Understanding God’s election
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Yet you said it was applied to Adam and Eve and that they were therefore saved.
Yes he does,
He enables everyone the opportunity.
But he will not overrule their free choice.. Not everyone will receive his love..
Adam was as free as you or I.
He could have resisted and told Eve no. he could have fought for her instead of letting her sin.. Thats why the onus falls on Adam. Eve was deceived. Adam knew what he was doing..
We are born in a state of grace.
no one deserves to live, even the baby, who is in adam..
Thats right.
As typified in the Jewish wedding contract, where the Bride has EVERY RIGHT and opportunity to say NO, and decline the offer of marriage.
What's worse, @Magenta says that not only does the Church/Bride has zero rights as regards this offer of marriage,
Mary was provided ZERO RIGHTS and no option to decline the miraculous conception!
No. You have used things that are true to come up with a false conclusion. Yes, we all have a sin nature, but we also were created by God with a desire for God. This is why all men worship something, it is how they are created. However, no person will ever be satisfied worshipping anything or anyone other than Jesus Christ. We are created like magnets that will always be attracted to Jesus Christ.
Again, no. Yes, we were all captive to the world, but Jesus blood frees us from that captivity. His blood breaks every chain. Now there is no doubt that prayer is effective and if you pray to the Lord for the salvation of those you care about that will go a long way. Yes, our being saved is against our enemies plans, but so what, he is a pipsqueak compared to Jesus.
This is the most wishy washy and worthless doctrine. Because if you pull up all the verses that could be interpreted to mean someone lost their salvation the argument is simply "they were never saved to begin with". Why would Peter tell us to make our calling and election sure? Why would Paul tell us to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling? Are they really saying this to people who aren't actually saved?
So the doctrine is meaningless because you have not identified how someone knows that another person has been saved. We are told all the ways to check to see if someone is a false prophet. We are told all the ways we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. But the Bible never tells us how you would know if someone were eternally saved or not. Consider Demas and all those who forsake the Lord for the world. Were they saved? What, Paul is incapable of discerning? Or did Paul say that "time will tell". This doctrine is useless prattling.
which makes the point.
God permits people to reject him, He does not force them to believe. But he also gives them every opportunity. If he does not.. then how can he expect to keep another rebellion from occurring in the future?
Its not
The love is that he made the way for them to get out of Hell. He died for them.
They rejected him, he did not reject them
Now if he did not give them an opportunity to get out. if he did nto die for them. and kept them from hearing truth. Then you would be correct. it would not be loving at all.. it would be called hate in our terms.
Did Noah seek out God? Abraham? Moses? Did Adam suggest to God that He should sacrifice an animal on his behalf or make a covering for him? Adam, in fact, did just the opposite. He provided his own covering and hid from God.
All relationships with God are initiated by God, whether in the natural or spiritual realm.
False. Post-fall Adam AND the Woman were UNDOUBTELY free moral agents.
The proof is unequivocal and codified for all to see.....
There was ZERO intervention from God when our father and mother made the RIGHT DECISIONS after the fall.
OR the wrong decisions before the fall either!
Their free will reigned supreme in their predicament.
Not only that, Satan had free will to cause chaos in the garden.
And God had free will to do all that He did when He intervened.
All three parties demonstrate the free will principle.
Free will is the INITIAL CONDITION demonstrated in this drama.
"YES, Adam was free to disobey. And he did.....to save his beloved wife. And he ALSO was FREE to repent and confess....and he did.
Adam chose to sin (a wrong choice) of his own free will.....WHILE HE WAS SINLESS AND PERFECT in full fellowship with God.
And THEN, AFTER HE FELL Adam ***chose*** to do the RIGHT THING of his own free will.....by preventing Eve from eating from the tree of life, and refusing to eat from the tree of life himself (which was a devastating temptation under the circumstances! Adam by his own sheer will power refused). And the Adam did the RIGHT THING by testifying TRUTHFULLY (as did the Woman) at the trial of Satan."
We vote for a president. One will be elected. If you were to become president, or whatever job you have you need to realize God has elected you for that job. However, it doesn't change the fact that we will be judged for the things we do in this life. You may be a great president, you may be a terrible one. You would never have become president if God had not elected you, so when you appear before the judgment seat saying you won the election is not going to mean anything. What will matter is what you did as President. Those are the things that will justify you or condemn you.
Nope, despite what seems the best efforts of some to suggest otherwise.
And this faith/grace principle has been operative......SINCE THE FALL OF ADAM. And to be clear: POST FALL ADAM.
God redeemed Adam and the Woman (despite the ignorant protestations of the obstinate Calvinites) and they were both saved.
Anyone, absolutely anyone, can avail themselves of this same salvation.
And they can (if they G2309 "desire" to do so) receive it BY EXACTLY THE SAME PATTERN of repentance, confession and faith.