Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Magenta]

Let us add in the details....

Scripture says, the world cannot receive the spirit of truth. Your view is, it can. Scripture says the man of flesh (unregenerated) cannot submit to or obey God. Your view is, he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot receive the spiritual things of God. Your view is, he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot understand the spiritual things of God. Your view is, he can. Scripture says a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. Your view is, it can. Scripture says the natural man is opposed to the spiritual things of God. Your view is, he is not. Scripture says the gospel is hid. Your view is, the gospel is not hid. Jesus said not everyone hears. Your view is, everyone hears. Scripture says flesh serves the law of sin and brings forth fruit unto death. Your view is, the flesh can choose to make a decision a plethora of Scriptures say it cannot, to bring forth fruit unto life. Scripture says the devil has taken people captive to do his will. Your view is, man has a will that is free. Scripture says no man can come to God unless God draws them. Your view is, divine intervention is not necessary. Your view is, man has everything he needs to come to believe. Scripture makes plain certain things are only known through the Spirit and revelation which you continually denigrate. Scripture shows over and over again from Genesis all the way through to Revelation that God reveals Himself differently from one person to the next. Your view is, God is unfair if He were to reveal Himself in any way differently from one person to the next. Your view is those you disagree with should preach in cemeteries, then you lie about conflating spiritual death with physical death. Your view is to not only blaspheme God yourself, but agree with those who blaspheme God in other ways. Along with other free willers, you come across as despising God's sovereignty, and call Him doing things for His own purposes doing them for no good reason. No matter how you look at it, your theological stance on this issue directly contradicts and outright denies what the Bible explicitly articulates in a number of places, and you are not likely to change it any time soon because to bring your view into line with what Scripture actually teaches would bring your whole house of cards down, and demolish your vain self-exalting stance. You cannot have that, since you are far too attached to it. One could even say you were in love with it. You certainly love it more than the Truth of Scripture.

 

[Rufus]

no idea ... scratchin' my head over his claim that "Adam wanted to be just like God" when the record clearly states it was Eve who saw that the tree was one to make one wise after satan told her about being "as god".
.

Of course Adam wanted to be just like God -- just like Lucifer did! Adam wanted his eyes to be open and to have the kind of knowledge only his Creator had at that point in time. And he wanted all this in spite of all the knowledge of and personal experience with his Creator.

 

[Genez]

According to you, not me. The promise of salvation is to those who believe not those who are alive.

They keep failing to understand one thing.
How the POWER of God's grace operates in drawing one to salvation.

Fuzzy thinking when it comes to what it means that we are saved by grace.
In the drawing of God, the operation of God's power of grace is to force down the tyrannical flesh over the soul, and to raise up the soul to allow that soul to make a choice that would otherwise be impossible without grace.

That is where they lose understanding.

They do not understand the function of the human soul well enough, while dogmatically following a formula (TULIP) which they can not explain when asked.

The best they can come up with is "irresistible grace," which they can not explain. Irresistible grace amounts to a hocus-pocus salvation, which they try to explain away by using God's sovereignty as the means to hide their wizard hiding behind the curtain.

Sane by grace ............

 

[Genez]

Scripture says, the world cannot receive the spirit of truth. Your view is, it can.

A soul can only receive the spirit of truth when the power of God's grace holds down the deafening and blinding flesh!

God's drawing is God presenting to the soul moments of seeing in their minds a taste of spiritual reality.
They may see it as fantasy. But God evaluates what that soul thinks towards what it was shown by grace.

 

[Magenta]

It is called being made alive with Christ, and being drawn with loving kindness. All your worthless unBiblical opinions are just that.

Ephesians 2:4-7 ~ Because of His great love for us, God, Who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved! And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might display the surpassing riches of His grace, demonstrated by His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

 

[cv5]

We have clearly and consistently delineated between the morally arbitrary god of Calvinism from the true God of scripture.

What is more blasphemous than to deny that Christ Jesus died for all!!

A salvation that is not FREELY available to ALL......is no salvation at all.

 

[Magenta]

John 6 v 37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.

 

[cv5]

So you admit I don't reject the rapture. Awesome.

While I do believe God has chosen a people for Himself in eternity past, I don't believe God forces salvation upon anyone. All who receive God's offer of salvation do so by their own will. If you actually read attempting to understand rather than denigrate, you could learn much. So contrary to what you say, it is your misunderstanding and prejudice that makes my doctrine seem inconsistent, and not what I actually post.

But as little in the way of edification results from a discourse with you, I'll bid you grace and peace.

I could easily prove what I said, and prove that you just now have "pivoted". Because these posts of yours are on record where you have unequivocally admitted to super-determinism.

But I'm just too busy to bother dredging them up....again. Because I already have. Multiple times. To expose your belief system for what it is.

As for "rapture", you have already declared that you are post-mil. No soon future rapture of the Bride is your belief. Right? No re-commissioning of the NATION Israel to service etc etc.

Right little buddy?

You know little buddy, you went from "vague" all the way to "denial" of your earlier admitted beliefs. So the question is.....why?

 

[cv5]

It is called being made alive with Christ, and being drawn with loving kindness. All your worthless unBiblical opinions are just that.

Ephesians 2:4-7 ~ Because of His great love for us, God, Who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved! And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might display the surpassing riches of His grace, demonstrated by His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

So you disavow the Reformed doctrine of "pre-birth sovereign lottery"? And you are now a "free-willer" (whom you say are blasphemers) and now a volitionalist?

 

[cv5]

Let us add in the details....


All (those selected by God in advance, before time) who receive God's offer of salvation do so by their own will (which can only be done after they have been regenerated).

Welp....as you can see, here come the vague wet blankets, dodges, misdirection, and denials.

As soon as the dust settles, they are gonna be back in business selling their wares to the unwary.

 

[Genez]

Oh...I see. So what you're saying is that you and your other FW comrades are totally free of all obstinacy and intolerance when it comes to your own opinions or prejudices. And this freedom accounts for how you and your ilk can shamelessly and audaciously blaspheme God, deliberately mischaracterize the Reformed Faith and glibly pervert the Word of God. Self-righteous much?

Unless you programmed some AI software to act like your persona?
Why not show us the way out, starting with your own deeply embedded obstinacy and prejudice?

You're a silly man who thinks he is dangerous.

 

[BillyBob]

Many of the comments concerning regeneration, [being made new], tend to sound as though it it has an instant [noticeable] effect on a person. However, I believe that this could happen on the day of your birth.
It seems to be God's method of setting aside those whom He wishes to save. It does not mean that you are saved immediately. It simply enables you to become saved.
A person who has been [made new] may continue on for many years as an unbeliever. However, God has set the time and method to finish the job, and it will take place on His schedule.
Those not renewed, will never come to faith. They are lost and without hope.

Just my opinion. . . . .

 

[Genez]

Let us add in the details....


All (those selected by God in advance, before time) who receive God's offer of salvation do so by their own will (which can only be done after they have been regenerated).

God in eternity past, selected out of all people whom He knows would believe, to be the chosen for who would be the Bride of Christ.

That is what God chose us for!
To be the Bride of Christ!

OT Jews were not selected and chosen to become the Bride!

grace and peace .........

 

[Rufus]

Why was John asking people to repent if they were not free to do so? That is my point: this is a scripture that SHOWS we have free will.

Before Jesus had died on the cross, he told people to go and sin no more. These were not people regenerated in the Holy spirit, for the spirit had not been given. His blood had not been shed, yet Jesus expected them to freely choose to stop sinning.

Moses was regenerated. But, he did not have the permanently indwelling Holy Spirit.

Regeneration restores to us the human spirit.
The human spirit that makes us able to comprehend God's Word.

For the Church, the indwelling Holy Spirit exceeds that ability, and makes us able to be living (not just to comprehend) God's Word.

That is why we are told to walk in the Spirit.

Grace and peace .......... [/QUOTE]

For the same reason why God gave the Law of Moses to Israel to keep perfectly all the time under all circumstances.

 

[Magenta]

Many of the comments concerning regeneration, [being made new], tend to sound as though it it has an instant [noticeable] effect on a person. However, I believe that this could happen on the day of your birth.
It seems to be God's method of setting aside those whom He wishes to save. It does not mean that you are saved immediately. It simply enables you to become saved.
A person who has been [made new] may continue on for many years as an unbeliever. However, God has set the time and method to finish the job, and it will take place on His schedule.
Those not renewed, will never come to faith. They are lost and without hope.

Just my opinion. . . . .

Romans 8 verse 28 ~ We know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose.

 

[Magenta]

Romans 8 verse 29-30; Ephesians 1 verse 5 ~ Those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified. He predestined us for adoption as His sons through Jesus Christ, according to the good pleasure of His will.

 

[Magenta]

The human spirit that makes us able to comprehend God's Word.

Not sure who said this since the quote was messed up.

It is the Holy Spirit Who allows us to understand the spiritual things of God.

The human spirit, not so much, if at all.

 

[Rufus]

God in eternity past, selected out of all people whom He knows would believe, to be the chosen for who would be the Bride of Christ.

That is what God chose us for!
To be the Bride of Christ!

OT Jews were not selected and chosen to become the Bride!

grace and peace .........

Pure rubbish! You shamelessly parade your gross ignorance of the Holy Word of God!

Ezek 16:1-34
16:1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 "Son of man, confront Jerusalem with her detestable practices 3 and say, 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says to Jerusalem: Your ancestry and birth were in the land of the Canaanites; your father was an Amorite and your mother a Hittite. 4 On the day you were born your cord was not cut, nor were you washed with water to make you clean, nor were you rubbed with salt or wrapped in cloths. 5 No one looked on you with pity or had compassion enough to do any of these things for you. Rather, you were thrown out into the open field, for on the day you were born you were despised.

6 "'Then I passed by and saw you kicking about in your blood, and as you lay there in your blood I said to you, "Live!" 7 I made you grow like a plant of the field. You grew up and developed and became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare.

8 "'Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love, I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness. I gave you my solemn oath and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Sovereign LORD, and you became mine.

9 "'I bathed you with water and washed the blood from you and put ointments on you. 10 I clothed you with an embroidered dress and put leather sandals on you. I dressed you in fine linen and covered you with costly garments. 11 I adorned you with jewelry: I put bracelets on your arms and a necklace around your neck, 12 and I put a ring on your nose, earrings on your ears and a beautiful crown on your head. 13 So you were adorned with gold and silver; your clothes were of fine linen and costly fabric and embroidered cloth. Your food was fine flour, honey and olive oil. You became very beautiful and rose to be a queen. 14 And your fame spread among the nations on account of your beauty, because the splendor I had given you made your beauty perfect, declares the Sovereign LORD.

15 "'But you trusted in your beauty and used your fame to become a prostitute. You lavished your favors on anyone who passed by and your beauty became his. 16 You took some of your garments to make gaudy high places, where you carried on your prostitution. Such things should not happen, nor should they ever occur. 17 You also took the fine jewelry I gave you, the jewelry made of my gold and silver, and you made for yourself male idols and engaged in prostitution with them. 18 And you took your embroidered clothes to put on them, and you offered my oil and incense before them. 19 Also the food I provided for you — the fine flour, olive oil and honey I gave you to eat — you offered as fragrant incense before them. That is what happened, declares the Sovereign LORD.

20 "'And you took your sons and daughters whom you bore to me and sacrificed them as food to the idols. Was your prostitution not enough? 21 You slaughtered my children and sacrificed them to the idols. 22 In all your detestable practices and your prostitution you did not remember the days of your youth, when you were naked and bare, kicking about in your blood.

23 "'Woe! Woe to you, declares the Sovereign LORD. In addition to all your other wickedness, 24 you built a mound for yourself and made a lofty shrine in every public square. 25 At the head of every street you built your lofty shrines and degraded your beauty, offering your body with increasing promiscuity to anyone who passed by. 26 You engaged in prostitution with the Egyptians, your lustful neighbors, and provoked me to anger with your increasing promiscuity. 27 So I stretched out my hand against you and reduced your territory; I gave you over to the greed of your enemies, the daughters of the Philistines, who were shocked by your lewd conduct. 28 You engaged in prostitution with the Assyrians too, because you were insatiable; and even after that, you still were not satisfied. 29 Then you increased your promiscuity to include Babylonia, a land of merchants, but even with this you were not satisfied.

30 "'How weak-willed you are, declares the Sovereign LORD, when you do all these things, acting like a brazen prostitute! 31 When you built your mounds at the head of every street and made your lofty shrines in every public square, you were unlike a prostitute, because you scorned payment.

32 "'You adulterous wife! You prefer strangers to your own husband! 33 Every prostitute receives a fee, but you give gifts to all your lovers, bribing them to come to you from everywhere for your illicit favors. 34 So in your prostitution you are the opposite of others; no one runs after you for your favors. You are the very opposite, for you give payment and none is given to you.
NIV

 

[Rufus]

Not sure who said this since the quote was messed up.

It is the Holy Spirit Who allows us to understand the spiritual things of God.

The human spirit, not so much, if at all.

I did not write those words that were falsely attributed to me. For indeed, it is the Spirit of the Living God who gives understanding.

 

[Rufus]

God in eternity past, selected out of all people whom He knows would believe, to be the chosen for who would be the Bride of Christ.

That is what God chose us for!
To be the Bride of Christ!

OT Jews were not selected and chosen to become the Bride!

grace and peace .........

This prescience concept is found nowhere in scripture with respect to election.