (And you'll feel a lot better too.)
 
I was raised in a church that saw its leaders as spiritually superior.

I do not personally believe this about any spiritual leader (that just being a spiritual leader, or just devoting one's life solely to God somehow makes them automatically spiritually superior,) but that's just me.
Ahem!

I BEG your pardon!

I am definitely spiritually superior to 97% of the people I meet. So there! :P :P :P :P



It doesn't seem to be helping you very much emotionally, but most everyone needs to believe they're winning at something, no matter how much they have to contort things to accommodate their own comfort.
Hey no fair! You can't copy one of my lines without paying royalties! You will be hearing from my lawyers.
 
I have no disrespect or fear for women, I just don't know anybody in real life with whom I can freely talk about these issues in English.
By the way is that cat in your avatar your cat? Tabbies are cool. They definitely have common "tabby" personality traits, while still maintaining feline individuality. I've never met a tabby who was not a cool cat.

What's your cat's name?
 
I do not take the world as my pattern for marriage. Anyhow, I know plenty of unbelievers who have made marriage work.

Your attitude to marriage stinks, to be blunt. I do not believe that marriage is entitlement. It was ordained by God from the creation of Adam and Eve. It is the individual's choice. And it is none of your business.
It is entitlement only if you translate "marriage was ordained by God from the creation of Adam and Eve" into "there's an Adam for every Eve and an Eve for every Adam to marry." It is your choice to marry, but it's God's chocie to actually get you married, unless you marry with yourself. There's a saying, "man proposes, God disposes," and there's Lord Jesus's prayer, "not as I will, but as YOU will." (Matt. 26:39)
 
Yes, it's much clearer now.

Either you can't find a girl OR a girl hurt you and you decided you don't want nothing to do with girls now. That's understandable.

Your mistake is in making it a matter of pride. To help yourself deal with the situation, you have elevated single above married and convinced yourself that it somehow makes you more holy than married people. This way you can feel good about being single, and feel like you're better than other people.

That is a mistake.

It is a mistake only as much as Paul's advice to singles is a mistake. It's not any individual verse taken out of the context, but the consistent message of the whole section in 1 Cor. 7:25-40, that singleness is preferred, marriage is merely permitted, it will burden you with worldly trouble and distract you from the Lord. We should be eschatalogically and teleologically minded, the current form of the world is passing away, don't hang on to it, stop concerning about marital status and start concerning things of the Lord.

Now concerning virgins: I have no commandment from the Lord; yet I give judgment as one whom the Lord in His mercy has made trustworthy. I suppose therefore that this is good because of the present distress—that it is good for a man to remain as he is: Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be loosed. Are you loosed from a wife? Do not seek a wife. But even if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. Nevertheless such will have trouble in the flesh, but I would spare you.

But this I say, brethren, the time is short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, and those who use this world as not misusing it. For the form of this world is passing away.

But I want you to be without care. He who is unmarried cares for the things of the Lord—how he may please the Lord. But he who is married cares about the things of the world—how he may please his wife. There is a difference between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman cares about the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit. But she who is married cares about the things of the world—how she may please her husband. And this I say for your own profit, not that I may put a leash on you, but for what is proper, and that you may serve the Lord without distraction.

But if any man thinks he is behaving improperly toward his virgin, if she is past the flower of youth, and thus it must be, let him do what he wishes. He does not sin; let them marry. Nevertheless he who stands steadfast in his heart, having no necessity, but has power over his own will, and has so determined in his heart that he will keep his virgin, does well. So then he who gives her in marriage does well, but he who does not give her in marriage does better.

A wife is bound by law as long as her husband lives; but if her husband dies, she is at liberty to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord. But she is happier if she remains as she is, according to my judgment—and I think I also have the Spirit of God.
 
By the way is that cat in your avatar your cat? Tabbies are cool. They definitely have common "tabby" personality traits, while still maintaining feline individuality. I've never met a tabby who was not a cool cat.

What's your cat's name?

Purrsuit. Purrsuit of happiness.
 
It is entitlement only if you translate "marriage was ordained by God from the creation of Adam and Eve" into "there's an Adam for every Eve and an Eve for every Adam to marry." It is your choice to marry, but it's God's chocie to actually get you married, unless you marry with yourself. There's a saying, "man proposes, God disposes," and there's Lord Jesus's prayer, "not as I will, but as YOU will." (Matt. 26:39)
Yeah. There sure are a lot of people who go around talking like God promised every person a mate. Buuuuuuull-oni!

A lot of people idolize marriage as a cure-all for their problems. So it's really important for them to believe that God will provide a spouse for everybody. "God has the perfect person all picked out for you, don't worry." Bull.
 
It is a mistake only as much as Paul's advice to singles is a mistake. It's not any individual verse taken out of the context, but the consistent message of the whole section in 1 Cor. 7:25-40, that singleness is preferred, marriage is merely permitted, it will burden you with worldly trouble and distract you from the Lord. We should be eschatalogically and teleologically minded, the current form of the world is passing away, don't hang on to it, stop concerning about marital status and start concerning things of the Lord.

Now concerning virgins: I have no commandment from the Lord; yet I give judgment as one whom the Lord in His mercy has made trustworthy. I suppose therefore that this is good because of the present distress—that it is good for a man to remain as he is: Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be loosed. Are you loosed from a wife? Do not seek a wife. But even if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. Nevertheless such will have trouble in the flesh, but I would spare you.

But this I say, brethren, the time is short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, and those who use this world as not misusing it. For the form of this world is passing away.

But I want you to be without care. He who is unmarried cares for the things of the Lord—how he may please the Lord. But he who is married cares about the things of the world—how he may please his wife. There is a difference between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman cares about the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit. But she who is married cares about the things of the world—how she may please her husband. And this I say for your own profit, not that I may put a leash on you, but for what is proper, and that you may serve the Lord without distraction.

But if any man thinks he is behaving improperly toward his virgin, if she is past the flower of youth, and thus it must be, let him do what he wishes. He does not sin; let them marry. Nevertheless he who stands steadfast in his heart, having no necessity, but has power over his own will, and has so determined in his heart that he will keep his virgin, does well. So then he who gives her in marriage does well, but he who does not give her in marriage does better.

A wife is bound by law as long as her husband lives; but if her husband dies, she is at liberty to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord. But she is happier if she remains as she is, according to my judgment—and I think I also have the Spirit of God.
That doesn't mean single people are the only REAL Christians, as you stated earlier in this thread. It also does not mean all Christians should be single, or even want to be single.

You are idolizing single the way some people idolize marriage.
 
Yeah. There sure are a lot of people who go around talking like God promised every person a mate. Buuuuuuull-oni!

A lot of people idolize marriage as a cure-all for their problems. So it's really important for them to believe that God will provide a spouse for everybody. "God has the perfect person all picked out for you, don't worry." Bull.
Yeah, there're two harsh terms for this, "social infertility" and "unplanned childlessness", check them out.
 
That doesn't mean single people are the only REAL Christians, as you stated earlier in this thread. It also does not mean all Christians should be single, or even want to be single.

You are idolizing single the way some people idolize marriage.
Nope, all I did was reaching the acceptance stage. You know, denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance.
 
That was not a command, and it was not written for Christians specifically - were Adam and Eve the ancestors of all mankind, or only born again Christians? Were Noah and his three sons the ancestors of all mankind, or only born again Christians?

If you let the bible interpret itself, the read command is the Great Commission, Lord Jesus's parting words - "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." We're commanded to make disciples, not babies. If you're obsessed with baby making, you'd be led astray like Sarah, Rachel, Hannah and Lot's daughters.
Just to agree with some of the other posters, lumping Sarah, Rachel and Hannah in with Lot's daughters is definitely not comparing apples with apples.

Surely the shortcomings of Sarah and Rachel (I don't think you've presented a scriptural case that Hannah's desire for children was wrong) pale in comparison to women like Delilah, Jezebel and Salome? If being led astray by a desire for baby-making keeps females from becoming such terrible sinners as these latter women, perhaps it would be best for all of them to be more like Sarah, Rachel and Hannah?
 
Nope, all I did was reaching the acceptance stage. You know, denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance.
Uh... No. You have been preaching waaaaaaay more than acceptance.

Thanks. Sorry I can't relate, I have no desire for any girl, nor do I know anyone personally. All that I'm saying is that marriage is a worldly pursuit, real hardcore Christians should stay single. After all, Jesus was single, Paul was single, most OT prophets and disciples were single.
That sounds more like idolatry. You are trying so hard to feel good about being single that you vaunt it above marriage, to the point that you claimed REAL Christians are single.

That is far beyond mere acceptance. You are idolizing single like some people idolize marriage.
 
Just to agree with some of the other posters, lumping Sarah, Rachel and Hannah in with Lot's daughters is definitely not comparing apples with apples.

Surely the shortcomings of Sarah and Rachel (I don't think you've presented a scriptural case that Hannah's desire for children was wrong) pale in comparison to women like Delilah, Jezebel and Salome? If being led astray by a desire for baby-making keeps females from becoming such terrible sinners as these latter women, perhaps it would be best for all of them to be more like Sarah, Rachel and Hannah?
Lot's daughters were not bad people, they thought the world had ended, they were the only people left, and it was their duty to "replenish the earth" like Noah's three sons. I admit that it wasn't the same case for them, as they didn't suffer infertility, but the obsession of baby making is the same.
 
Uh... No. You have been preaching waaaaaaay more than acceptance.


That sounds more like idolatry. You are trying so hard to feel good about being single that you vaunt it above marriage, to the point that you claimed REAL Christians are single.

That is far beyond mere acceptance. You are idolizing single like some people idolize marriage.
That's a logical and reasonable conclusion drawn from Paul's teaching on singleness, Jesus's teaching on celibacy, the history of Catholic priesthood and the current time of distress.
 
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