The commentary in my NIV says that "the vague imagery and referents of the passage make a definitive decision difficult".
(IOW, your guess is as good as anyone's :^)
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The commentary in my NIV says that "the vague imagery and referents of the passage make a definitive decision difficult".
(IOW, your guess is as good as anyone's :^)
In the same chapter in 2 Thess 2 besides speaking of the Restrainer it speaks of the coming of the Lord, and our gathering to meet Him,
and the Day of the Lord.
We know from Dan 9:27 that the antichrist takes his seat in the middle of the 7 which is 1260 days in the Tribulation and then it speaks of the Restrainer.
Only makes sense if it is the church!
and the Day of the Lord.
We know from Dan 9:27 that the antichrist takes his seat in the middle of the 7 which is 1260 days in the Tribulation and then it speaks of the Restrainer.
Only makes sense if it is the church!
God, Father of risen Son be the restrainer, the Holy Spirit, why?
The time to be over is not yet ready. yet the time is nearer then when Jesus was risen for new life to get given in Daddy's Spirit and Truth to us. Those that are willing for Daddy's will. Will see it and stand in it
Peter talks of why is it taking so long. God desires for no one to perish. That day will come. Today is the day to believe consciously or not, between God and self
As each person knows this truth in them already. All know per Col 1, 2 thank you
I believe the restrainer is the same one for the last 4000 years. The Holy Spirit. During the Tower of Babel we had the proto anti-Christ and the proto world kingdom.
Genesis 11:6-7
And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
7Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech
So this is what I find is actually being restrained from the Tower to now. The rise of the man of perdition and that final kingdom, all we imagine. In the past from the the tower to the death of Christ and his return to the Father. The restraint was done in the confounding of language.
I believe that the Holy Spirit was using the languages of mankind to restrain. However, with the outpouring of the Spirit and the gift of tongues. I believe the method employed changed to the church. With the Spirit dwelling in the Temple of God, us the church and him restraining from that vantage point.
Matthew 16:18
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
The word gates is pyle in the Greek and this is what Strong's has to say on the matter.
4439 pýlē (a feminine noun) – a large door; an entrance-gate to a city or fortress; a door-gate. 4439 /pýlē ("a door-gate") typically refers to the exit people go out, i.e. focusing on what proceeds out of it.
https://biblehub.com/greek/4439.htm
So the emphasis on the gates of hell is not a entrance but a exit. They are not able to prevail because they are being held shut. In Revelations we have verses that show what comes up from the bottomless pit.
So I believe that this what is being spoken about in 2 Thessalonians 2 concerning the restrainer and what is being restrained. We can pick up after the restraint is removed reading Revelations chapter 5 and 6. Christ taking the book and opening the first seal unleashing the anti-Christ whom he will destroy with his coming.
Genesis 11:6-7
And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
7Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech
So this is what I find is actually being restrained from the Tower to now. The rise of the man of perdition and that final kingdom, all we imagine. In the past from the the tower to the death of Christ and his return to the Father. The restraint was done in the confounding of language.
I believe that the Holy Spirit was using the languages of mankind to restrain. However, with the outpouring of the Spirit and the gift of tongues. I believe the method employed changed to the church. With the Spirit dwelling in the Temple of God, us the church and him restraining from that vantage point.
Matthew 16:18
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
The word gates is pyle in the Greek and this is what Strong's has to say on the matter.
4439 pýlē (a feminine noun) – a large door; an entrance-gate to a city or fortress; a door-gate. 4439 /pýlē ("a door-gate") typically refers to the exit people go out, i.e. focusing on what proceeds out of it.
https://biblehub.com/greek/4439.htm
So the emphasis on the gates of hell is not a entrance but a exit. They are not able to prevail because they are being held shut. In Revelations we have verses that show what comes up from the bottomless pit.
So I believe that this what is being spoken about in 2 Thessalonians 2 concerning the restrainer and what is being restrained. We can pick up after the restraint is removed reading Revelations chapter 5 and 6. Christ taking the book and opening the first seal unleashing the anti-Christ whom he will destroy with his coming.
I agree with Sacredwarrior that the Archangel Michael is the one that restrains Satan until it is time for him to be revealed. That time will be when Michael and his angels cast Satan out of heaven down to earth as written in Rev 12:7-10. I also believe it is Michael that will bind Satan with a chain and throw him into the bottomless pit as written in Rev 20:1-3. The big thing to remember is that Satan will come first, before Jesus, claiming to be God. Do not allow yourself to fall away in his deception, but rather stand against him to expose his lies.
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Satan is not the man called the antichrist. Even in the scriptures Satan and his angels are not thrown down till after middle of the Tribulation.
To me it seems a good possibility it's the Holy Spirt. But I don't buy the argument that the Holy Spirit will vanish at a pre-trib rapture of the ekklesia, so His influence will no longer restrain the lawless one. It probably just means the Holy Spirit's restraining influence will be taken away at the proper time. This isn't the only explanation though; it could just be some restrainer in heaven whom God appointed.
I once agreed that it was the Holy Spirit but then again the church seems to be more likely seeing that things escalated when the time of the Gentiles are finished.
Some speculate that the rapture occurs while others who don't believe in the rapture point to Israel as becoming a independent nation that is isolated by the new world order.
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The Beast out of the earth-------the antichrist
Is a beast out of the earth mentioned in 2 Thess. 2 ?
In your mind, which verse mentions the antichrist being restrained?
It seems to me that the day of the Lord, or the Lord's coming, is being delayed.
Right?
I wonder, of those who think otherwise, if they have never been restrained by the Holy Spirit personally. Personal restraint is a foundational instruction from the Holy Spirit to all who are His in Christ.
Restraint is a function of love. I know of no reference in the scriptures that speak to an angel's ability to love. Simply: love is not required of the servants, only obedience.
Paul said: "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal."
Paul was restrained neither by the church or by the angels. Love restrained him and that, by the Holy Spirit.
Consider he was forbidden to travel to Asia because of the Spirit:
"Now when they had gone through Phrygia and the region of Galatia, they were forbidden by the Holy Spirit to preach the word in Asia."
And Bithynia (part of modern day Turkey)...
"After they had come to Mysia, they tried to go into Bithynia, but the Spirit did not permit them."
But Paul is given a vision.
So passing by Mysia, they came down to Troas. 9 And a vision appeared to Paul in the night. A man of Macedonia stood and pleaded with him, saying, “Come over to Macedonia and help us.” 10 Now after he had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go to Macedonia, concluding that the Lord had called us to preach the gospel to them.
So Paul heads to Macedonia.
Now Who gave Paul that vision? The answer is below:
‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God,
That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh;
Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
Your young men shall see visions,
Your old men shall dream dreams.
Interestingly, Paul was considered a "young man" at this time because he was given a vision.
But the point is Paul was given the vision by the Holy Spirit.
Did Paul not have the ability to do what he wanted apart from the direction of the Spirit? No, not if he wanted to remain faithful to the Lord. He certainly could go wherever he wanted, but to do so would put him outside of the grace of God.
This is just the tee-up. Pardon me for summarizing the swing: No authority functions without the consent of the Spirit, the Delegate of the Lord Jesus Christ in the earth. God to Christ to the Spirit to man is the Organizational Chart of God's Kingdom.
Certainly, without the permission of the Spirit, no evil may persecute the church or prosper.
The Spirit Restrains. He restrains the whole of creation. In my estimation, The Spirit has been withdrawing His restraint from creation for some time now.
The above is why we will not only see wickedness thrive in the last Days (in which we are) but all manner of shakings in the physical creation, too: earthquakes, tsunamis, storms, and even falling stars.
Which has been for decades mine as well. Problem with that view is, it doesn't line up with the Lord's signal definition of His lasting presence, ,
And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever (Jn 14:16)
Would it not be more in line with a condition, or result of a condition within, ,
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine (2Tim 4:3)
No stronger clue that I am aware of, but do enlighten me if need be!
The Holy Spirit will not leave His people.
This is about the world becoming unrestrained.
The world only? Yea, a subject as old as the Church. But look at the times in which a significant number of Denominations have justified for themselves to embrace a traitors' dream of lawlessness (Border harbors). Yet, I'm not sure who is at the greater fault, the Christ-bearing, Spirit-quenching traitors, or those of us who resist calling them out?
Yeah. The removal of restraint reveals the true nature of things... like people in the pews who are worldly.
No problem - when the Holy spirit is withdrawn ( as He was in EZEK 10) WE GO WITH HIM to his presence remains with us (THE CHURCH). thise left never had His Presence with them at all.
I'm not sure exactly why you automatically assume the restraint being removed equals the restrainer ceasing to exist or something like that. Don't get me wrong I understand what you're saying and see clearly why you'd make this argument really, but I don't see that this "HAS" to mean it in the sense that you're suggesting. I don't see "taken out of the way" having to mean that they are just gone from existence, earth, or anything like that, it could just mean "let them go now" , stop holding. To me it sounds more like moved out of the way, I just don't think this argument is as cut and dry as you're presenting here.