the Sabbath

[Cameron143]

When Jesus told Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:... "Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

What was his first thought? Joh 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

When Jesus meet the woman of samaria and told her ..."If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water. "

What was her response ? Joh 4:11 The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?

Both of these people missed the point at first. They looked at the literal not the spiritual

Jesus helped them to understand. And Jesus used many pysical things to illustrate spiritual lessons.
Rest in Jesus is a wonderful thing. Fredom from the burden of Sin. But that does not mean the sabbath day is made void.

Sabbath rest is a gift and commandment that God gave to us. God knows what is best, and i will follow the Lord not man.

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest (sabbatismos, “sabbatism”) to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Heb 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. = God rested on the sabbath at creation

I only said they would understand the reference and the implication. Their very consideration reveal their thoughts. That doesn't mean they weren't in need of greater enlightenment. Seems they both had been led to the right place.
Typically, when someone tells me that they will follow God and not man, they are really saying I will follow my preferred understanding of God and not yours.

 

[TMS]

The Sabbath was part of God's plan after the fall as well.

All of the 10 commandments were part of Gods plan before and after the fall....

Before the fall God expected us to

have no other gods before Him. Not make any graven image, or any likeness of any thing, not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God. Not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Honour thy father and thy mother, not kill, not commit adultery, not steal, not bear false witness against thy neighbour, not covet.

God did not change when Adam sinned. The standards didn't change, God didn't change, the rules didn't change, WE CHANGED.

After the fall God still expected us to obey the principles above.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

What you consider editing is merely understanding. Are you familiar with the Constitution? There are also Federalist Papers. In the Federalist Papers one finds the arguments that were considered by the founding fathers. In this way, the Constitution can be understood by referring to them.
The Bible has no such reference, but it is important to understand God's intention. Thankfully, the Bible is its own reference, comparing scripture with scripture.
The OT is filled with shadows and types. Clear understanding is impossible apart from NT revelation. Yet you insist you understand the Sabbath and God's intention without NT revelation.

Thankfully, we have Jesus who tells us not a jot or tittle can pass form His law Mat 5:18, He will not alter His words Psa 89:34 , so no need to lean on our own understanding when we have Jesus. He wrote, He spoke, He numbered, He claimed the Ten Commandments as His commandments- do you know of anyone who has more Authority to God to alter what was written by God’s own finger? No one that I know of. It’s best to let God be God and if He was going to change His holy and eternal law, we would have a thus saith the Lord. God blessed, no man can reverse God’s blessing Num 23:20, not even Paul, why we are told many misunderstand Pauls writings, but Jesus is easy to understand and we should trust Him at His Word.

 

[Cameron143]

Amen! Of course it was that why God personally wrote it with His own finger and spoke it with His own voice to the entire nation of Israel which represents God’s people

The Sabbath never changed, still on the seventh day, just like it was at Creation.

Exo 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

And its still on the seventh day in the NC as the Sabbath rest is according to the commandments

Luke 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.

Placed in our heart in the NC because we will also need God’s blessing and sanctification.

The Sabbath has never changed in that what God's intention in it has never changed. It was never God's intention that one would find physical rest in the observance of a particular day. God's intention was that people would find rest in Him.

 

[Cameron143]

All of the 10 commandments were part of Gods plan before and after the fall....

Before the fall God expected us to

have no other gods before Him. Not make any graven image, or any likeness of any thing, not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God. Not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Honour thy father and thy mother, not kill, not commit adultery, not steal, not bear false witness against thy neighbour, not covet.

God did not change when Adam sinned. The standards didn't change, God didn't change, the rules didn't change, WE CHANGED.

After the fall God still expected us to obey the principles above.

See post #3824.

 

[Cameron143]

Thankfully, we have Jesus who tells us not a jot or tittle can pass form His law Mat 5:18, He will not alter His words Psa 89:34 , so no need to lean on our own understanding when we have Jesus. He wrote, He spoke, He numbered, He claimed the Ten Commandments as His commandments- do you know of anyone who has more Authority to God to alter what was written by God’s own finger? No one that I know of. It’s best to let God be God and if He was going to change His holy and eternal law, we would have a thus saith the Lord. God blessed, no man can reverse God’s blessing Num 23:20, not even Paul, why we are told many misunderstand Pauls writings, but Jesus is easy to understand and we should trust Him at His Word.

This has been your fallback position while ignoring the truths I shared. I can see that regardless of what I share you will not hear it.
Thanks for the discussion. Grace and peace.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

The Sabbath has never changed in that what God's intention in it has never changed. It was never God's intention that one would find physical rest in the observance of a particular day. God's intention was that people would find rest in Him.

Those who enter Christ rest also rest from their works as God did from His on the seventh day. Heb 4:10 Heb 4:4

In Christ rest, we enter through faith and we rest from sin. Isa 48:13 There is no disobedience in Christ rest Heb 4:6 Heb 4:11 Sin is breaking God’s law 1 John 3:4, which includes the Sabbath commandment James 2:10-12 Mat 5:19-30

God gives us 6 days to get work and labors done but we rest on the seventh day from physical works so we can keep the Sabbath day holy. Exo 20:8-11

You keep getting the rest in Christ mixed up with the seventh day Sabbath rest. They are two different rests. We need both rests not one or the other.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

This has been your fallback position while ignoring the truths I shared. I can see that regardless of what I share you will not hear it.
Thanks for the discussion. Grace and peace.

All of God’s commandments are Truth Psa 119:151 and when we keep not His commandments there is no truth 1 John 2:4. It’s why I like to stick with what God said, because it’s His Truth that matters, not ours.

Grace and peace to you as well.

 

[TMS]

I only said they would understand the reference and the implication. Their very consideration reveal their thoughts. That doesn't mean they weren't in need of greater enlightenment. Seems they both had been led to the right place.
Typically, when someone tells me that they will follow God and not man, they are really saying I will follow my preferred understanding of God and not yours.

Man is not every wise,,,
1Co 3:18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

When i say follow God rather then man. i mean man is a fool when it comes to understanding the truth. But God is all wise, His wisdom is found in the word... Don't follow the understanding of man follow the word of God.

Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest (sabbath) to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

The word of God is clear.

 

[Cameron143]

Those who enter Christ rest also rest from their works as God did from His on the seventh day. Heb 4:10 Heb 4:4

In Christ rest, we enter through faith and we rest from sin. Isa 48:13 There is no disobedience in Christ rest Heb 4:6 Heb 4:11 Sin is breaking God’s law 1 John 3:4, which includes the Sabbath commandment James 2:10-12 Mat 5:19-30

God gives us 6 days to get work and labors done but we rest on the seventh day from physical works so we can keep the Sabbath day holy. Exo 20:8-11

You keep getting the rest in Christ mixed up with the seventh day Sabbath rest. They are two different rests. We need both rests not one or the other.

Hebrews 4:10 describes Jesus' rest as a cessation of works for salvation. The entire passage establishes the Sabbath was given to this end.

 

[Cameron143]

Man is not every wise,,,
1Co 3:18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

When i say follow God rather then man. i mean man is a fool when it comes to understanding the truth. But God is all wise, His wisdom is found in the word... Don't follow the understanding of man follow the word of God.

Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest (sabbath) to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

The word of God is clear.

It's very clear. The whole passage is equating the rest in Christ for salvation was the intent behind the Sabbath in creation.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Hebrews 4:10 describes Jesus' rest as a cessation of works for salvation. The entire passage establishes the Sabbath was given to this end.

There are two different rests here, why there is the word "also" which means in addition to

Heb 4:10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

So we enter into Christ rest through faith Heb 4:2 and those who enter ALSO cease from their works as God did from His, on the seventh day

Heb 4:4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;

This is a direct reference to the Sabbath commandment God spoke at Mt Sinai and a reference to Creation Exo 20:11 Gen 2:1-3

Which is why the Sabbath-rest remains for God's people Heb 4:9

The rest in this verse literally translates into Sabbath-keeping

Original Word: σαββατισμός
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Pronunciation: sab-bat-is-mos'
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: Sabbath rest
Meaning: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

The Sabbath rest is according to the commandment Luke 23:56 all of God's Word harmonizes because God, He promised not to alter the words of His covenant Psa 89:34 not a jot or tittle can pass Mat 5:18 and God cannot lie. His Word is a pillar of Truth.

God bless!

 

[TMS]

Hebrews 4:10 describes Jesus' rest as a cessation of works for salvation. The entire passage establishes the Sabbath was given to this end.

but the sabbath was given before sin.

 

[Inquisitor]

In the New Testament, Jesus swept away these rules when He “declared all foods clean” (Mark 7:18-19): “There is nothing outside the man which can defile him if it goes into him; but the things which proceed out of the man are what defile the man.”
There are people in other countries eating rats, fat, locusts(lol) things we may frown on, but that's why we are to pray over everything, food included. Sodas and processed food may be way more harmful than pork. I've been eating tostadas de carnitas for decades, and pray over all I partake of.

Don't tell me Jesus 'swept away' the letter of the law?

 

[Cameron143]

There are two different rests here, why there is the word "also" which means in addition to

Heb 4:10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

So we enter into Christ rest through faith Heb 4:2 and those who enter ALSO cease from their works as God did from His, on the seventh day

Heb 4:4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;

This is a direct reference to the Sabbath commandment God spoke at Mt Sinai and a reference to Creation Exo 20:11 Gen 2:1-3

Which is why the Sabbath-rest remains for God's people Heb 4:9

The rest in this verse literally translates into Sabbath-keeping

Original Word: σαββατισμός
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Pronunciation: sab-bat-is-mos'
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: Sabbath rest
Meaning: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

The Sabbath rest is according to the commandment Luke 23:56 all of God's Word harmonizes because God, He promised not to alter the words of His covenant Psa 89:34 not a jot or tittle can pass Mat 5:18 and God cannot lie. His Word is a pillar of Truth.

God bless!

You literally draw the correlation, then deny it. There are not 2 rests. There is a physical rest that prefigures the spiritual rest.

 

[Pasifika]

Jesus:"Do not presume that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish, but to fulfill. For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke of a letter shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished!"
MATTHEW 5:17


Paul:
For Christ is the end of the Law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
ROMANS 10:4

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us
GALATIANS 3:13

But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.
ROMANS 7:6

For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, by abolishing in His flesh the hostility, which is the Law composed of commandments expressed in ordinances…
EPHESIANS 2:14-15

https://contradictionsofpaul.com/paul-contradicts-yeshua-2/

so as you've mentioned Christ came to Fulfill the Law. Now you're trying to fulfill the same Law apart from Him, instead you must seek to know Christ for Him to come live within you so the Law He fulfilled be fulfill in You.

 

[TMS]

It's very clear. The whole passage is equating the rest in Christ for salvation was the intent behind the Sabbath in creation.

God knows the begining from the end but God did not put the plan of salvation into place until the plan was needed.
When Jesus said that He is the water of life, we do not take that literally and stop drinking water? When Jesus said He is the bread of life, does that mean we stop eating bread?

NO

Just because we find rest in Jesus (He frees us from guilt and sin) does not mean we stop keeping the holy sabbath day.

 

[Cameron143]

but the sabbath was given before sin.

Do you believe God was surprised by the fall? Jesus was the Lamb slain before the earth was created, no?

 

[Inquisitor]

Abraham was a Gentile.

Though the Jews were the direct offspring of Abraham and his son Isaac.

Jew
A member of the people and cultural community whose traditional religion is Judaism and who trace
their origins through the ancient Hebrew people of Israel to Abraham.

 

[Cameron143]

Don't tell me Jesus 'swept away' the letter of the law?

My favorite verse: Jesus swept.