Applying God's Word to Politics

[Eli1]

I understand where you stand lol. This is not really so much my personal view though, it just is what it is. Whether I was even ever born or not isn't going to change what is truth and what is morality. As for free-will, if it even is real, which is very debateable, God's will trumps it just like God's outline of morality trumps yours or my attempts to define morality, and he has already judged and made his judgments known.

Yes, free-will is a long and eternal debate which will go on until God returns and then we might know more.
I think that a lot of people agree on some high level concepts about free will but they express themselves incorrectly because language itself is limited to describe God and His Creation.
The best i can say about free-will using my limited vocabulary and mind is that it's "limited free will".
But this debate about free-will will go on forever.

 

[SonJudgment]

Yes, free-will is a long and eternal debate which will go on until God returns and then we might know more.
I think that a lot of people agree on some high level concepts about free will but they express themselves incorrectly because language itself is limited to describe God and His Creation.
The best i can say about free-will using my limited vocabulary and mind is that it's "limited free will".
But this debate about free-will will go on forever.

Game of influences really. No one really does their own will, they are influenced to do someone else's, thus it is not free. Then it's just a matter of how aware they are of the influences. Though yes, pretty big subject so I will just leave that off here for this thread.

 

[GWH]

Re "I am now wondering if you speak English or have some comprehension problems." Ditto, because I asked you very clearly to quote me when making accusations, because I am almost certain I have said from the start that MAGA MORE closely aligns with Biblical/KOG morality, so my stance is the same.

I understand that you have no desire for agreement/unity, even though I guess you affirm the kerygma or else you wouldn't call me "brother".

Re "Where does the Bible say that trinity exists?” The OT Shema (DT 6:4) teaches that God is one, and the NT also affirms that there is one God (EPH 4:6, 1TM 2:5). However, the NT teaches that God relates to believers in three ways simultaneously: as the Father, as the Son and as the Holy Spirit (1 x 1 x 1=1). The Father/Parenthood of God is indicated in Jesus’ model prayer (MT 6:9), throughout the Gospel of John (3:35, 5:17-18, etc.), and in the epistles of Paul (RM 4:11, 8:15, PHP 2:11). God the Father and Christ’s Sonship are discussed in Hebrews 1:1-4. The Son of God also is mentioned by John (JN 1:14, 3:16, etc.) and by Paul (RM 1:4, GL 2:20, 1THS 1:10). The Holy Spirit is mentioned in three successive chapters in John (JN 14:26, 15:26, 16:13), frequently in the book of Acts (ACTS 1:5, 2:4, 9:17, 13:2, 19:2), and in many of Paul’s letters (RM 8:4-26, 1CR 6:19, EPH 4:30) as well as in some of the other epistles (2PT 1:21, JUDE 20).

These divine aspects or “persons” may be distinguished by role: God the Father as creator or initiator (GN 1:1), God the Son as Messiah or mediator (1TM 2:5), and God the Spirit as indweller (RM 5:5). For example, 1 John 4:7 says love comes from (is initiated by) God (the Father), Galatians 5:22 says that love is a fruit of the (indwelling) Spirit, and Ephesians 3:18 speaks of the (mediating) love of Christ (RM 5:8, EPH 2:18). We can denote these distinctions by the use of three prepositions: God the Father is over all creation (EPH 4:6), God the Son is Immanuel or with humanity (MT 1:23), and the Holy Spirit is within all believers (EPH 1:13). A single passage that comes closest to indicating this distinction is Ephesians 3:14-19, in which Paul prays to the Father that through His Spirit of love Christ would dwell in believers’ hearts (also see 1CR 8:6).

Actually, since the creation also manifests God (RM 1:20, cf. JN 1:1-3 & PS 33:6), in a sense God may be viewed as a “Quadity”. As Paul told the Athenians (ACTS 17:28), “In Him we live and move and have our being.” God as Creation is throughout physical reality (called “panentheism”). However, since this mode of revelation is impersonal, it has rightly been de-emphasized by most Christian denominations.

So yes, I am a trinitarian.

Re "So when Jesus said that about Cesar it meant that these two types of government are separate and should be separate": No, Jesus taught that the spiritual KOG should be salt, light and leaven for earthly entities, including family, visible church and political government. My love for GW enables me to see this truth, but your hatred for MAGA blinds you and you can’t process any other ideas. Stop projecting your own obstinacy onto me. Cheers!

 

[Eli1]

Re "I am now wondering if you speak English or have some comprehension problems." Ditto, because I asked you very clearly to quote me when making accusations, because I am almost certain I have said from the start that MAGA MORE closely aligns with Biblical/KOG morality, so my stance is the same.

First of all let me address your cute remarks about “accusation” which come from the mentality of your legalistic culture.
You are on an international forum with an anonymous username. You’re not in a courtroom. So try to adjust your vocabulary since there is nothing at stake besides your ego.
It appears that you also don’t remember what you say so I’m wondering if I’m dealing with other issues here. Or, you’re so blind to MAGA that you can’t process any criticism which is pretty obvious so far.

I understand that you have no desire for agreement/unity, even though I guess you affirm the kerygma or else you wouldn't call me "brother".

I understand that you lack self-awareness and it’s either “your way or the highway” and can’t come to terms with disagreements and that every Christian has unique journey in life. Not your journey.

Re "Where does the Bible say that trinity exists?” The OT Shema (DT 6:4) teaches that God is one, and the NT also affirms that there is one God (EPH 4:6, 1TM 2:5). However, the NT teaches that God relates to believers in three ways simultaneously: as the Father, as the Son and as the Holy Spirit (1 x 1 x 1=1). The Father/Parenthood of God is indicated in Jesus’ model prayer (MT 6:9), throughout the Gospel of John (3:35, 5:17-18, etc.), and in the epistles of Paul (RM 4:11, 8:15, PHP 2:11). God the Father and Christ’s Sonship are discussed in Hebrews 1:1-4. The Son of God also is mentioned by John (JN 1:14, 3:16, etc.) and by Paul (RM 1:4, GL 2:20, 1THS 1:10). The Holy Spirit is mentioned in three successive chapters in John (JN 14:26, 15:26, 16:13), frequently in the book of Acts (ACTS 1:5, 2:4, 9:17, 13:2, 19:2), and in many of Paul’s letters (RM 8:4-26, 1CR 6:19, EPH 4:30) as well as in some of the other epistles (2PT 1:21, JUDE 20).

These divine aspects or “persons” may be distinguished by role: God the Father as creator or initiator (GN 1:1), God the Son as Messiah or mediator (1TM 2:5), and God the Spirit as indweller (RM 5:5). For example, 1 John 4:7 says love comes from (is initiated by) God (the Father), Galatians 5:22 says that love is a fruit of the (indwelling) Spirit, and Ephesians 3:18 speaks of the (mediating) love of Christ (RM 5:8, EPH 2:18). We can denote these distinctions by the use of three prepositions: God the Father is over all creation (EPH 4:6), God the Son is Immanuel or with humanity (MT 1:23), and the Holy Spirit is within all believers (EPH 1:13). A single passage that comes closest to indicating this distinction is Ephesians 3:14-19, in which Paul prays to the Father that through His Spirit of love Christ would dwell in believers’ hearts (also see 1CR 8:6).

Actually, since the creation also manifests God (RM 1:20, cf. JN 1:1-3 & PS 33:6), in a sense God may be viewed as a “Quadity”. As Paul told the Athenians (ACTS 17:28), “In Him we live and move and have our being.” God as Creation is throughout physical reality (called “panentheism”). However, since this mode of revelation is impersonal, it has rightly been de-emphasized by most Christian denominations.

So yes, I am a trinitarian.

None of those passages say the word Trinity, according to your logic. Are you aware of what you say half of the time? You said that the Cesar comment said nothing about voting right?
So where in these passages is the word “Trinity”? Where?
This is your logic and how you reason.

Re "So when Jesus said that about Cesar it meant that these two types of government are separate and should be separate": No, Jesus taught that the spiritual KOG should be salt, light and leaven for earthly entities, including family, visible church and political government. My love for GW enables me to see this truth, but your hatred for MAGA blinds you and you can’t process any other ideas. Stop projecting your own obstinacy onto me. Cheers!

Yes exactly, but your blind love of MAGA confuses KOG with MAGA and this is how it’s going to be until the end for you.
What are we doing for lunch today?
I'm thinking Greek or Italian.

 

[GWH]

Accusation = judgment comes from my biblical culture, so because the shoe fits, wear it.

Re "None of those passages say the word Trinity": Yes, but all of them teach the truth Trinity.

Again, your hatred of MAGA blinds you to the salting/enlightening/leavening work of the KOG in the world.

Projection is a tactic recommended by Alinsky that you Dems like to employ.

(GW just ate your lunch :^)

 

[Eli1]

Accusation = judgment comes from my biblical culture, so because the shoe fits, wear it.

Biblical culture varies from region to region. This is why denominations exist.
Get real and grow up.

Re "None of those passages say the word Trinity": Yes, but all of them teach the truth Trinity.

Does this mean that the Cesar comment means that MAGA has nothing to do with God? Doubt.

Again, your hatred of MAGA blinds you to the salting/enlightening/leavening work of the KOG in the world.

Your assumptions due to your infatuation with MAGA blind you to even ask honest questions so don’t worry about your self-awareness buddy.

Projection is a tactic recommended by Alinsky that you Dems like to employ.

(GW just ate your lunch :^)

Hahah. Alinsky eh?
Man, you are so programed on this topic you’re too funny.

Remember we are here at this point in the discussion because we both agreed to support RFK Jr but you didn’t like that I’m coming at it from a different angle.
So it must be your way or the highway.
You’re very cute.

And bon-appetite brother. Cheers!

 

[GWH]

All Christian cultures share the same Bible that contains MT 7:1-5, so get one, read it, learn it and apply it.

The KOG salts/enlightens/leavens the world, including MAGA and all other entities.

Re "your self-awareness buddy": Just look in the mirror as you say that.

Yes, the Dems have been leavened by Alinsky more than by the KOG IMHO, (so I hope you aren't drinking their kool-aid with your bitter herbs for lunch :^)

 

[Eli1]

All Christian cultures share the same Bible that contains MT 7:1-5, so get one, read it, learn it and apply it.

All Christian cultures share different interpretations that contain PR 11:2.
Realize it. Acknowledge it. Come to terms with it and be happy that they even had the privilege to look at it.

The KOG salts/enlightens/leavens the world, including MAGA and all other entities.

Re "your self-awareness buddy": Just look in the mirror as you say that.

Did you shatter all your mirrors?

Yes, the Dems have been leavened by Alinsky more than by the KOG IMHO, (so I hope you aren't drinking their kool-aid with your bitter herbs for lunch :^)

If you remember ( LOL ) I’m not even born in US so I am as emotionally invested in your 2-party system as watching paint dry.
But you on the other hand, are so hooked with the MAGA like an addict and you can’t let go of them until the end.
And you simply won’t accept any mid-level agreement even when I agree with you about RFK or Trump, due to your army mentality.

So what are we doing for dessert?
I personally don’t eat sugar. Do you want some tiramisu or baklava before our coffee?

 

[daisyseesthesun]

GWH, God call us a peculiar people because we are all unique. if you study the saints for even a day, you will see how different each of them are. Likewise, It may surprise you, but there will be Democrats and independents in heaven too, and the majority of Christians aren't even American or Maga. One spirit, not the same political opinion.

 

[Aaron56]

If you remember ( LOL ) I’m not even born in US

WAT?! Not 'Merican? How can you even be saved?

 

[GWH]

All Christian cultures share different interpretations that contain PR 11:2.
Realize it. Acknowledge it. Come to terms with it and be happy that they even had the privilege to look at it.




View attachment 270557




Did you shatter all your mirrors?



If you remember ( LOL ) I’m not even born in US so I am as emotionally invested in your 2-party system as watching paint dry.
But you on the other hand, are so hooked with the MAGA like an addict and you can’t let go of them until the end.
And you simply won’t accept any mid-level agreement even when I agree with you about RFK or Trump, due to your army mentality.

So what are we doing for dessert?
I personally don’t eat sugar. Do you want some tiramisu or baklava before our coffee?

Well, I have applied PR 11:1 by learning MT 5:13-16, 6:10&33, 7:1-5, and LK 17:20-21, but all I can say in response to your lies and projections is that I bet you a million dollars worth of heavenly riches that my understanding of the KOG is closer to correct than your apparent preference for the Marxist Dems.

Since you cannot quote me being hooked on MAGA, I will quote myself:

"I perceive earthly experience as a history-long "king of the hill" (KOTH) war or struggle against both sinful people and natural disasters, and IMO the recent election was a battle won by the MAGA folks over the evil forces of atheism/communism/fascism and globalism in the Dem party.

We all are imperfect, but the leaven/light/salt/truth/kingdom of God/GW=HS has made us better than what we would be without such blessings and morally better than the enemy servants of Satan, even though we should love them too. God has always employed human agency to accomplish His POS.

BTW, some of the goals espoused by leftists are good, but good ends do not justify evil means, especially because utopia (the KOG) will never be attained in this earthly realm, especially by atheists."

 

[GWH]

GWH, God call us a peculiar people because we are all unique. if you study the saints for even a day, you will see how different each of them are. Likewise, It may surprise you, but there will be Democrats and independents in heaven too, and the majority of Christians aren't even American or Maga. One spirit, not the same political opinion.

Daisy, One way we are peculiar is that we believe the truth, and the truth is that I have never said anything that disagrees with what you just said, so why did you say it?!

 

[Eli1]

Well, I have applied PR 11:1 by learning MT 5:13-16, 6:10&33, 7:1-5, and LK 17:20-21, but all I can say in response to your lies and projections is that I bet you a million dollars worth of heavenly riches that my understanding of the KOG is closer to correct than your apparent preference for the Marxist Dems.

Well the reason I’ve mentioned PR11:1 to you is precisely because of your attitude which I’ve seen in your other comments to others where you say “My interpretation is closer to God’s”.
I mean I don’t know if you realize how ridiculous you sound. Like a small child “look at me guys, I’m the smartest of them all”.

Secondly, to bring things home again, I don’t like the Dems any more than you do and I am very happy with the current way the election turned out, but I don’t support MAGA because of anything Biblical.
And this is where you get bent out of shape, because you desperately want to link some random political party at a random part of the globe in a random year in history with the Kingdom Of God.
This is where your problem is which is fueled by your habits in the military and your emotional and spiritual investment in an earthly political party.
So have some PR11:1 and know that you are 100% wrong by linking MAGA with KOG and I will be here to remind you of that daily.

Since you cannot quote me being hooked on MAGA, I will quote myself:

"I perceive earthly experience as a history-long "king of the hill" (KOTH) war or struggle against both sinful people and natural disasters, and IMO the recent election was a battle won by the MAGA folks over the evil forces of atheism/communism/fascism and globalism in the Dem party.

I perceive earthly history as a scale which self-corrects itself and which repeats itself. History always repeats itself and always find balance which is done by the mass-consciousness.
Currently, the win of the MAGA is a win which was needed and also bound to happen because the Left has gone too much into the extreme. So to balance it, people said “enough” and applied another mindset to the current insane mindset by the left who can’t tell us what a woman is.

We all are imperfect, but the leaven/light/salt/truth/kingdom of God/GW=HS has made us better than what we would be without such blessings and morally better than the enemy servants of Satan, even though we should love them too. God has always employed human agency to accomplish His POS.

We are ambassadors of Christ here, not politicians. This is why we pay what’s owed to the Cesar (or governments) and we carry on with our spiritual journey in this physical existence seeking our true home and the true Kingdom of God.
And thank God we live in a country where state and religion is separated because we’d be like another Muslim country with sharia law.
The founding fathers of this country were smart because they had experience coming from the land of kings and queens.

BTW, some of the goals espoused by leftists are good, but good ends do not justify evil means, especially because utopia (the KOG) will never be attained in this earthly realm, especially by atheists."

I agree that the KOG will never be attained here but also I’m not sure what good things the left has anymore since they are lost in identity politics. But they used to be pretty good when they supported the blue collar worker and the working class.
But instead they have switched from protecting people’s rights to protecting people’s feelings.

You play backgammon?

 

[Eli1]

Oh an another thing.
The current political rhetoric in USA is at this point comical which is why i enjoy it by the way and it's a reality show, so when i hear talking points from either side they make me laugh.
Your comment "Marxist Left" made me laugh because most people in the West have no clue what communism is.
It's basically a political talking point like taxes, or trickle down economics or your body my choice ( lol ).
But, i have lived in an actual communist country during cold war so if you want to know anything about communism you can always ask. Not just me but anybody who has lived through it.
This was a regime which had state-sanctioned atheism by the way. Very close to North Korea.

 

[Eli1]

You know why i like backgammon by the way?

Because you can play strategically and the dice can ruin your game, or you can play horribly and the dice can improve your game.
So, nothing is in your control.

 

[GWH]

Well the reason I’ve mentioned PR11:1 to you is precisely because of your attitude which I’ve seen in your other comments to others where you say “My interpretation is closer to God’s”.
I mean I don’t know if you realize how ridiculous you sound. Like a small child “look at me guys, I’m the smartest of them all”.

Secondly, to bring things home again, I don’t like the Dems any more than you do and I am very happy with the current way the election turned out, but I don’t support MAGA because of anything Biblical.
And this is where you get bent out of shape, because you desperately want to link some random political party at a random part of the globe in a random year in history with the Kingdom Of God.
This is where your problem is which is fueled by your habits in the military and your emotional and spiritual investment in an earthly political party.
So have some PR11:1 and know that you are 100% wrong by linking MAGA with KOG and I will be here to remind you of that daily.



I perceive earthly history as a scale which self-corrects itself and which repeats itself. History always repeats itself and always find balance which is done by the mass-consciousness.
Currently, the win of the MAGA is a win which was needed and also bound to happen because the Left has gone too much into the extreme. So to balance it, people said “enough” and applied another mindset to the current insane mindset by the left who can’t tell us what a woman is.



We are ambassadors of Christ here, not politicians. This is why we pay what’s owed to the Cesar (or governments) and we carry on with our spiritual journey in this physical existence seeking our true home and the true Kingdom of God.
And thank God we live in a country where state and religion is separated because we’d be like another Muslim country with sharia law.
The founding fathers of this country were smart because they had experience coming from the land of kings and queens.



I agree that the KOG will never be attained here but also I’m not sure what good things the left has anymore since they are lost in identity politics. But they used to be pretty good when they supported the blue collar worker and the working class.
But instead they have switched from protecting people’s rights to protecting people’s feelings.

You play backgammon?
View attachment 270561

Apparently, you don't think your interpretation is closer to correct than others, so why don't you change your interpretation to be closer?! Rather than ridiculous, that would sound like you are humble/teachable, instead of sounding like you are hypocritical because you think are throwing a tantrum because I don't agree with you! "So have some PR11:1 and know that you are 100% wrong by linking MAGA with KOG and I will be here to remind you of that daily." When have I ever said anything so prideful? Neither of us can claim to know anything with absolute certainty, because we are fallible.

I am glad you do not like the Dem policies, and you say you are happy MAGA won, although you don't support them because you think their policies are more Biblical, so just why do you support them?

I am unaware of ever being "bent out of shape", so please quote me saying something that you think indicates/manifests such.

All Christians around the globe in all eras are linked with the Kingdom Of God, and my military service has nothing to do with that belief other than that I think most soldiers hope our cause is just, i.e., peacemaking rather than warmongering.

You said, "I perceive earthly history as a scale which self-corrects itself and which repeats itself. History always repeats itself and always find balance which is done by the mass-consciousness." Well, I think God would be pleased if you would help history be better by being leaven/light/salt/truth/kingdom of God/GW=HS.

You said "Currently, the win of the MAGA is a win which was needed and also bound to happen because the Left has gone too much into the extreme. So to balance it, people said “enough” and applied another mindset to the current insane mindset by the left who can’t tell us what a woman is." What you ignore is that the people saying "enough" included a lot of Christians, whereas the Left includes a lot of atheists.

You said, "We are ambassadors of Christ here, not politicians." Whether ambassadors or politicians, we all are imperfect, and we should try to be better and elect better.

You said, "And thank God we live in a country where state and religion is separated because we’d be like another Muslim country with sharia law." I agree, but that is a different issue than what I have been saying.

You said, "I agree that the KOG will never be attained here but also I’m not sure what good things the left has anymore since they are lost in identity politics. But they used to be pretty good when they supported the blue collar worker and the working class.
But instead they have switched from protecting people’s rights to protecting people’s feelings." I agree, but I am astounded that you don't agree with me saying MAGA is better aligned with GW, if you believe helping the poorer classes is a good thing.

 

[Eli1]

You said, "I agree that the KOG will never be attained here but also I’m not sure what good things the left has anymore since they are lost in identity politics. But they used to be pretty good when they supported the blue collar worker and the working class.
But instead they have switched from protecting people’s rights to protecting people’s feelings." I agree, but I am astounded that you don't agree with me saying MAGA is better aligned with GW, if you believe helping the poorer classes is a good thing

Apparently, you don't think your interpretation is closer to correct than others, so why don't you change your interpretation to be closer?! Rather than ridiculous, that would sound like you are humble/teachable, instead of sounding like you are hypocritical because you think are throwing a tantrum because I don't agree with you! "So have some PR11:1 and know that you are 100% wrong by linking MAGA with KOG and I will be here to remind you of that daily." When have I ever said anything so prideful? Neither of us can claim to know anything with absolute certainty, because we are fallible.

You are astounded because you are too emotionally invested with the conservative ideology to see anything with the least amount of bias.
So you can’t understand anything outside of your bubble and I don’t think you ever will.
The fact that you don’t even accept mid-level agreement and it has to be absolutely 100% your way or the highway speaks to this fact of the ideology you have bought yourself in.

My interpretation of the Bible is not like you or in some Protestant circles where you treat it as a crossword puzzle to fit your preconceived ideologies. And for the things that are unknown, I say that they are unknown or mysteries and are left up to God. I don’t come up with theories and find Bible verses to support them.

So if you claim to be fallible then don’t say “ my understanding is correct” because you are just another man in year 2024 in an internet forum and there have been many men before us who can’t solve any important existential and mysteries of God.

I am glad you do not like the Dem policies, and you say you are happy MAGA won, although you don't support them because you think their policies are more Biblical, so just why do you support them?

I am unaware of ever being "bent out of shape", so please quote me saying something that you think indicates/manifests such.

All Christians around the globe in all eras are linked with the Kingdom Of God, and my military service has nothing to do with that belief other than that I think most soldiers hope our cause is just, i.e., peacemaking rather than warmongering.

Because they counterbalance the leftists. I told you this already many times. MAGA is needed to restore balance.
My comments about your military habits are said because you want to have uniformity in the ranks. Your way or the highway. Let go bro. We are all different. The apostles themselves were different. They were not robots. Otherwise God would have created robots who think and act the same.
So why do you have this need that you want to force others to think like you? Especially when you are wrong when mixing politics with KOG.

You said, "I perceive earthly history as a scale which self-corrects itself and which repeats itself. History always repeats itself and always find balance which is done by the mass-consciousness." Well, I think God would be pleased if you would help history be better by being leaven/light/salt/truth/kingdom of God/GW=HS.

You said, "We are ambassadors of Christ here, not politicians." Whether ambassadors or politicians, we all are imperfect, and we should try to be better and elect better.

You said, "And thank God we live in a country where state and religion is separated because we’d be like another Muslim country with sharia law." I agree, but that is a different issue than what I have been saying.

Of course but not by investing our spiritual focus of God in any current political parties. We are the salt of the earth through our churches where we help and give food to the less fortunate ones and we also fill their spirits with the message of Christ.
We leave Caesar stuff to the Cesar people. So this is where you need to do your mental separation. When you vote, you're not voting for the KOG. You're voting to restore balance and sanity in your community. And this cycle is going to repeat itself.

You said "Currently, the win of the MAGA is a win which was needed and also bound to happen because the Left has gone too much into the extreme. So to balance it, people said “enough” and applied another mindset to the current insane mindset by the left who can’t tell us what a woman is." What you ignore is that the people saying "enough" included a lot of Christians, whereas the Left includes a lot of atheists.

Yeah no, and what you don’t realize is that people throughout history have done this a million times without involving any type of religion.
I’m surprised because you’ve posted a history thread somewhere else which I like but I’m wondering if you’ve copy/pasted stuff without understanding.

 

[GWH]

No, I am astounded you can't see that YOU are guilty of what you accuse me of.

I don't know what "mid-level agreement" you want me to accept. Is wanting 50% agreement better than wanting 100%?

You said, "My interpretation of the Bible is not like you or in some Protestant circles where you treat it as a crossword puzzle to fit your preconceived ideologies." Projection/hypocrisy strikes again!

You said, "And for the things that are unknown, I say that they are unknown or mysteries and are left up to God. I don’t come up with theories and find Bible verses to support them.": Okay, so what? How do you know what will remain a mystery and what you might learn with a little more Bible study?

You said, "So if you claim to be fallible then don’t say “ my understanding is correct”. Quote me saying that, because I am quite sure I have said "IMO" or "more correct", because as I say on my website, "As truthseekers, whenever we encounter someone who has a contradictory understanding, we want to learn which is the better belief, to admit when we are wrong, and to change our opinion. As people-lovers we want to share our knowledge with other truthseekers, so that we may fellowship (2TM 4:3-4, 1JN 1:3).

A truthseeker wants to know the truth, and is guided by the question: What is most true or closest to the truth? The basis for determining truth is subjective logic that is made as objective as possible by learning from other truthseekers, preferably via dialogue when possible. Everyone lives by fallible faith/belief/opinion and sufficient knowledge of evidence rather than by absolute certainty or proof or coercion (2CR 5:7). However, a logical train of thought leads an unbiased truthseeker to have a propensity to believe in an all-loving God, who is not tricky and does not hide the way to heaven (HB 11:6, ACTS 13:10).

My reason for posting on CC is simply to share my fallible faith with others, hoping they will find what I have learned helpful for understanding ultimate truth. I am grateful to all people—famous philosophers and anonymous acquaintances—who have helped shape my beliefs."

You said, "My comments about your military habits are said because you want to have uniformity in the ranks. Your way or the highway.": Your failure to quote me causes you to lie about what I say, which is that I would like to be part of the answer to the prayer of Jesus for oneness in JN 17:20-23, so tell Him that we are all different, bro.

You said, "We are the salt of the earth through our churches where we help and give food to the less fortunate ones and we also fill their spirits with the message of Christ.": Yes, but even churches are imperfect entities needing more salt and light from the invisible KOG.

 

[Eli1]

No, I am astounded you can't see that YOU are guilty of what you accuse me of.

Man, you are a mess. Let’s do a recap.
You say that “my interpretation of the KOG is close to correct on how God would interpret it”
I say “you sound like a child”
You say “I am fallible”
I say “then don’t say that you are correct”
You say something completely unrelated to this train of thought.
Do you have comprehension problems or something?

I don't know what "mid-level agreement" you want me to accept. Is wanting 50% agreement better than wanting 100%?

The mid-level agreement is that I told you that I support RFK, Trump or MAGA, but NOT because it has anything to do with God.
This is the part that gets you bent out of shape and can’t accept.
Try to accept this. Everything will be okay if you do.

You said, "My interpretation of the Bible is not like you or in some Protestant circles where you treat it as a crossword puzzle to fit your preconceived ideologies." Projection/hypocrisy strikes again!

You are the one who confuses KOG with Politics. Not me. Do you even know what projection means?

You said, "And for the things that are unknown, I say that they are unknown or mysteries and are left up to God. I don’t come up with theories and find Bible verses to support them.": Okay, so what? How do you know what will remain a mystery and what you might learn with a little more Bible study?

Hahah. What kind of question is this? Because it’s self evident that’s how.
Topics like young earth creation or aliens or the location of Garden of Eden and many other topics which don’t have clear answers. Those are mysteries.
Also why do you think you will find the answers in the Bible only? You are the one who has said that God is self-evident in nature too right? So we look in the Bible and in Nature and when we have no answer then it’s a mystery.

You said, "So if you claim to be fallible then don’t say “ my understanding is correct”. Quote me saying that, because I am quite sure I have said "IMO" or "more correct", because as I say on my website, "As truthseekers, whenever we encounter someone who has a contradictory understanding, we want to learn which is the better belief, to admit when we are wrong, and to change our opinion. As people-lovers we want to share our knowledge with other truthseekers, so that we may fellowship (2TM 4:3-4, 1JN 1:3).

So hold on a second here. You think that because you said IMO this somehow makes you more humble when you say that God is going to agree with you? LOL Bro you are hilarious.
And TM 4:3-4 applies to you too but since you’ve shattered all your mirrors you can’t see anything anymore about yourself.

This here also speaks about this whole notion of iron sharpening iron right? But here’s the thing, if you are unable to receive information that KOG is not the same as MAGA then how are you even going to receive any “sharpening”. All you’re becoming is more dull.

A truthseeker wants to know the truth, and is guided by the question: What is most true or closest to the truth? The basis for determining truth is subjective logic that is made as objective as possible by learning from other truthseekers, preferably via dialogue when possible. Everyone lives by fallible faith/belief/opinion and sufficient knowledge of evidence rather than by absolute certainty or proof or coercion (2CR 5:7). However, a logical train of thought leads an unbiased truthseeker to have a propensity to believe in an all-loving God, who is not tricky and does not hide the way to heaven (HB 11:6, ACTS 13:10).

Where do you think your “logical” train of thought has led you in your pursuit to merge your love of MAGA with KOG? At some dead end station?

My reason for posting on CC is simply to share my fallible faith with others, hoping they will find what I have learned helpful for understanding ultimate truth. I am grateful to all people—famous philosophers and anonymous acquaintances—who have helped shape my beliefs."

Amen to that! I am also grateful for many others before me who have done a lot of work in understanding our natural and spiritual state. I am most grateful for Jesus Christ Himself.

You said, "My comments about your military habits are said because you want to have uniformity in the ranks. Your way or the highway.": Your failure to quote me causes you to lie about what I say, which is that I would like to be part of the answer to the prayer of Jesus for oneness in JN 17:20-23, so tell Him that we are all different, bro.

Bro, focus. I will never support MAGA on Biblical basis because it’s not supportable. You can support it of course because you have free-will, and I will call you out for it.
I support MAGA on NON-Biblical basis.

You said, "We are the salt of the earth through our churches where we help and give food to the less fortunate ones and we also fill their spirits with the message of Christ.": Yes, but even churches are imperfect entities needing more salt and light from the invisible KOG.

Well yes of course churches are not perfect but they are the closest aligned to the KOG not some political party in USA in 2024 election. LOL

 

[GWH]

Man, you are a mess. Let’s do a recap.
You say that “my interpretation of the KOG is close to correct on how God would interpret it”
I say “you sound like a child”
You say “I am fallible”
I say “then don’t say that you are correct”
You say something completely unrelated to this train of thought.
Do you have comprehension problems or something?





The mid-level agreement is that I told you that I support RFK, Trump or MAGA, but NOT because it has anything to do with God.
This is the part that gets you bent out of shape and can’t accept.
Try to accept this. Everything will be okay if you do.




You are the one who confuses KOG with Politics. Not me. Do you even know what projection means?



Hahah. What kind of question is this? Because it’s self evident that’s how.
Topics like young earth creation or aliens or the location of Garden of Eden and many other topics which don’t have clear answers. Those are mysteries.
Also why do you think you will find the answers in the Bible only? You are the one who has said that God is self-evident in nature too right? So we look in the Bible and in Nature and when we have no answer then it’s a mystery.



So hold on a second here. You think that because you said IMO this somehow makes you more humble when you say that God is going to agree with you? LOL Bro you are hilarious.
And TM 4:3-4 applies to you too but since you’ve shattered all your mirrors you can’t see anything anymore about yourself.

This here also speaks about this whole notion of iron sharpening iron right? But here’s the thing, if you are unable to receive information that KOG is not the same as MAGA then how are you even going to receive any “sharpening”. All you’re becoming is more dull.



Where do you think your “logical” train of thought has led you in your pursuit to merge your love of MAGA with KOG? At some dead end station?



Amen to that! I am also grateful for many others before me who have done a lot of work in understanding our natural and spiritual state. I am most grateful for Jesus Christ Himself.



Bro, focus. I will never support MAGA on Biblical basis because it’s not supportable. You can support it of course because you have free-will, and I will call you out for it.
I support MAGA on NON-Biblical basis.




Well yes of course churches are not perfect but they are the closest aligned to the KOG not some political party in USA in 2024 election. LOL

Without having a direct quote, I can only say that I think I said something like "my interpretation of the KOG is closer to correct or how God means it than yours".

I generally ignore insults such as “you sound like a child” as not worth responding to.

I say both that I am fallible and that I believe I am correct because I amend by belief as soon as I think another is better/truer.

You said "You say something completely unrelated to this train of thought. Do you have comprehension problems or something?": I have no idea what you are ranting about since you did not provide a quote.

You said, "The mid-level agreement is that I told you that I support RFK, Trump or MAGA, but NOT because it has anything to do with God. This is the part that gets you bent out of shape and can’t accept." I don't get bent but merely surprised that you support folks for reasons that have nothing to do with GW, because I always evaluate people in light of GW.

You said, "You are the one who confuses KOG with Politics. Not me." I deny doing that, but you cannot deny judging me in that regard, because you just did and do it every post. "you treat it as a crossword puzzle to fit your preconceived ideologies."

You asked, "Do you even know what projection means?" Of course, especially because I have been experiencing it every time you post.

You said, "It is self-evident that I will not learn the answer to a mystery with a little more Bible study." I cannot argue with that.

Yes, many topics are mysteries, but I know that I have learned a lot of answers to questions I have had by studying GW with an open mind.

You ask, "why do you think you will find the answers in the Bible only?" Did I say "only"? Yes, we learn from scientific study of nature also.

You said, "So You think that because you said IMO this somehow makes you more humble when you say that God is going to agree with you?": I say that to indicate that even though I have searched the Scriptures diligently seeking answers to various questions, I do not claim that what I found is infallible, even though as a truthseeker, whenever I encounter someone who has a contradictory understanding, I want to learn which is the better belief, to admit when I am wrong, and to change my opinion. IOW, I always apply Scripture to myself, which is why you may have noticed that I do not judge or belittle your beliefs, but only try to defend against your attacks.

You asked, "Where do you think your “logical” train of thought has led you in your pursuit to merge your love of MAGA with KOG?" If you read my quote you should see that I said "logic will lead an unbiased truthseeker to have a propensity to believe in an all-loving God, who is not tricky and does not hide the way to heaven (HB 11:6, ACTS 13:10)."

You said, "Amen to that! ["My reason for posting on CC is simply to share my fallible faith with others, hoping they will find what I have learned helpful for understanding ultimate truth. I am grateful to all people—famous philosophers and anonymous acquaintances—who have helped shape my beliefs."] I am also grateful for many others before me who have done a lot of work in understanding our natural and spiritual state. I am most grateful for Jesus Christ Himself." Amen!

You said, "I will never support MAGA on Biblical basis because it’s not supportable. You can support it of course because you have free-will, and I will call you out for it." Okay, I will do that next time, but for now I will merely repeat that your failure to quote me causes you to lie about what I say, which is that I would like to be part of the answer to the prayer of Jesus for oneness in JN 17:20-23, so He is the one you should tell that we are all different.

You said, "Well yes of course churches are not perfect but they are the closest aligned to the KOG not some political party in USA in 2024 election." Yes, IYHO, and in the same way MAGA policies are more closely aligned with the KOG morality than the current Dems IMHO.