Acts 2:38 Comparison: Evangelical vs. Oneness / Baptismal-Regeneration View

[studier]

I have obeyed God's word by believing in Jesus Christ

Precisely. And by believing in Jesus Christ I have obeyed God's word - actually God's command. Faith and obedience are equivalent and inseparable.

 

[studier]

Obeying God's voice is what saves

Because this is genuine faith in God.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

True for all systematic theologies which is why we have so many different hives, including the faith-alone hive.

The faith-alone hive is knowing God through knowledge, ie, gnosis. The faith + works of faith hive is knowing God through hearkening to (obeying) his voice

And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that says, I know him, and doesn't keep his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4​

​

 

[studier]

Faith is inward and baptism is the outward expression of that faith

Faith is inward and submission, i.e. obedience is inward with faith. Then faith/obedience is expressed outwardly in acts of/from faith/obedience which is faithfulness.

 

[Wansvic]

That question — “What’s the name?” — is a common Oneness tactic meant to collapse Matthew 28:19 into “Jesus only,” ignoring that “name” (ὄνομα) in Greek often denotes authority or power, not just a single spoken word.

The “name” in Matthew 28:19 KJV isn’t a single syllable to recite — it’s the shared divine authority of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

When Acts records baptism “in the name of Jesus,” it’s identifying whose authority they baptized under — the very authority Jesus spoke of when He said “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”

If “the name” were meant to replace those titles, the apostles would have disobeyed Christ’s direct command. Instead, they fulfilled it by baptizing in the full revelation of the Godhead manifested through Jesus. Scripture harmonizes; it doesn’t contradict itself.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

You should take your own advice and study what scripture actually reveals on the topic instead of diverting attention to denominational beliefs. The truth is found throughout the recorded word of God.

One of the many accounts that confirm the validity of the use of the name is found in 1 Corinthians. Paul begins his letter by pointing out those he is writing to were sanctified IN Christ Jesus through calling upon the name of Jesus. Considering Paul's own experience there is no doubt he is making reference to water baptism. (Acts 22:15-16)
"For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord."



"Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,
Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:" 1 Cor. 1-2

Paul makes it clear that an actual name is used in baptism. The name of the one crucified for them:
"Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name." 1 Cor. 1:13


Lastly, there is not a single reference to the apostles administering water baptism using the phrase. This alone should prompt further study. It is a mistake to reject what the word clearly conveys on any topic just because it aligns with an unpopular denomination's belief system.

Since the word is going to judge each and everyone of us we better be sure not to reject something revealed there just because of a denominaitonal bias. (John 12:48)

 

[Wansvic]

That question — “What’s the name?” — is a common Oneness tactic meant to collapse Matthew 28:19 into “Jesus only,” ignoring that “name” (ὄνομα) in Greek often denotes authority or power, not just a single spoken word.

The “name” in Matthew 28:19 KJV isn’t a single syllable to recite — it’s the shared divine authority of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

When Acts records baptism “in the name of Jesus,” it’s identifying whose authority they baptized under — the very authority Jesus spoke of when He said “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”

If “the name” were meant to replace those titles, the apostles would have disobeyed Christ’s direct command. Instead, they fulfilled it by baptizing in the full revelation of the Godhead manifested through Jesus. Scripture harmonizes; it doesn’t contradict itself.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

You may want to investigate when the use of the phrase from Matthew 28:19 was officially begun and by whom. And what that phrase replaced. There is a vast amount of historical documentation for those willing to study it out.

 

[Wansvic]

...let the Bible interpret itself.

“Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.” — 2 Timothy 2:15 (KJV)​

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

Father, Son and Holy Ghost are not names. Whereas, Jesus is the name of the one in whom the Godhead dwells and the one we are buried with in baptism according to Colossians 2:9-12

 

[Wansvic]

I was thinking too, usually 3 names mentioned in the baptism.

Father, Son and Holy Ghost are titles not names. The bible reveals Jesus is the name the apostles used when administering water baptism.

In addition, the historical record reveals forerunners of the Roman Catholic Church replaced the use of the name of Jesus with the phrase around 325A.D. A simple search on the Internet such as "encyclopedia references to a change in baptism in the name of Jesus" provides evidence of this truth.

 

[LightBearer316]

Right, obedience is how faith shows itself — that’s exactly what I’m saying. The act of baptism doesn’t create faith; it’s the outward step that follows it. The heart responds first, the water just marks what’s already happened within. As shown above: By Faith, Not by water!

Faith must show itself in obedience because obedience is equivalent to faith. No obedience, then no genuine faith.

“Faith must show itself in obedience because obedience is equivalent to faith. No obedience, then no genuine faith.”​

You are equating obedience with faith itself, not as its result. That’s the serious key theological error!

That’s close, but there’s an important distinction Scripture keeps clear:


Faith isn’t equivalent to obedience — it’s what produces obedience. Paul makes that contrast plain in Romans 4:5 KJV, where he says the one who does not work but believes is counted righteous. Faith precedes obedience and gives it meaning.

If obedience were faith itself, then salvation would rest on performance instead of grace, and that would nullify the cross. True faith always results in obedience, but they aren’t the same thing — one is the cause, the other is the effect.

What you’re saying actually goes beyond what Scripture teaches.

The Bible never equates faith with obedience — it shows obedience as the evidence of faith. When Paul explains justification, he says plainly that “to him that worketh not, but believeth, his faith is counted for righteousness” (Romans 4:5 KJV). That’s not obedience producing faith; it’s faith producing obedience afterward.

To merge the two is to blur the very line Paul draws between grace and works. If obedience were faith, then salvation would depend on performance instead of God’s grace. Scripture consistently keeps that distinction clear — we obey because we believe, not in order to believe.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

 

[Wansvic]

So is baptism the same as salvation?

Water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for remission of sin is one of the essential elements required in order to be born again. (Acts 2:4-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-7, 22:16)

According to Paul we are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. As such salvation is an ongoing journey. This is revealed by Jesus in John 15:1-8:

"I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."

 

[LightBearer316]

Precisely. And by believing in Jesus Christ I have obeyed God's word - actually God's command. Faith and obedience are equivalent and inseparable.

studier again merges faith and obedience as if they’re the same act — saying, “Faith and obedience are equivalent and inseparable.”
That’s a subtle but serious distortion of Scripture. The Bible never teaches that faith is obedience; rather, obedience is the fruit and outward expression of faith. If they were equivalent, salvation would be earned by performance, not received by belief.

That’s not actually what Scripture teaches — you’re creating definitions that the Bible never gives.

Faith and obedience aren’t the same thing, and nowhere does Scripture treat them as identical. You’re blending categories that God Himself keeps distinct. Paul couldn’t be clearer in Romans 4:5 KJV: “To him that worketh not, but believeth, his faith is counted for righteousness.”

Faith receives grace — obedience reflects it. One is the root, the other the fruit. To make them equivalent is to rewrite the very framework of salvation and turn grace into performance.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

 

[studier]

In James 2:21, notice closely that James does not say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac resulted in God accounting Abraham as righteous. The accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, (also see Romans 4:2-3) many years before his work of offering up Isaac recorded in Genesis 22. The work of Abraham did not have some kind of intrinsic merit to account him as righteous, but it showed or manifested the genuineness of his faith. (James 2:18) That is the "sense" in which Abraham was "justified by works." (James 2:21) He was shown to be righteous.

NKJ James2:17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

• The faith being discussed (genuine faith) is intrinsically ("by itself") dead if it does not have/possess works - genuine faith that does not intrinsically possess works is dead.

18 But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

• James uses an interlocutor to explain how genuine faith can be seen

19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe-- and tremble!

• In context, the demons believe there is one God and shudder.
  • Example of "shudder": Job4:15; Jer2:12
    • Liddell-Scott Lexicon uses examples like hair bristling/standing on end, getting goose-skin, shivering
  • The demons believe there is one God but do not accordingly do works according to God
    • The issue here is believe but no works
    • Works are not intrinsic to their belief
    • Dead faith.

20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead1?

• No works - then no genuine faith - just dead faith like the demons

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?

• Abraham was justified by works
  • In context works intrinsic to faith - genuine faith
  • Must carry forward the contextual genuine faith with its intrinsic works
  • Inserting "justified before men" is an interpretation favored by faith alone soteriology.

22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?

• Faith working together with works
  • Working together is lexically "to engage in cooperative endeavor" (BDAG)
• "by works" is literally "from works" speaking of results
  • Faith & works (intrinsic to genuine faith) co-operate
    • works result in completing/finishing/accomplishing faith - bringing faith to the goal - bringing an imperfect state of faith to fulfilment
      • faith is incomplete apart from works (works are intrinsic to genuine faith)
      • faith has a goal - apart from this goal faith reaches by cooperating with works intrinsic to it - faith is incomplete - it cannot be said to be genuine faith

23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness." And he was called the friend of God.

• Gen15:6 was fulfilled/brought to its designed completion/completed
  • Credited righteousness is for a purpose - it has a goal
    • Apart from this goal faith without cooperating with its intrinsic works incomplete

24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

• Man is justified from/as a result of works [intrinsic to genuine faith]
• Man is NOT justified from/as a result of faith-alone.
  • faith-alone is intrinsically dead faith because genuine faith co-operates with works that it possess that are intrinsic to genuine faith

Between James and Paul just make sure we're reading Paul as not being in disagreement with James regarding what genuine faith is - having works intrinsic to genuine faith. Paul also establishes that obedience in intrinsic to genuine faith (which can also be tied to the demons in James believing - the demons believe but do not obey and do not do works - their belief is no genuine in the sense of genuine faith).

Paul's clarification is that God initially saves apart from works which is just logic and common sense since God creates men anew in Christ Jesus for good works, so good works begin after we're saved. Salvation is God's work. Any works we may do pre-salvation are of no merit for salvation. Any works of righteousness men do according to law are not the righteousness God requires and provides to men through genuine faith which intrinsically possesses obedience and works.

Could be clearer, I'm sure. But James is clear about genuine faith intrinsically possessing works. And Paul makes it clear that those works intrinsic to genuine faith begin post salvation.

 

[LightBearer316]

The faith-alone hive is knowing God through knowledge, ie, gnosis. The faith + works of faith hive is knowing God through hearkening to (obeying) his voice

And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that says, I know him, and doesn't keep his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4​

​

This post from @ChristRoseFromTheDead mixes knowledge (gnosis) and obedience into a hybrid “faith + works” concept, then misuses 1 John 2:3-4 KJV to support it. That’s another theological overreach — the passage is talking about the evidence of knowing God, not the basis of salvation.

You keep mishandling Scripture because you don’t seem very familiar with it. Apart from the usual name-calling — which has become your modus operandi — you rarely offer anything of real substance to the discussion.

Again, that’s not actually what Scripture teaches — you’re blending categories the Bible keeps distinct. You’re creating definitions that don’t exist in the text.

John isn’t redefining faith as obedience in 1 John 2:3–4 KJV. He’s saying obedience proves we already know God — not that it creates that relationship. The knowing comes first; the keeping follows.

Paul makes the same point in Romans 4:5 KJV: “To him that worketh not, but believeth… his faith is counted for righteousness.” Faith justifies — obedience demonstrates. One is the root, the other the fruit.

Turning them into the same thing turns grace into performance, and that’s simply not the gospel.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture verses!

 

[studier]

Noah was justified by his faith, but that justification by itself wouldn't have saved him. He needed a boat through which his progeny could survive the flood, through whom the messiah would come. So Noah obeyed God by building the ark, and thus ensured his salvation

Gen6:9 description of Noah's faith

 

[studier]

Faith isn’t passive—it always leads to obedience. But Scripture keeps the order clear: salvation is by grace through faith, unto good works, not because of them (Eph. 2:8-10). The works prove life is there; they don’t create it. That’s the difference between root and fruit.

Wrongly equates obedience with works denying obedience being intrinsic to genuine faith. Standard systematic faith-alone error.

 

[studier]

That’s close, but Scripture makes it clear that salvation starts with faith, not with any outward act. Obedience follows because we’re saved, not so we can be saved. Baptism is the fruit of belief — not the root of it.

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture versus!

Salvation starts with genuine faith that possesses obedience and works as intrinsic parts of itself.

 

[studier]

The issue isn’t about wanting to please God — it’s about what saves us. Scripture’s clear that salvation isn’t something we guard to keep; it’s something God secures for us. Obedience flows from salvation, not anxiety about losing it. (Philippians 1:6 KJV ; 1 Peter 1:5 KJV)

Grace and Peace
Acts 17:11 (KJV)
“These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
https://ergonis.com/typinator
Highly Recommended - great for often cited scripture versus!

Salvation is a gift from God (Eph2) that God and His faithfully obedient children cooperate together in accomplishing (Phil2:12-13) through genuine faith that possesses obedience and good works.

 

[studier]

obedience is the fruit of faith

Obedience is intrinsic to faith and is first mental then manifested experientially.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Wrongly equates obedience with works denying obedience being intrinsic to genuine faith. Standard systematic faith-alone error.

Yes, this is the sleight of hand they use. Faith vs works rather than works of faith, or faith that works, vs works of law that is the antithesis of faith.

And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. Galatians 3:12​

 

[mailmandan]

That’s a subtle but serious distortion of Scripture. The Bible never teaches that faith is obedience; rather, obedience is the fruit and outward expression of faith. If they were equivalent, salvation would be earned by performance, not received by belief.

Faith and obedience aren’t the same thing, and nowhere does Scripture treat them as identical. You’re blending categories that God Himself keeps distinct. Paul couldn’t be clearer in Romans 4:5 KJV: “To him that worketh not, but believeth, his faith is counted for righteousness.”

Faith receives grace — obedience reflects it. One is the root, the other the fruit. To make them equivalent is to rewrite the very framework of salvation and turn grace into performance.

Amen! Prior to my conversion, while still attending the Roman Catholic church several years ago, I made the same serious error of identifying faith and obedience as being "equivalent" and I even basically defined faith "as" obedience. Coming to finally understand that faith receives grace and obedience reflects it led me to place my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Ephesians 2:8,9) That was my turning point to salvation.