Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Magenta]

Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. Stand firm, then, and do not be encumbered once more by a yoke of slavery. For in Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set you free from the law of sin and death. Now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the outcome is eternal life. 2 Corinthians 3 verse 17; Galatians 5 verse 1; Romans 8 verse 2; from Romans 6 verse 22

 

[Jordon]

Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. Stand firm, then, and do not be encumbered once more by a yoke of slavery. For in Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set you free from the law of sin and death. Now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the outcome is eternal life. 2 Corinthians 3 verse 17; Galatians 5 verse 1; Romans 8 verse 2; from Romans 6 verse 22

I hope you've got some good time out planned for today .or when you wake up after your sleep, I need to go for a nice walk and plan my week ahead, think about all the meals to cook today, and then get ready for the next oppression

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Peace in your heart and mind is something most clearly felt, which is not in a worldly sense, remembering truths only really come from believing in these truths.
You aways remember what is important.

The peace that surpasses understanding is experienced in the life of the born again one ... even though we do not fully comprehend it ... that is why this peace surpasses our understanding.

Like doing everything to please the lord is important , those truths are truths that lead to the riches of his fruits of feeling joy in the heart..

That lead to messages being spoken in gladness when we do things to please the lord he is rewards us with the riches of What he has placed in our heart.

Gladness is a very special joy

Psalm 30:4-5 Sing unto the LORD, O ye saints of his, and give thanks at the remembrance of his holiness. For his anger endureth but a moment; in his favour is life: weeping may endure for a night, but joy cometh in the morning.


when you are in the mood for music, check out this song ... Joy in the Morning ...

.

 

[Jordon]

I am not going through a trial right now ... two weeks ago, yes, I was going through a difficult time ... but I am through that right now ... God saw me through and all is good. thank you for your care and concern.





my trust is in my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ ... we, as a body of believers, are to come together in caring for one another. At this moment in time, the widow of Charlie Kirk ... who is going through a really really difficult time at this very moment ... is in need of prayer (she and her family). Eleven years ago I went through what she is going through now ... and it is devastating. God is the One Who brought me through the loss of my very good best friend and husband. While I miss my good best friend every single day, Erika Kirk is in need of prayer at this time.





all of the definitions of "free willer" that have been provided thus far do not encompass what I believe ... so, in the very words of those who use the term, I am not a "free willer".





do you believe "free willers" are born again?
.

there's a lot to reply to here and it be wouldn't fair to apply to this straight away , but maybe your taking to much on at moment and your brain is like saying i need to care for myself at the moment.
Which is what I'm doing now.
Id rather talk about things that are not problematic with you, but texting is difficult.
I take it you've got friends to talk to there ? Face to face

Talk to them about your upset it will soon pass hopefully

 

[Cameron143]

I do not mean to exasperate anyone ... I just wanted clarification because of what I thought was the meaning ... appreciate your time in responding.

I looked up "outworking of salvation" and found that it is a tenet of the reformed theology.

AI defines "outworking of salvation" as follows:

It refers to the lifelong process by which a believer grows in holiness and lives in a way that reflects their new nature in Christ. ​

​

This outworking is not a way to earn salvation but is the necessary evidence and result of it. This distinction is crucial to understanding the Reformed view. ​

​

is that an accurate understanding? ... just asking so I can understand terms being used without causing undue exasperation.
.

No. By outworking of salvation I simply mean what happens as people are saved. What you refer to comes from Philippians 2:12.

 

[Cameron143]

What is this? Why are you attempting to disavow and run away from your cherished religious doctrine little buddy?

Be prepared for more of the same type of devastating expose tomorrow. I expect that you will be running for the hills.

That's what you don't understand. I haven't run from any belief I hold. You believe that truth makes some things mutually exclusive when it doesn't. Hence, you can't understand how truth is reconciled. For you, things are either or. Truth is both and. Until you can wrap your head around that, you will continue to err and misrepresent people.

 

[Cameron143]

Is that so? Well be prepared for that checklist that I made earlier in the thread, all of which you agreed to. Remember that little buddy? I'm sure that you do. I will repost your responses. Just to keep you honest.....

Honesty isn't a problem with me. That, and lack of understanding, is what troubles you.

 

[cv5]

Honesty isn't a problem with me. That, and lack of understanding, is what troubles you.

LOL. Physician heal thyself.....

 

[Cameron143]

LOL. Physician heal thyself.....

Nothing like making a point and then seeing it evidenced.

 

[cv5]

That's what you don't understand. I haven't run from any belief I hold. You believe that truth makes some things mutually exclusive when it doesn't. Hence, you can't understand how truth is reconciled. For you, things are either or. Truth is both and. Until you can wrap your head around that, you will continue to err and misrepresent people.

Typical bafflegab pseudo-intellectual determinist response. Totally worthless and pointless, proving nor denying nothing.

The fact is that YOU say that NO determinist (or any person born into the world) is able or willing to.....repent. Or believe.
Therefore "God" did it for you. The repenting. And believing. Somehow.

And YOU say that in order for "God" to stand in for you and repent and believe for you (by sheer force and domination of will), you must FIRST OF ALL be "elected" by winning this "pre-birth sovereign lottery" that you definitely said that you agree to as being a valid precept of your belief system.

Which means that YOU did not do what the Bible says is necessary to be saved.

You, and the rest of your crew has made all of this crystal clear innumerable times.

 

[HeIsHere]

Who is "they"? Nobody?
Because the determinists' soteriology strictly FORBIDS this supposedly outrageous transgression of willful belief.

In fact, the Reformed view is that God cannot possibly accept anyone's faith, belief, trust, or anything of the sort, as it is a man-exalting "work", the very act of which invalidates and nullifies any erstwhile salvific benefit.

No, but a totally uninformed, abrupt mind-wipe is compulsory (devoid of informed consent or even perception), this being THE absolute necessary prerequisite for Calvinist-type salvation.

They SLIGHTEST effort in seeking, the MEREST whispered asking, the utterly useless beating of the chest and cries of repentance MUST be rejected by God at all times and in all circumstances, as God is insulted by the "natural man's" heinous efforts.

From the spirit of God!
Absolute fire.

 

[Cameron143]

Typical bafflegab pseudo-intellectual determinist response. Totally worthless and pointless, proving nor denying nothing.

The fact is that YOU say that NO determinist (or any person born into the world) is able or willing to.....repent. Or believe.
Therefore "God" did it for you. The repenting. And believing. Somehow.

And YOU say that in order for "God" to stand in for you and repent and believe for you (by sheer force and domination of will), you must FIRST OF ALL be "elected" by winning this "pre-birth sovereign lottery" that you definitely said that you agree to as being a valid precept of your belief system.

Which means that YOU did not do what the Bible says is necessary to be saved.

You, and the rest of your crew has made all of this crystal clear innumerable times.

I'm sure you are familiar with Galatians 2:20...I live...Christ lives in me.

Also, election is not selection. Learning the difference will allow you to understand why your lottery concept is ill-applied.

 

[HeIsHere]

I'm sure you are familiar with Galatians 2:20...I live...Christ lives in me.

Also, election is not selection. Learning the difference will allow you to understand why your lottery concept is ill-applied.

That is correct election is not selection, but the Reformed doctrine has taken a biblical concept and transformed it by bad textual and

contextual analysis into something completely foreign to scripture making it into salvation "for the selected" via a divine lottery system.

 

[BillyBob]

Repeat........
Kroogz said:
Isn't it interesting that the majority of reformed/calvie/tulip folks TRY to sound like freewillers on the surface?........As if they know the truth, but suppress it?

Very few, preach their straight-up determinist views. They shroud it with a counterfeit of freewill.

I agree! And we also have evil termites that are trying to destroy the earth from within!

 

[HeIsHere]

They is those who believe. Since lots of people believe, you misrepresented the truth.
Also, no one who is reformed denies volition. I've seen them acknowledging volition in their posts. Because you can't understand how the two things can be reconciled, you espouse your ignorance in your assertion that it isn't believed by those with a reformed bent.
Seeking, asking, and repentance are likewise acknowledged by those of the reformed faith. The difference they have with what you believe is the impetus for them. You believe they are the freewill choices of individuals. They believe they are the result of the activity of the Spirit.

So...what you say is false. That you can't understand the arguments of the reformed at this point and continue to misrepresent them is simply sad. Disagreeing is one thing, deliberate misrepresentation is altogether another.

Reformed teaches "particular regeneration before faith" and this is not evidenced in scripture, so everything else is moot.
And there is more to "will" than choosing socks.

 

[Cameron143]

That is correct election is not selection, but the Reformed doctrine has taken a biblical concept and transformed it by bad textual and

contextual analysis into something completely foreign to scripture making it into salvation "for the selected" via a divine lottery system.

You are in the same boat as @cv5. You insist things are that are not. And for the same reasons.

 

[Cameron143]

Reformed teaches "particular regeneration before faith" and this is not evidenced in scripture, so everything else is moot.
And there is more to "will" than choosing socks.

You can't admit what the Bible has made plain.

 

[lrs68]

Kinda but do you back to that place enough, do you go back to the place of presence , a private time, that place of affirmation, where do you go,

Is his affirmation set in your faith like a diamond that will shine forever.
Has the father changed you to the point where you know you have to do the right thing Because God is real.

Do you do things just to please God. Or do you do things just to please people

Have you felt his warmth when doing one of his wishes,

Have you felt his strength when you are weak

Have you felt his warmth when you've done an act of his work for him for anyone you know,

Have you seeked the lord to do his work.

I am Pentecostal and we believe walking and being in the presence of God continually. We believe God is the same yesterday and today and still active like we read in the Bible.

 

[BillyBob]

That is not a gift. That is being shanghaied and pressed into service. Potentially hazardous service.
But as we all know, for the determinist, there are no ***willing*** volunteers.......right?

"Shanghaiing or crimping is the practice of kidnapping people to serve as sailors by coercive techniques such as trickery, intimidation, or violence. Those engaged in this form of kidnapping were known as crimps. "

Perhaps you feel as you do simply because you have never experienced it?

 

[lrs68]

You lie and you redefine terms when your argument fails. Very un-Christian-like.

I actually clarify my original intentions because you continue to move the goal post.