As He chooses after, He alone knows who accepted His drawing, and those who rejected!
SBS!
Understanding God’s election
- Thread starter dougcho
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As He chooses after, He alone knows who accepted His drawing, and those who rejected!
SBS!
You have the first mover Call-er transmitting the "signal" and the reactionary call-ees, the responders, who "receive" it and then call upon Him in return by asking for that promised grace which, as a result of the plea, is then granted.
And BTW, it is ALWAYS ***granted*** to those who ***ask***.
[Joe 2:32 KJV]
And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.
[Hos 6:1 KJV]
Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
The drawing of God is an invisible, private matter between the one being drawn and God alone.
The end result of the drawing will be determined upon the decisions of the one being drawn.
For God has been telling us?
You can pray all you want for your lovely aunt Betty for me to save her!
Stop doing that!
For, it's between Me and her!
I will save whom I will save!
I will condemn those who made it so I have to condemn them!
It's about time you got the right perspective!
The "real question" is whether TULIP-sim is a heresy or not.
The critical matter at hand being whether such a doctrine stifles the gospel message.
And whether such a doctrine rightly glorifies God or not.
But, not will all people.
For it was possible that Lucifer could have been God's most esteemed angel forever.
And that saying came out of a discussion Jesus had with His disciples who had exclaimed, who then can inherit eternal life? With man it is impossible, Jesus' meaning is clear but many muddy it and say the opposite, with man it is possible, and God is not necessarily required.
Well let me help you out:
...both camps have their version of TULIP. Both camps are made up of fallible humans who are sincerely trying to understand and glorify God.
...both camps have the same gospel...Jesus Christ and Him crucified. Both camps have the same directive...the proliferation of the gospel. Why would the gospel be stifled? Who can frustrate God anyway?
...God works all things to our good and His glory. He's incredible in that way.
I am not a pessimist, I am a realist and I know how complicated people are, unlike some who make all people into a little
pre-determined one dimensional Flat Stanley.
Not sure how you meant the statement but most people tend to stay in their indoctrination, few escape but those who test themselves to see if they are in the faith, they might.
And I read no where in scripture where we are heading towards utopia here on earth, so I am a realist.
Sure, it would only apply to things that remain possible, and not restricted or prohibited by God. Surely you know this doesn't apply to the content of the current discussion.
Aaaaahhhh no. Actually no. I don't think so.
The only part of TULIP that I agree with is "P".
Anything that alludes to some kind of pre-birth chosenitism is off the table.
What do you believe the result to be if Jesus destroys all the works of the devil?
Agree insofar as this present condition and state of prophetic fulfillment.
And @Cameron143 does believe this non-interventionalist (in terms of prophecy and judgement) utopia business. Certainly an unbiblical notion to say the least.
BTW, I hear that you are not a dispensationalist. Thats all well and good, as this is yet another simplistic moniker.
What you are REALLY dealing with is prophecy.
That which has come to pass.
That which is in play presently (a lot including much to do with the Nation Israel).
That which is soon coming to pass (trib, the repentance/redemption of Israel, the Millennial reign etc).
None of this registers with @Cameron143 .
Despite the overwhelming evidence to support it. I mean just look out your window, or watch the "news".
Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell
you, it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
From Matthew 19, and again in Mark 10, Jesus said to them again, “Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of
God! It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
They were even more astonished and said to one another, “Who then can be saved?”
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but not with God. For all things are possible with God.”
Echoed also in Luke 18: Jesus said, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God! Indeed, it is
easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
Those who heard this asked, “Who then can be saved?”
But Jesus said, “What is impossible with man is possible with God.”
you, it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
From Matthew 19, and again in Mark 10, Jesus said to them again, “Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of
God! It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
They were even more astonished and said to one another, “Who then can be saved?”
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but not with God. For all things are possible with God.”
Echoed also in Luke 18: Jesus said, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God! Indeed, it is
easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
Those who heard this asked, “Who then can be saved?”
But Jesus said, “What is impossible with man is possible with God.”