Understanding God’s election

[Genez]

Why does Genesis 2:7 read חַיִּ֑ים plural rather than singular?

https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/39568/why-does-genesis-27-read-חַיִּ֑ים-plural-rather-than-singular

 

[ocean]

My questions are in response to what people post. And the reason I ask questions is so as to not assume what is being said.
As to why the questions are posed to those who hold a view different from mine, I'm interested in why people hold the positions they do. Invariably the questions would be to those with differing views because I already know the reasons why people would hold the same position.

I don't think you read my post very carefully.

 

[Magenta]

This passage speaks to what kind of life that was put into the ark. The phrase "breath of life" is referring to nostril breathing creatures (Gen 7:22) -- humans and animals alike. The passage says nothing about any creature becoming a "living soul". Nor does scripture teach that God breathed life into animals, etc. Or that any of the animals were spiritually living beings or souls.

Eh? What I said was, All flesh has this breath of life. You contested it, and asked for verses showing that animals
have the breath of life. You cannot explain them away as you have tried. All animals have the breath of life.

For the fate of the sons of men and the fate of beasts is the same. As one dies so dies the other; indeed,
they all have the same breath and there is no advantage for man over beast, for all is vanity. Ecclesiastes 3:19

 

[Rufus]

I don't have to wrestle with your maxim at all because Jesus Christ was purposed from before the foundation
of the world to bring/bestow spiritual life to those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life.

And what does that have to do with Adam's spiritual state before he sinned? Was Adam spiritually alive or dead prior to his fall? If Adam were the latter, then he had not much advantage over any of us who also come into this world as spiritual stillborns. Or...do you think Adam came into this world in a morally neutral state -- neither dead or alive? But even then....he couldn't have died spiritually after he sinned because death always presupposes antecedent life. Only the living can die.

Many of us here really should pay better attention to the metaphors in scripture. So many of us handle the metaphors and similes in scripture in a careless, slip-shod manner.

 

[Magenta]

And what does that have to do with Adam's spiritual state before he sinned? Was Adam spiritually alive or dead prior to his fall? If Adam were the latter, then he had not much advantage over any of us who also come into this world as spiritual stillborns. Or...do you think Adam came into this world in a morally neutral state -- neither dead or alive? But even then....he couldn't have died spiritually after he sinned because death always presupposes antecedent life. Only the living can die.

Many of us here really should pay better attention to the metaphors in scripture. So many of us handle the metaphors and similes in scripture in a careless, slip-shod manner.

Adam was of the natural world and there is ZERO in Scripture to indicate he was indwelt with the Holy Spirit of God.

I accept what Scripture says: he became a living soul when God breathed into him the breath of life. (Genesis 2:7)

 

[Rufus]

Eh? What I said was, All flesh has this breath of life. You contested it, and asked for verses showing that animals
have the breath of life. You cannot explain them away as you have tried. All animals have the breath of life.

For the fate of the sons of men and the fate of beasts is the same. As one dies so dies the other; indeed,
they all have the same breath and there is no advantage for man over beast, for all is vanity. Ecclesiastes 3:19

Yes, all animals have the breath of life; but show me in scripture where God breathed that life into them and those animals became living souls!

And what Solomon is talking about in the above passage is physical death. Both the sons of men and the animals all face the same destiny: Physical Death! But...we're not talking physical death in the case of Adam. You and I both came into this world with the "breath of life" in us -- but we were still DEAD spiritually at the time of birth. All the unregenerate sinners in this world came into it with the "breath of life" in them, but they are DEAD in their trespasses and sins. And if the die physically in that spiritual state, then they will suffer the second death.

So...let me ask you this question for clarification: Do you believe that Adam died spiritually on the day he disobeyed?

 

[Rufus]

Adam was of the natural world and there is ZERO in Scripture to indicate he was indwelt with the Holy Spirit of God.

I accept what Scripture says: he became a living soul when God breathed into him the breath of life. (Genesis 2:7)

Yes...and that's the only scripture that describes how God imparted Spiritual Life to Adam's soul. Show me a text whereby God breathes the breath of life into the nostrils of animals. You're comparing apples to oranges.

 

[Genez]

Very confusing when someone bases his premise on a mainstream translation into English.

Nephesh in Genesis One meant soul life.
Animals were given souls.
Man also has a soul.

But, they were not the same kind of soul.

For man's soul was uniquely created in God's image, and animals were not.

What was created in God's image is the human soul. Not the body.

The human body is a phenomenal biological vehicle that God designed for a human soul to move about with while living in the material world.

 

[Cameron143]

Then he couldn't have died spiritually, could he? If Christians are made alive by the Spirit, then how could Adam have died subsequent to fall? What you're really saying is that Adam was created in a state of spiritual death! It's only God's Spirit who gives LIFE! God himself BREATHED into Adam --- and he became a LIVING soul or being. Also read Ezek 37 sometime. What you're postulating is illogical -- unless you don't believe that Adam died spiritually after he sinned.

There are 2 parts to man...that which is material and that which is immaterial. When sin occurred, spiritual death, physical death, and eternal death should have immediately ensued. Instead, God immediately entered into a covenant of grace with Adam and Eve. A promise was given, a vow was made, and a sign was given.
When God placed His image in man, this allowed man to relate to God. When sin entered, the image of God in man was marred and corrupted. Man could no longer relate to God intimately. This is the spiritual death that was wrought through Adam. Man can still know of God's existence through nature and Providence, as well as through conscience, but he is no longer able to relate to God intimately as before. Sin has separated man from God. As a part of the common grace, man is allowed to continue to live, reproduce, and work.

So I don't believe man was born spiritually dead.

 

[Magenta]

Yes...and that's the only scripture that describes how God imparted Spiritual Life to Adam's soul. Show me a text whereby God breathes the breath of life into the nostrils of animals. You're comparing apples to oranges.

I showed you a text where it says all have the same breath. You dispute what Scripture says.

 

[Genez]

I showed you a text where it says all have the same breath. You dispute what Scripture says.

Yes... All animals have a soul.

Man also has a soul.

But, the difference?

Man's soul was created in the image of God.
Animal souls were created generic in nature.

That is why God was able to give us animals for food.

Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, ​

so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, ​

over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures ​

that move along the ground.”​

​

So God created mankind in his own image,​

in the image of God he created them;​

male and female he created them." Genesis 1:26-27​

Man's soul was created in Chapter One before the body came into existence in the second chapter of Genesis.


........

 

[MeowFlower]

So, the fall of Adam was a part of God's plan to deal with the denials of Satan which he gave when he fell.

I didn't say that.

 

[Inquisitor]

See my reply to Cameron. What's illogical is that your theory (and Cam's) would mean that God created Adam in a state of spiritual death. There are numerous scriptures that teach that God is the source of LIFE, most especially the most important form of life...spiritual!

Either Adam came into this world as living soul unto God or he was created with a dead soul. There is no third option. So, which is it?

The third option is Adam was created with flesh and blood.

Flesh and blood cannot inherit eternal life.

We also know that Adam would need to changed from the flesh to the Spirit, to enter heaven.

Even though Adam had not yet encountered death, Adam also had not eaten from the tree of life.

So we cannot explain the state that Adam was in, before he ate of the tree of knowledge.

The text provides no information regarding this issue.