A misconception of obedience
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It is crucial to realize (which many in the comments do not) that pursuing holiness and trying to live in accordance with God's word is a response to God's love and grace, not relying on self. Grace is a gift from God that is accessed by faith (Eph. 2:8-9; Rom. 5:2). When one has faith, they want to live a life that honors God and is consistent with His teachings. 1 Peter 1:15–16 exhorts us to be holy. Seeking holiness is about loving God and being thankful, not about relying on self for salvation.
A saving faith will not be dead, as it will be a faith that works/obeys (Jms. 2:14-26). Our obedience demonstrate our love and devotion to God, as we desire to live according to His word (Jn. 8:31, 14:15, 23-24). Obedience does not earn or negate grace. Following God's word is a result of your relationship with Him, not earning salvation or relying on self. God’s grace instructs us to live for Him (Titus 2:11-12; Rom. 6:1) and when we obey God, He is working in us, (Phil. 2:12-13), as those are His words that are in our lives working, not ours. God’s grace is the source of our spiritual growth and obedience. Our relationship with God begins and is sustained by His grace through our faith (Eph. 2:8; 1 Peter 1:5). It is His grace that instructs us to align our will with His will. This is how we grow in the grace of our Lord and Savior (2 Peter 3:18, 1:5-11), and continue in it (Acts 13:43).
God’s saving grace calls us to repentance (2 Peter 3:9) and restoration (Jms. 5:19-20). By following God's commands, we become more Christ-like and strengthen our bond with Him (2 Peter 1:5-8). Our obedience stems from a heart of love and gratitude. It's a reflection of our faith and trust in Him, and His grace enables us to live a life that honors Him.
The words of Jesus is filled with grace on how to be saved…and how to live such a life that demonstrates we are saved…one which glorifies Him so that we glorify the Father in heaven…the life we live is based on grace…as the teachings we have is founded…rooted…and filled with His amazing grace.
A saving faith will not be dead, as it will be a faith that works/obeys (Jms. 2:14-26). Our obedience demonstrate our love and devotion to God, as we desire to live according to His word (Jn. 8:31, 14:15, 23-24). Obedience does not earn or negate grace. Following God's word is a result of your relationship with Him, not earning salvation or relying on self. God’s grace instructs us to live for Him (Titus 2:11-12; Rom. 6:1) and when we obey God, He is working in us, (Phil. 2:12-13), as those are His words that are in our lives working, not ours. God’s grace is the source of our spiritual growth and obedience. Our relationship with God begins and is sustained by His grace through our faith (Eph. 2:8; 1 Peter 1:5). It is His grace that instructs us to align our will with His will. This is how we grow in the grace of our Lord and Savior (2 Peter 3:18, 1:5-11), and continue in it (Acts 13:43).
God’s saving grace calls us to repentance (2 Peter 3:9) and restoration (Jms. 5:19-20). By following God's commands, we become more Christ-like and strengthen our bond with Him (2 Peter 1:5-8). Our obedience stems from a heart of love and gratitude. It's a reflection of our faith and trust in Him, and His grace enables us to live a life that honors Him.
The words of Jesus is filled with grace on how to be saved…and how to live such a life that demonstrates we are saved…one which glorifies Him so that we glorify the Father in heaven…the life we live is based on grace…as the teachings we have is founded…rooted…and filled with His amazing grace.
Y’all can accuse me and others of “relying on self” etc etc but obedience to God out of love and devotion to Him in doing His will is never looked at relying on self, earning, boasting etc etc…as God gets the glory, as He is the one who gave us the way to have salvation. Not us. And a lot of people don’t know that.
Part of my thread that a couple seem to outright ignore or didn’t read…
“When we become a Christian and continue to follow Jesus, it isn’t showing how good we are, it’s showing how good He is (Jhn 10:11, 14, 27-28). Following Jesus doesn’t point back to our own righteousness, it points to His (Rom. 5:17, 21). Following Jesus isn’t looking to self for salvation, it’s looking to Him, the author and finisher of faith (Heb. 12:2). Following Jesus isn’t making ourselves the captain of our salvation, it’s Jesus who is the captain (Heb. 2:10). We obey God out of a love, faith, and out of having gratitude that we are saved in Christ. We have reverential love for Him (Gal. 5:6), and it’s by His grace which instructs (Titus 2:11-12). Living for God is trusting God. Living a godly lifestyle is not making it about our “works”. It's trusting in Christ’s work by making it about Him by being conformed to His image (Rom. 8:29). All of our good works we do and living faithfully is not making it all about ourselves but about God, as we are His workmanship (Eph. 2:10). Living a Christian life affirms our love to Christ (John 14:15, 15:14). It affirms our devotion to Him. His love compels us (2 Cor. 5:14) to do so and God’s grace is the instructor (Titus 2:11-12). By His grace, He has showed us how.
All of this is confirmation of having a saving faith in Christ, and is confirmation that we have and are surrendering our lives to Him by allowing Him to be the Lord and King over our lives. It is not our works that makes us righteousness (Titus 3:5). It is our faith in Christ that does by the power of the gospel (Rom. 3:22, Phil. 3:9, Rom. 1:16).”
Here’s another (that might of not have been in it)
Living a godly lifestyle is not making it about your “works”. It's trusting in Christ’s work by making it about Him by being conformed to His image (Rom. 8:29). The works of Christ that save us is His death, burial, resurrection, as well as what He has commanded us to do to be saved by Him. All of those are God ordained commandments/works which Jesus taught and which the Spirit revealed to the Apostles, to teach us how to be saved by His grace.
It’s not placing hope in ourselves, but rather, hope in God, as when we live faithfully that is how we let our light shine so that others may see Him in us (Matt. 5:16). That is why God gets all the glory (Psalm 29:2, Phil 2:13). His grace tells us that we can’t live in sin any longer (Rom. 6:1). It teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts, and teaches us to live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world (Titus 2:12) and teaches us to grow in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior (2 Peter 3:18).
Bonus: The same grace that saved us (Eph. 2:8) is also the same grace that motivates, instructs, and warns us not to continue in sin (Rom. 6:1, 12-18ff). Grace teaches us (Titus 2:11-12) not to continue in sin (Rom. 6:1), and has the answers for salvation when one ask what must we/I do? What do you want me to do? (Acts 2:37-28; Acts 16:30ff; Acts 9:6). Grace tells us what we must do to enter the kingdom of heaven (Matt. 7:21). Jesus brought us salvation. On the cross, He died for all men (2 Cor. 5:15), and He brought us a soul saving message to all through His sacrifice, His words, His apostles and disciples. All of that is grace and is how His grace that has brought salvation has appeared to all men. In having mercy upon us, He saved us by His grace which instructs us, not only how to be saved, but also how to live such a life that we can walk worthy of our calling as a Christian to glorify God (Ti. 3:5, Ti. 2:11; Eph. 2:8, 4:1; 1 Cor. 6:20).
“When we become a Christian and continue to follow Jesus, it isn’t showing how good we are, it’s showing how good He is (Jhn 10:11, 14, 27-28). Following Jesus doesn’t point back to our own righteousness, it points to His (Rom. 5:17, 21). Following Jesus isn’t looking to self for salvation, it’s looking to Him, the author and finisher of faith (Heb. 12:2). Following Jesus isn’t making ourselves the captain of our salvation, it’s Jesus who is the captain (Heb. 2:10). We obey God out of a love, faith, and out of having gratitude that we are saved in Christ. We have reverential love for Him (Gal. 5:6), and it’s by His grace which instructs (Titus 2:11-12). Living for God is trusting God. Living a godly lifestyle is not making it about our “works”. It's trusting in Christ’s work by making it about Him by being conformed to His image (Rom. 8:29). All of our good works we do and living faithfully is not making it all about ourselves but about God, as we are His workmanship (Eph. 2:10). Living a Christian life affirms our love to Christ (John 14:15, 15:14). It affirms our devotion to Him. His love compels us (2 Cor. 5:14) to do so and God’s grace is the instructor (Titus 2:11-12). By His grace, He has showed us how.
All of this is confirmation of having a saving faith in Christ, and is confirmation that we have and are surrendering our lives to Him by allowing Him to be the Lord and King over our lives. It is not our works that makes us righteousness (Titus 3:5). It is our faith in Christ that does by the power of the gospel (Rom. 3:22, Phil. 3:9, Rom. 1:16).”
Here’s another (that might of not have been in it)
Living a godly lifestyle is not making it about your “works”. It's trusting in Christ’s work by making it about Him by being conformed to His image (Rom. 8:29). The works of Christ that save us is His death, burial, resurrection, as well as what He has commanded us to do to be saved by Him. All of those are God ordained commandments/works which Jesus taught and which the Spirit revealed to the Apostles, to teach us how to be saved by His grace.
It’s not placing hope in ourselves, but rather, hope in God, as when we live faithfully that is how we let our light shine so that others may see Him in us (Matt. 5:16). That is why God gets all the glory (Psalm 29:2, Phil 2:13). His grace tells us that we can’t live in sin any longer (Rom. 6:1). It teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts, and teaches us to live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world (Titus 2:12) and teaches us to grow in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior (2 Peter 3:18).
Bonus: The same grace that saved us (Eph. 2:8) is also the same grace that motivates, instructs, and warns us not to continue in sin (Rom. 6:1, 12-18ff). Grace teaches us (Titus 2:11-12) not to continue in sin (Rom. 6:1), and has the answers for salvation when one ask what must we/I do? What do you want me to do? (Acts 2:37-28; Acts 16:30ff; Acts 9:6). Grace tells us what we must do to enter the kingdom of heaven (Matt. 7:21). Jesus brought us salvation. On the cross, He died for all men (2 Cor. 5:15), and He brought us a soul saving message to all through His sacrifice, His words, His apostles and disciples. All of that is grace and is how His grace that has brought salvation has appeared to all men. In having mercy upon us, He saved us by His grace which instructs us, not only how to be saved, but also how to live such a life that we can walk worthy of our calling as a Christian to glorify God (Ti. 3:5, Ti. 2:11; Eph. 2:8, 4:1; 1 Cor. 6:20).
The very same people who accuse obedience to Christ for salvation to be relying on self to save or boasting…would be the very same ones who would accuse all the biblical examples of obedience to God to be relying on self or boasting in their ability when they obeyed. How absurd. Whether to be saved or because they were saved, they still obeyed. No way around it. Is God going to save those who refuse to obey Him? And it seems like a lot of people on here also thinks God’s commandments are burdensome, but they are not per 1 John 5:3. They also seem to think obedience is burdensome or work, when it’s actually trusting and proof that you love Jesus (Jn 14:15; 1 Jn. 5:2ff). The fact people conflate obedience with relying on self and boasting is disturbing, which is also proof they do not understand biblical faith, as biblical faith and obedience goes hand in glove.
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Biblical faith is inherently linked to obedience. Hebrews 11 provides numerous examples of individuals whose faith was demonstrated through their actions. Their obedience was not a means of earning salvation but a response to their trust in God. This illustrates that biblical faith naturally results in a desire to obey God's commands.
1 John 5:3 states, "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome." This verse emphasizes that obedience is not meant to be a heavy burden but rather a joyful expression of our love for God. When we understand His commandments as expressions of His love and wisdom, we can embrace them with joy.
Obedience is an act of trust in God and His goodness. When we obey, we acknowledge that His ways are higher than our own (Isaiah 55:8-9) and that He knows what is best for us. This trust is foundational to our relationship with Him and is a reflection of our love for Christ (John 14:15).
The conflation of obedience with self-reliance or boasting often stems from a misunderstanding of the nature of faith and works. Obedience is a loving response. It is not about boasting in our ability but about glorifying God through our lives (Ephesians 2:10).
Scripture consistently emphasizes the importance of obedience in the life of a believer. Jesus taught that those who follow Him will obey His commands (John 15:10). While salvation is a gift of grace, the call to obedience is a vital aspect of living out that faith.
In summary, obedience is not a burden, but a joyful expression of love and trust in God. It is important to clarify misconceptions about faith and works, recognizing that biblical faith naturally leads to obedience. God calls us to live in accordance with His commands, not as a means of earning salvation, but as a response to Him.
1 John 5:3 states, "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome." This verse emphasizes that obedience is not meant to be a heavy burden but rather a joyful expression of our love for God. When we understand His commandments as expressions of His love and wisdom, we can embrace them with joy.
Obedience is an act of trust in God and His goodness. When we obey, we acknowledge that His ways are higher than our own (Isaiah 55:8-9) and that He knows what is best for us. This trust is foundational to our relationship with Him and is a reflection of our love for Christ (John 14:15).
The conflation of obedience with self-reliance or boasting often stems from a misunderstanding of the nature of faith and works. Obedience is a loving response. It is not about boasting in our ability but about glorifying God through our lives (Ephesians 2:10).
Scripture consistently emphasizes the importance of obedience in the life of a believer. Jesus taught that those who follow Him will obey His commands (John 15:10). While salvation is a gift of grace, the call to obedience is a vital aspect of living out that faith.
In summary, obedience is not a burden, but a joyful expression of love and trust in God. It is important to clarify misconceptions about faith and works, recognizing that biblical faith naturally leads to obedience. God calls us to live in accordance with His commands, not as a means of earning salvation, but as a response to Him.
LOL..How in the world does anyone rely on self to obey God when God is the one who tells us and has given us the ability to obey? Is obeying God to be saved saving ourselves by ourselves in the sense of relying on self…or is it relying on God to save? If you say the former, then you are saying obeying God to be saved is saving self by ourself without God, as you’d say it’s relying on self instead of God.
I do not think you know what a biblical concept of believe/believing is. When one truly believes in Jesus then they will believe what He says to do.
If I told you to get a free $1,000 all you would have to do is sign a letter and mail it to me would you then be saying you “worked” or “earned” that $1,000 simply by signing and mailing the letter? If I throw a rope, I call to the person to grab the rope. The gospel calls to grab the rope. If one refuses the gospel call there is no rope to grab. The gospel call extends the rope and you grab it, or you refuse to listen and you drown. Can the man say he earned his salvation because he grabbed and held to the rope as instructed?
No one is saving theirselves BY theirselves when they obey God’s divine authoritative commands that they read in His word. God saves when they SUBMIT/OBEY His teachings. They are HIS teachings, which He gives. Thus, there can be no boasting whatsoever on the part of man. Simply gratitude and thankfulness that God has given mankind
I do not think you know what a biblical concept of believe/believing is. When one truly believes in Jesus then they will believe what He says to do.
If I told you to get a free $1,000 all you would have to do is sign a letter and mail it to me would you then be saying you “worked” or “earned” that $1,000 simply by signing and mailing the letter? If I throw a rope, I call to the person to grab the rope. The gospel calls to grab the rope. If one refuses the gospel call there is no rope to grab. The gospel call extends the rope and you grab it, or you refuse to listen and you drown. Can the man say he earned his salvation because he grabbed and held to the rope as instructed?
No one is saving theirselves BY theirselves when they obey God’s divine authoritative commands that they read in His word. God saves when they SUBMIT/OBEY His teachings. They are HIS teachings, which He gives. Thus, there can be no boasting whatsoever on the part of man. Simply gratitude and thankfulness that God has given mankind
Disobedience not forgiven = condemnation, and
Disobedience = personal responsibility
Actually, "works of the law" is mentioned only one time in Romans (Ro 9:32). It is a hallmark of Galatians however, being mentioned there six times. And althought there are doctrinal parellels in Romans and Galatians, Romans 4 speaks of works more generally than does the term "works of the law".
Did you see anything in my post that addressed your question about the possible reasons for disagreement with your doctrine?
Disobedience = personal responsibility
Actually, "works of the law" is mentioned only one time in Romans (Ro 9:32). It is a hallmark of Galatians however, being mentioned there six times. And althought there are doctrinal parellels in Romans and Galatians, Romans 4 speaks of works more generally than does the term "works of the law".
Did you see anything in my post that addressed your question about the possible reasons for disagreement with your doctrine?
@NewLifeInChrist, sorry, but you are on my ignore list for false accusations against obedience.
Did you read what I said? How is disobedience to God overcome? Is it not through the forgiveness that Jesus offers? If so, how can those who's sins are forgiven think their rightness with God is through their obedience? That is the part that is confusing to me. The only thing I can think of that would make sense of your doctrine is that if you believe in the sinless perfection of the believer. Otherwise, you are condemming yourself with your own doctrine.
Obedience to God is NOT relying on one’s ability. It is relying on God to save. Obedience is the RESPONSE of WANTING God to save them as it’s TRUSTING IN HIM TO SAVE. To suggest it is not is INSANE!!!
Humble submission to the will of God as expressed in HIS word DEMONSTRATE COMPLETE RELIANCE upon GOD. Not upon self!!
YOU do NOT have a clue of what a biblical saving faith is!!
Humble submission to the will of God as expressed in HIS word DEMONSTRATE COMPLETE RELIANCE upon GOD. Not upon self!!
YOU do NOT have a clue of what a biblical saving faith is!!
@NewLifeInChrist, keep on misrepresenting obedience within God’s word…I’ve ignored you for good reason…no more of your nonsensical garbage!!
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Your reasoning is sound but alas your words do not tickle the ears.
Many conflate simple obedience with works of merit. This is the error that they are blind to.
Let me make this clear. Those of the Faith Alone Regeneration Theology movement will label anything done in the name of obedience as an attempt to earn salvation. This is a flawed line of reasoning and something that they would never use in other circumstances.
Your efforts are not in vain.
Many conflate simple obedience with works of merit. This is the error that they are blind to.
Let me make this clear. Those of the Faith Alone Regeneration Theology movement will label anything done in the name of obedience as an attempt to earn salvation. This is a flawed line of reasoning and something that they would never use in other circumstances.
Your efforts are not in vain.
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