The Kerygma - God's Requirement for Salvation

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I answered your right?

Did you see my 4 questions?

1. How do you think we get rid of our sins?
2. How do we get washing of regeneration?
3. WHY DO YOU SAY HE ONLY TOLD A FEW in Acts 2:38-39?
4. WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME WHAT IT SHOULD SAY in Acts 2:38-39?
I have answered multiple times

John 1: 11: 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12. But AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED HIM, to THEM he gave the right to become children, even TO THEM WHO BELIEVE 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (no works)

John 3, FOR God so loved the world he gave his only son that WHOEVER BELIEVES (trusts) in him will NEVER PERISH, and LIVE FOREVER (eternal life) for the son was not sent to judge, but that the world might be saved, he who BELIEVES is NOT CONDEMNED, he who does not believe is condemned already (no works)

John 4: 13 Jesus answered and said to her, “Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, 14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will NEVER THIRST. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into EVERLASTING LIFE” (no works)

John 5: 24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he whoever HEARS MY WORD and BELIEVES IN HIM WHO SENT ME who sent Me HAS ETERNAL LIFE and SHALL NOT COME INTO JUDGMENT but HAS PASSED FROM DEATH TO LIFE (No works)

John 6: 35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. HE WHO COMES TO ME shall NEVER HUNGER and he who BELIEVES IN ME shall NEVER THIRST (NO WORKS)

John 6: 37: and THE ONE WHO COMES TO ME I WILL BY NO MEANS CAST OUT 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, thatof all He has given Me I SHAL LOSE NOTHING, but SHOULD RAISE IT UP ON THE LAST DAY. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that EVERYONE WHO SEES AND BELIEVES IN HIM MAY HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE AND I WILL (NOT MIGHT) RAISE HIM ON THE LAST DAY (NO WORKS)

John 6: 47 Most assuredly, I say to you, HE WHO BELIEVES IN ME HAS EVERLASTING LIFE. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and are dead. 50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that THAT ONE MAY EAT OF IT AND NOT DIE 51 am the living bread which came down from heaven. IF ANYONE EATS THIS BREAD HE WILL LIVE FOREVER (NO WORKS)

John 6: 63 It is the SPIRIT WHO GIVES LIFE ; the flesh profits nothing. THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK to you ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE (SIGNIFYING THE BREAD FROM HEAVEN, THE FLESH AND BOOD ARE THE WORDS JESUS SPOKE. NOT THE PHYSICAL FOOD OR WORKS,)

EPH 1: 13 In Him YOU ALSO TRUSTED , after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also ,HAVING BELIEVED YOU WERE SEALED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT OF PROMISE 14 who IS THE GAURANTEE OF OUR INHERITANCE until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

THE INHERITANCE HE SAID WE ALREADY HAD IN THE 1ST 12 VERSES. (AGAIN, NO WORKS)

eph 2: 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses,MADE US ALIVE together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and RAISED US UP TOGETHER , and MADE US SIT TOGETHER IN HEAVENLY PLACES 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For BY GRACE YOU HAVE BEEN SAVED (A COMPLETED ACTION) THROUGH FAITH , (AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED) and that NOT OF YOURSELVES ; it IS THE GIFT OF GOD, 9 NOT OF WORKS LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST (NO WORKS)

rom 4: 3 For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND HE ACOUNTED IT TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” 4 Now TO HIM WHO WORKS, THE WAGES ARE NOT COUNTED AS GRACE BUT DEBT (Works cancels out grace. and makes it a wage) 5 But TO HIM WHO DOES NOT WORK but BELIEVES ON HIM WHO JUSTIFIES THE UNGOLDY , his HIS FAITH IS ACCOUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS (AGAIN NO WORKS. PERIOD)

rom 4: 16 Therefore IT IF OF FAITH THAT IT MAY BE ACCORDING TO GRACE , so that THE PROMISE MAY BE SURE TO ALL THE SEED not only to those who are of the law, but also TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM , who is the father of us all (AGAIN, NO WORKS, IT IS OF GRACE THROUGH FAITH)

Rom 4: 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but ALSO FOR US, IT SHALL BE IMPUTED TO US WHO BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED UP JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD , 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was RAISED BECAUSE OF OUR JUSTIFICATION (AGAIN NO WORKS)

Rom 11: 6 And IF BY GRACE, THAN IT IS NO LONGER OF WORKS, ; otherwise GRACE IS NO LONGER GRACE.But IF IT IS OF WORKS, THEN IT IS NO LONGER OF GRACE. OTHERWISE WORK IS NO LONGER WORK (AS i HAVE SAID NUMEROUS TIME, GRACE + WORKS = WORKS.. GRACE AND WORKS CAN NOT MIX IN THE AREA OF SALVATION. ITS LIKE MIXING OIL AND WATER)

2 Tim 1: 9 who HAS SAVED US (A COMPLETED ACTION) and called us with a holy calling, NOT ACCORDING TO OUR WORKS , but ACCORDING TO HIS OWN PURPOSE AND GRACE which was GIVEN TO US in Christ Jesus BEFORE TIME BEGAN (AGAIN, NO WORKS. BUT GRACE)

Titus 3: 4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS (GOOD DEEDS) WHICH WE HAVE DONE , but ACCORDING TO HIS MERCY HE SAVED US through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that HAVING BEEN JUSTIFIED BY HIS GRACE we should become HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE
(AGAIN, NO QUESTION HERE. PAUL LEAVES NO QUESTION. NO GOOD DEED CAN SAVE US,. WE ARE SAVED BY GODS MERCY, AND GIVEN THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE. WHICH IS PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN


Titus 1: 2
in HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE which GOD WHO CAN NOT LIE PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN

this is what our faith is in, the grace and mercy of God. not our deeds.
 
So have you received the Holy Ghost since you have believed?

If all you have to do is beleive then devils are also saved.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
For by grace you have been saved by faith

Mere belief never saved anyone..

James 2 is discussing people who claim to have faith. but have no evidence that they every trusted God.

Demons do not trust God for salvation.. thats the point. do you just believe.. thats great, even demons believe.

But do you trust God

From your discussion. it seems you trust your work. not God
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
He was made alive along time ago

Have you? or are you still dead..
How do you know he was made live? He's not following what he is told to do.

I like Paul have to die daily, but I have been baptized in JESUS name and HE has filled me with HIS spirit.

I stll ask you AND HIM have you been filled with the Holy Ghost since you have believed?

Don't leave earth without it.
 
How do you know he was made live? He's not following what he is told to do.
Actually he did

He trusted Christ. and not himself.

then after he was saved, He started doing what God commanded him to do. things like getting baptized.

Just like i did

I like Paul have to die daily, but I have been baptized in JESUS name and HE has filled me with HIS spirit.
So your still dead. trying to earn your salvation. Got it

I stll ask you AND HIM have you been filled with the Holy Ghost since you have believed?
I was anointed by the HS after he baptized me 50 some years ago. I am not sure when Dan experienced this
Don't leave earth without it.
We have not. are you?
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
its no different really then jews adding the work of Circumcision.

Only this is less painful and easier to do..
Yes and Ouch, along with works-salvationists in general cannot seem to grasp the difference between mere "mental assent" belief in God (James 2:19) and saving belief in Christ. (Acts 16:31)

In James 2:19, see that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God," but they do not believe in/have faith in/trust in/reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. In other words the demons do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and are not saved.

Their trust and reliance are in Satan (and not in Jesus) as demonstrated by their rebellion in heaven and continuous evil works. There is a difference between mere "mental assent" belief (as the demons have) and saving belief in Christ, which the demons do not have, and only genuine believers do have.
 
Yes and Ouch, along with works-salvationists in general cannot seem to grasp the difference between mere "mental assent" belief in God (James 2:19) and saving belief in Christ. (Acts 16:31)

In James 2:19, see that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God," but they do not believe in/have faith in/trust in/reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. In other words the demons do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and are not saved.

Their trust and reliance are in Satan (and not in Jesus) as demonstrated by their rebellion in heaven and continuous evil works. There is a difference between mere "mental assent" belief (as the demons have) and saving belief in Christ, which the demons do not have, and only genuine believers do have.
I have yet to have anyone explain to me how I can have true saving faith that saves. and not trust in God on anything else.. to the point I have no works.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
Actually he did

He trusted Christ. and not himself.

then after he was saved, He started doing what God commanded him to do. things like getting baptized.

Just like i did


So you're still dead. trying to earn your salvation. Got it


I was anointed by the HS after he baptized me 50 some years ago. I am not sure when Dan experienced this

We have not. are you?

So you say?

Are you saying that when someone obeys the commanmandment and gets baptized to get rid of their sins they are trusting in themselves?

Be great to explain that one.

After you both were saved according to you not HIS word, then he obeyed the commanmandment?

So in your mind people can be saved in all of their sins just like you THINK you were.

THAT'S CRAZY but you do you.

Why would you say I'm still dead? According to you I did all you did except in different orders?

If this happened to you 50 years ago you would be able to SEE. I'm thinking of John 3:3.

Was it like this? If not how do you know you have the Holy Ghost?

Acts 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Acts 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Have you? I have no idea but I will also bet if you were baptized for show it was done in the name of the father, the son and the Holy Ghost.

Satan's plan, keep them out of the water and if they get in the water keep JESUS name out of it.
 
I have yet to have anyone explain to me how I can have true saving faith that saves. and not trust in God on anything else.. to the point I have no works.

Problem is what is the difference between work and obedience?

You don't think you have to trust in GOD to be saved?

When we obey him we have to have faith HE will do HIS part.

We need to obey to be reborn and follow HIS commandments.

After we have been reborn we need to work for HIM.

JESUS told HIS disciples NOT TO GO OUT WITHOUT A COMFORTER.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.
5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

Notice JESUS said two baptisms, John which is in water and the Holy GHost.

James 2:14-26
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Joshua 6:2 And the Lord said unto Joshua, See, I have given into thine hand Jericho, and the king thereof, and the mighty men of valour.
3 And ye shall compass the city, all ye men of war, and go round about the city once. Thus shalt thou do six days.
4 And seven priests shall bear before the ark seven trumpets of rams' horns: and the seventh day ye shall compass the city seven times, and the priests shall blow with the trumpets.
5 And it shall come to pass, that when they make a long blast with the ram's horn, and when ye hear the sound of the trumpet, all the people shall shout with a great shout; and the wall of the city shall fall down flat, and the people shall ascend up every man straight before him.

Joshua 6:20 So the people shouted when the priests blew with the trumpets: and it came to pass, when the people heard the sound of the trumpet, and the people shouted with a great shout, that the wall fell down flat, so that the people went up into the city, every man straight before him, and they took the city.

2 Kings 5:14-17
14 Then went he down, and dipped himself seven times in Jordan, according to the saying of the man of God: and his flesh came again like unto the flesh of a little child, and he was clean.
15 And he returned to the man of God, he and all his company, and came, and stood before him: and he said, Behold, now I know that there is no God in all the earth, but in Israel: now therefore, I pray thee, take a blessing of thy servant.
16 But he said, As the Lord liveth, before whom I stand, I will receive none. And he urged him to take it; but he refused.
17 And Naaman said, Shall there not then, I pray thee, be given to thy servant two mules' burden of earth? for thy servant will henceforth offer neither burnt offering nor sacrifice unto other gods, but unto the Lord.

Would the walls have fallen if they did NOT OBEY?
Would the man of been healed if he DIDN'T OBEY?

Just a COUPLE of examples of being obedient.
People humbled themselves and obeyed what they were told to do AND GOD held up HIS END.

Who is doing the work when a person gets baptized in JESUS name?

The person who humbles themself and is obedient to HIS word? No.
The person who is doing the baptizing? Yes, after we are reborn we have to work for HIM.
OR is it JESUS since HE IS THE ONE who if forgiving our sins?

Do you think JESUS sent YOU OUT with out the same tools as HE did HIS disciples?

If you do then JESUS has different rules for different people.

This is ALL IN LOVE, it's not about me being right I'm not the one who died for you.

Our walk is between us and HIM alone.
 
Problem is what is the difference between work and obedience?

You don't think you have to trust in GOD to be saved?
Ok Dude, time for you to back off. I never made any such comments or insinuated I believed anything of the sort.

Read my post. I asked how someone could believe we have true saving faith... and you ask me if I do not believe I have to trust God???



If you are unable or unwilling to sit and actually listen people to understand what they say, and not come in and make these rude untrue statements to them, then again, i will just assume your another in a long line of trolls trying to push their legalism down others throats.

I backed off this thought when you at least tried to answer questions.. But if your going to act like the and lie about me.. we will go no where
 
So you say?

Are you saying that when someone obeys the commanmandment and gets baptized to get rid of their sins they are trusting in themselves?
What what you just posted.

Dan and I got baptized because God told us to. A work of obedience expecting nothing in return. we did it because we trust God. not only that he saved us, but that he is trustworthy.

You got baptized in order to merit the forgiveness of sins a work of merit

we are not the same
 
What what you just posted.

Dan and I got baptized because God told us to. A work of obedience expecting nothing in return. we did it because we trust God. not only that he saved us, but that he is trustworthy.

You got baptized in order to merit the forgiveness of sins a work of merit

we are not the same

After reading you comment, I was supprized you wer so angry, but I see the problem.

I have yet to have anyone explain to me how I can have true saving faith that saves. and not trust in God on anything else.. to the point I have no works.

When I read your statement I read nd not trust in God OR anything else.

I am sorry Please forgive me.

Being baptized in JESUS name is not legalism is being obeident.

I followed HIS word and got baptized to get rid of my sins PEOIRD.

Meaning we are not the same, I OBEYED HIS RULE BOOK you didn't.
 
If all you have to do is beleive then devils are also saved.

interesting question:

did He offer His blood to cleanse the sins of angels?

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

obvious question:

is James saying that devils believe there is only one God, or is he saying that they believe Christ has accomplished their salvation, and they trust Him to complete it?

another obvious question:

has anyone ever said that being monotheistic is salvation?
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
interesting question:

did He offer His blood to cleanse the sins of angels?



obvious question:

is James saying that devils believe there is only one God, or is he saying that they believe Christ has accomplished their salvation, and they trust Him to complete it?

another obvious question:

has anyone ever said that being monotheistic is salvation?

There is ONLY one way to be reborn.

Acts 2:38-39
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

After JESUS fills you with HIS spirit he will lead to.
 
There is ONLY one way to be reborn.

Acts 2:38-39
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

After JESUS fills you with HIS spirit he will lead to.

you didn't address any of the questions..
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
you didn't address any of the questions..


@Ouch OK i'll field the easy one - -

obvious question:

is James saying that devils believe there is only one God, or is he saying that they believe Christ has accomplished their salvation, and they trust Him to complete it?


James 2:19 is categorically not saying demons are condemned for having faith in Christ but insufficient works.
so, you completely abused it as a proof text.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Everlasting-Grace
@Ouch OK i'll field the easy one - -




James 2:19 is categorically not saying demons are condemned for having faith in Christ but insufficient works.
so, you completely abused it as a proof text.

That FOR SURE DOES ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

You can read it for your self if you like it says what it says.

James to taling to,
James 2:1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

He is telling his brethren THEY believe their in ONE GOD which is JESUS then THEY DO WELL.

How many GODS are there? DO YOU DO WELL?

Then he says the devils also believe, and tremble.

Why are you adding to scripture with your opinion.

"James 2:19 is categorically not saying demons are condemned for having faith in Christ but insufficient works.
so, you completely abused it as a proof text."

IT DOES NOT SAY DEMONS HAVE FAITH AT ALL LET ALONE WORKS!!!!

WOW TALK ABOUT PUTTING WORDS IN GOD'S MOUTH!!!!!!

What is does say is they BELIEVE AND TREMBLE.

Demons don't obey JESUS or work for him, the only times Satan and his team listen to JESUS is when JESUS follows use JESUS name to cast them out.

James is sharing which proves that just believing DOESN'T WORK.