Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

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GWH said:
Yes, whether to believe God's Word or Satan's lie.
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Yeo a naturally wicked heart does believe satan lie, thats.when the will of God's prick in there conscience takes over to help them believe God, something which a naturally wicked heart can not do by it's self.

And then a saved heart needs the will of God's will power in there hearts to overcome.

However in your head you did it all by yourself
 
Mem said:
Then I've seen actual pictures of a place that looked like a skull that is claimed to be Golgotha so I'm not sure it is a myth (given that doesn't prove that Jesus was or wasn't actually crucified in that exact place). And although verse offered is a strong lead toward your claim, wasn't Jesus was crucified outside of Jerusalem?
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He could have been crucified on the Mt of Olives across the Kidron Valley from Jerusalem, which is outside the city. I'm talking about the part of the Mt of Olives that is called the Mt of Corruption, where Solomon set up idolatrous groves for his pagan wives/concubines. I believe that is where the red heifer used to cleanse the temple was slain. Ancient caves in that area give it a skull-like appearance. I'll see if I can find some pictures.
 
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Cameron143 said:
The verse is simple. It was given to saved individuals to believe on Christ. It was not given to those who don't believe to believe on Christ. It's no more complicated than that. When God gives to an individual to believe on Christ, they believe on Christ. If He doesn't, individuals remain in unbelief.
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Nonsense. Then they would indeed have an "excuse".

so that they are without excuse.
 
cv5 said:
Nonsense. Then they would indeed have an "excuse".

so that they are without excuse.
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Nonsense the prick in the naturally wicked heart conscience delivered by God is enough to help them believe.

That's only how they are heid accountable for every careless word spoken,

However in your head your own faith you grew personally was enough
 
cv5 said:
Nonsense. Then they would indeed have an "excuse".

so that they are without excuse.
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Never said men aren't without excuse. Romans 1 teaches that man can know of God through creation and conscience and so are without excuse. Doesn't alter anything I posted.
 
Mem said:
I'd heard that they (must've?) put on flesh in order to... what would it be called... fraternize? with females. I'd also heard that these same angels taught women how to apply makeup, but that they were created with sexual ability is a novel idea to me.
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Yeah, belongs in the conspiracies forum or trash bin, not the Bible discussion forum.
 
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Cameron143 said:
Thus far, people have simply obfuscated without dealing with the verse itself.
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The usual response from free willers entails a number of choices which they freely avail themselves of rather than dealing
with the truth of Scripture: reject what is written, rewrite what is written, contradict what is written, deny what is written.
After telling us how words have meaning, they love to decimate the meanings of words and then they use wrong words.
 
Jordon said:
Nonsense the prick in the naturally wicked heart conscience delivered by God is enough to help them believe.

That's only how they are heid accountable for every careless word spoken,

However in your head your own faith you grew personally was enough
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Oohhhh so now you are coming around to the thesis set forth by @Genez are you?
Calvinism kicked to the curb?
 
Cameron143 said:
Never said men aren't without excuse. Romans 1 teaches that man can know of God through creation and conscience and so are without excuse. Doesn't alter anything I posted.
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Nope.
Here's their excuse......you provided it yourself: "its God's fault". Same excuse as Satan uses.

"It was not given to those who don't believe to believe on Christ."
 
HeIsHere said:
Gatekeepers, good description, reminds me of this...

View attachment 280998
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The thing is, Calvinism introduces (patently unbiblical) impossible and absurd paradoxes, thereby sowing doubt, fear, guilt, and all of the mental anguish that goes along with it. Balls and chains galore.

This of course reeks of draconian cultic tyranny.

Glad that I am on the outside of the Calvinist prison looking in......;)
 
Cameron143 said:
Thus far, people have simply obfuscated without dealing with the verse itself.
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29 For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe in him, but also to suffer for him,

Notice:

1. Paul does not use the noun "faith" he uses the infinitive verb "to believe"
Paul is not stating faith is gift in the verse, nor is he speaking about saving faith.

I can explain further if you need a lesson in grammar.

2. According to the BDAG "granted" is explained using "privilege" also has the meaning of "opportunity"
Confirmed by non-Calvinist scholars like Norman Geisler.
Calvinists seem to scoff at exegesis and context, so we now this will be refuted.

The Philippians have been given opportunity/privilege to believe along with being given the opportunity/privilege to suffer for Christ Jesus.

It is a choice people make, just like suffering, even as a privilege for all people who chose to believe, this in no way means it is unconditional selection by God of an created class of beings for salvation.

Now go mining for other verses with words like "given" so we can de-calvinize them. Thank you.

#contextkillscalvinism
 
HeIsHere said:
29 For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe in him, but also to suffer for him,

Notice:

1. Paul does not use the noun "faith" he uses the infinitive verb "to believe"
Paul is not stating faith is gift in the verse, nor is he speaking about saving faith.

I can explain further if you need a lesson in grammar.

2. According to the BDAG "granted" is explained using "privilege" also has the meaning of "opportunity"
Confirmed by non-Calvinist scholars like Norman Geisler.
Calvinists seem to scoff at exegesis and context, so we now this will be refuted.

The Philippians have been given opportunity/privilege to believe along with being given the opportunity/privilege to suffer for Christ Jesus.

It is a choice people make, just like suffering, even as a privilege for all people who chose to believe, this in no way means it is unconditional selection by God of an created class of beings for salvation.

Now go mining for other verses with words like "given" so we can de-calvinize them. Thank you.

#contextkillscalvinism
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Easy as pie......:sneaky:

I mean, crack open BDAG for 3 minutes and poof there goes Calvinism like so much fog at the noonday sun.
 
cv5 said:
Oohhhh so now you are coming around to the thesis set forth by @Genez are you?
Calvinism kicked to the curb?
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You've got a screw loose.

Gods word is not set fourth by my genez, further more Gods prick to a naturally wicked heart conscience is God's enabling grace. It's not mr genezes enabling grace neither is it yours.

Further more the prick to the conscience speaks to your conscience because the naturally wicked heart can not believe neither does it hear neither does it behave without the prick to the conscience.

However you and mister know it all Mr genez think you both know it all, and attribute this believe to an argument self credit and all the rest of it, Your both totally disturbed
 
Jordon said:
You've got a screw loose.

Gods word is not set fourth by my genez, further more Gods prick to a naturally wicked heart conscience is God's enabling grace. It's not mr genezes enabling grace neither is it yours.

Further more the prick to the conscience speaks to your conscience because the naturally wicked heart can not believe neither does it hear neither does it behave without the prick to the conscience.

However you and mister know it all Mr genez think you both know it all, and attribute this believe to an argument self credit and all the rest of it, Your both totally disturbed
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Funny how the words "enabling grace" do not appear in that verse.
 
HeIsHere said:
Funny how the words "enabling grace" do not appear in that verse.
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HeIsHere said:
Funny how the words "enabling grace" do not appear in that verse.
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since when is a prick delivered to a person conscience not enabling grace ?

What favour would the naturally wicked heart have without the prick delivered to conscience from God

Well the answer is only the devils favour in the naturally wicked heart .

And I tell you what if you fail to recognise this your an absolute spiritual fraud
 
Jordon said:
since when is a prick delivered to a person conscience not enabling grace ?

What favour would the naturally wicked heart have without the prick delivered to conscience from God

Well the answer is only the devils favour in the naturally wicked heart .

And I tell you what if you fail to recognise this your an absolute spiritual fraud
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Is your precious "system" built on a selected number of mined out of context verses being challenged to a point where perhaps you cannot really defend it?

I take that as a good thing.
 
reneweddaybyday said:
The fact that you and your friend think it's "gobbledygook" to put off the old man and put on the new man reveals much ... you and your friend should go back to your Chubby Checker ... smh.
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Satan is the one who comes to rob and steal....

He would rob you of any good sense you make with the Word if you give what he says a chance.

Some of the worst detractors among believers causing staying from the strait and narrow, are ones who have a strong weakness
for envy and jealousy.

They don't want others to have what they fail to have. Failing to that, grace would supply them as well.
Envy and jealousy produces selective stupidity. It sets up its defense by denial of the truth presented them.

If they would only humble themselves by facing the exposed error that they have been finding mutual pride in.
They are cherishing that bond more than the Lord Himself. But, they will deny that as well.

Jealousy and denial go out on blind dates.
 
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