Understanding God’s election

[Cameron143]

The Word gives you the answer.

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

... he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God

Whoever believes in him is not condemned

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

There's enough verses to make the case and answer the question. Believe and be saved.

So what is the power of God in the gospel? The ability to persuade?

 

[Cameron143]

The Holy Spirit does the persuading, convicting of sins and pointing the way to Christ.

Without the conviction of the Spirit would a person be persuaded?

 

[HeIsHere]

So is that a yes or no? And is this any different from the effect a persuasive writer has on his or her audience?

All that matters is scripture makes clear faith always preceded regeneration, otherwise the God's Gospel message is insufficient and ineffective

In you our theology a person can only respond negatively and must be regenerated first.

However this means is person is bequeathed a gift who is an unbeliever. lol

Illogical!

 

[Cranberry]

Waaaat, that's it? That's the best you got? No scripture? In that case then, you really should stop referring to the marriage of the Lamb
in the context you've been using, which context, is totally incorrect.

Yes. 1st Corinthians 2 is reiterated with every one of their posts.

Their intent is to sew Discord. They fail. Whole in that effort God's word is proven true repeatedly. It's glorious.

 

[HeIsHere]

I find that view as distasteful and cruel as the Nazi's selecting who will die, head that direction. It's simply not the character of God. They keep asking where is God morally obligated to save, like he's Zeus. God obligated Himself when He sent His only Son to die for ALL. Scripture is so clear yet Cran and Rufus have not yet been able to show error in the verses I posted. I guess we rip that part out of the Bible and burn it. The Gospel is Christ crucified, Savior to all who believe. Jesus is the Gospel, not TULIP not Calvin, Jesus + nothing!!

Take note what is being preached here, regeneration/a personal change/the gift of salvation bequeathed ...... before belief.

 

[Cranberry]

All that matters is scripture makes clear faith always preceded regeneration, otherwise the God's Gospel message is insufficient and ineffective

In you our theology a person can only respond negatively and must be regenerated first.

However this means is person is bequeathed a gift who is an unbeliever. lol

Illogical!

Faith comes through the gift of God. That's Scripture.

 

[HeIsHere]

Faith comes through the gift of God. That's Scripture.

Salvific faith is never stated as part of the gift in scripture. The gift is salvation.

 

[Cameron143]

All that matters is scripture makes clear faith always preceded regeneration, otherwise the God's Gospel message is insufficient and ineffective

In you our theology a person can only respond negatively and must be regenerated first.

However this means is person is bequeathed a gift who is an unbeliever. lol

Illogical!

You make a claim but haven't established it from scripture. You haven't even shared what the power of God in the gospel is.

 

[HeIsHere]

You make a claim but haven't established it from scripture. You haven't even shared what the power of God in the gospel is.

Been done over and over again!

 

[cv5]

Waaaat, that's it? That's the best you got? No scripture? In that case then, you really should stop referring to the marriage of the Lamb
in the context you've been using, which context, is totally incorrect.

Quit trying to blame me because the blind nutless squirrels refuse to RECEIVE the marriage proposal.

Not my problem.

 

[Cameron143]

Been done over and over again!

Remind me what your answer was please.

 

[rogerg]

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Some may intellectually come to believe with the human mind for a time, but to believe and endure with the spiritual heart, that requires a new heart given by God through salvation/spiritual rebirth

[Eze 36:26 KJV] 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

... he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God

Whoever believes in him is not condemned

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

There's enough verses to make the case and answer the question. Believe and be saved.

Actually, there is nothing in those verses that makes your case. This is because you do not understand how someone
comes to a true, enduring belief. Here's a hint: it is neither by nor of man.

[Phl 1:29 KJV] 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

[Act 13:48 KJV]
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

 

[rogerg]

Quit trying to blame me because the blind nutless squirrels refuse to RECEIVE the marriage proposal.

Not my problem.

Hmmm. Okay, then post specific verses that confirm your POV regarding the marriage of the Lamb. Not of the marriage of a person to a person, but of who it is that Christ, as the Lamb, will marry. Post 'em if you got 'em.

 

[Magenta]

While I agree that one is to persuade, then the one persuading is exercising the
power, wouldn't they be giving the increase and not just planting and watering?
If the power is in the words of scripture, why doesn't everyone who physically hears the gospel get persuaded?
According to Isaiah 55, when the word of God goes forth from Him it always accomplishes His purposes.
When the gospel goes forth and some are still unaffected, was God's purpose accomplished?

1 Corinthians 3:6-7 I planted the seed and Apollos watered it, but God made it grow. So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God Who makes things grow.

 

[Magenta]

According to Isaiah 55, when the word of God goes forth from Him it always accomplishes His purposes.
When the gospel goes forth and some are still unaffected, was God's purpose accomplished?

Isaiah 55:10-11

 

[Magenta]

All that matters is scripture makes clear faith always preceded regeneration, otherwise the God's Gospel message is insufficient and ineffective

In you our theology a person can only respond negatively and must be regenerated first.

However this means is person is bequeathed a gift who is an unbeliever. lol

Illogical!

And yet even unbelievers have received the gift of life. From a Biblical standpoint it is very logical.

He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.

The wicked even prosper! How unfair and illogical you must think God is to allow that.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Some may intellectually come to believe with the human mind for a time, but to believe and endure with the spiritual heart, that requires a new heart given by God through salvation/spiritual rebirth

[Eze 36:26 KJV] 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

Who is the YOU being talked about here? Then we can discuss further.


24 “‘For I will take you out of the nations; I will gather you from all the countries and bring you back into your own land. 25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols. 26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws.

Actually, there is nothing in those verses that makes your case. This is because you do not understand how someone
comes to a true, enduring belief. Here's a hint: it is neither by nor of man.

Here's what Cameron said.

... why doesn't everyone who physically hears the word of God get saved?

I gave him verses that said why everyone who hears isn't saved. Belief. Those who believe WILL be saved. Yes, I made the case according to what the Word says.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Faith comes through the gift of God. That's Scripture.

Faith comes through hearing the word of God.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Without the conviction of the Spirit would a person be persuaded?

That is the job of the Holy Spirit, to convict. Every person on earth has felt that in their lives, the Bible says that the Holy Spirit draws men. Your question doesn't make sense according to what the Word says. The Spirit draws, convicts and points us to Christ.

 

[cv5]

Hmmm. Okay, then post specific verses that confirm your POV regarding the marriage of the Lamb. Not of the marriage of a person to a person, but of who it is that Christ, as the Lamb, will marry. Post 'em if you got 'em.

Have you perhaps wondered why you are no longer getting any straight answers?

Think in terms of what happened between the last verse of Matt 12 leading to the first verse of Matt 13.