I am struggling

[Seeker47]

I am struggling with an issue that concerns me greatly. Perhaps someone here on CC can give me wise council.
Th nation of Israel is right now engaged in a struggle for existence. It is fighting a war against seven named enemies, all sworn to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. They are totally surrounded on all sides and their back is pressed against the sea. The nations of the world actively support her enemies or, remain largely silent and disengaged. Our own nation, long the major supporter of Israel is at best lukewarm, wavering in our commitment and in many cases openly opposed to their survival.

Yet this is not the issue for me, we were forewarned this would happen.

What keeps me tossing at night is the near total silence and indifference of the Christian church. There are a precious few that have taken a stand on this issue, but for the most part there is silence. Rarely is this mentioned from the pulpit. No sermons, no organized activities, no counter voice to the constant deadly attacks by those supporting evil. I hear no demands on our faltering government to support Israel coming from Christs own Church. The silence is deafening. Are we repeating the history of pre-WWII Germany? While Israel stands alone fighting an evil whose goal is enslavement of the world, we are risk of doing just that. Can we sit quietly while God's people are at risk?

That's the thought that keeps me awake.

 

[Aussie52]

Unfortunately, much of the Church is given to Replacement Theology, and thus, despise Israel. Antisemitism is rife in many Churches.
I would suggest that this is a sign of the last days.

 

[ImstillHealing]

I don't subscribe to replacement theology but I understand a lot of Christians who do haven't read the full chapter of Romans 11. I have been a supporter of IFCJ for several years and will continue with my support until I am no longer on this earth. I believe that Christianity is engrafted on to Abraham's tree and we are to be spiritual Jews because our father Jesus is the King of Kings. His chosen nation will always be Israel and Jerusalem. I would love to see more Christians speaking up and rallying for Israel.

 

[PennEd]

I am struggling with an issue that concerns me greatly. Perhaps someone here on CC can give me wise council.
Th nation of Israel is right now engaged in a struggle for existence. It is fighting a war against seven named enemies, all sworn to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. They are totally surrounded on all sides and their back is pressed against the sea. The nations of the world actively support her enemies or, remain largely silent and disengaged. Our own nation, long the major supporter of Israel is at best lukewarm, wavering in our commitment and in many cases openly opposed to their survival.

Yet this is not the issue for me, we were forewarned this would happen.

What keeps me tossing at night is the near total silence and indifference of the Christian church. There are a precious few that have taken a stand on this issue, but for the most part there is silence. Rarely is this mentioned from the pulpit. No sermons, no organized activities, no counter voice to the constant deadly attacks by those supporting evil. I hear no demands on our faltering government to support Israel coming from Christs own Church. The silence is deafening. Are we repeating the history of pre-WWII Germany? While Israel stands alone fighting an evil whose goal is enslavement of the world, we are risk of doing just that. Can we sit quietly while God's people are at risk?

That's the thought that keeps me awake.

Most mainline Churches teach the horribly erroneous doctrine of amillennialism.

These Churches range from total indifference of Israel, to hatred of the Jews to actually believing that the Jews in Israel aren’t really Jews.

Unfortunately, much of this lays at the feet of men like Luther and Calvin, who preached incredible vitriol against Jews. This also allowed much of the worst of the holocaust to occur.

 

[JaumeJ]

Rev_2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Rev_3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

 

[JaumeJ]

We as believers of Jesus Yeshua are inserts in the original vine. We ae not to say we are above that original, rather we are not part of it, chosen by God by our faith in Jesus Yeshua.
Pontius Pilate, unknowing to himself, professed that our King is King of the Jews, that is King of all who believe Yahweh God. Knowing this, it is fairly easy to understand who is the true Jew and who is not.
* A good meditation is to take yourself back to the time Jesus Yeshua walked this land and imagine, no, think how newly in the faith were considered, then think about when apostasy began.

 

[Jimbone]

Unfortunately, much of the Church is given to Replacement Theology, and thus, despise Israel. Antisemitism is rife in many Churches.
I would suggest that this is a sign of the last days.

Can you please define "Replacement Theology" for me, because I'm not 100% sure exactly what people mean by this when speaking about this issue. Is believing that God chose and used Israel to bring forth the Messiah, they did so exactly how He told them He would, and now Jesus is the only way to God for EVERYONE, "Replacement Theology"?

Am I supposed to believe there are more ways than Jesus to be reconciled to God? If I don't believe the current country of Israel is still Gods "chosen people" (chosen for what by the way? That's right, chosen to bring forth the Messiah. They did that) still to this day and I must agree with anything they do no matter what? Is there another way for Jews than Jesus? I am not exactly sure how you define "Replacement Theology", and am curious to know exactly what you believe that is.

 

[Seeker47]

Can you please define "Replacement Theology" for me, because I'm not 100% sure exactly what people mean by this when speaking about this issue. Is believing that God chose and used Israel to bring forth the Messiah, they did so exactly how He told them He would, and now Jesus is the only way to God for EVERYONE, "Replacement Theology"?

Am I supposed to believe there are more ways than Jesus to be reconciled to God? If I don't believe the current country of Israel is still Gods "chosen people" (chosen for what by the way? That's right, chosen to bring forth the Messiah. They did that) still to this day and I must agree with anything they do no matter what? Is there another way for Jews than Jesus? I am not exactly sure how you define "Replacement Theology", and am curious to know exactly what you believe that is.

I am no expert on "Replacement Theology" but I may be able to answer some of your questions.

Jesus Yeshua is absolutely not "Replacement Theology" and is the only savior/redeemer for EVERYONE, there is no other. God told Abraham that his descendants would be "...a blessing for all peoples on earth." Yeshua is the fulfillment of this promise. Abraham's descendants are still God's "chosen people" as are all those who come to faith through the blood of Christ.

The Messiah is the savior of all people, including Jews. Yeshua told us that some Jews would experience a “Hardening of the Heart” until the "...age of the gentiles" is complete. That is when all God’s people will respond to His call at the end times and will be redeemed, both Jew and Gentile. (I most note the growing messianic movement now underway in Israel).

“Replacement Theology” as I understand the term, is the idea that the gentile church has “replaced” God’s Chosen People. It includes the belief that all the blessings recorded in the First Testament (OT) have been taken away from Abraham’s descendants and given to the gentile church. Abraham’s people are then eternally separated from God’s blessings.

 

[Bruce_Leiter]

I am struggling with an issue that concerns me greatly. Perhaps someone here on CC can give me wise council.
Th nation of Israel is right now engaged in a struggle for existence. It is fighting a war against seven named enemies, all sworn to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. They are totally surrounded on all sides and their back is pressed against the sea. The nations of the world actively support her enemies or, remain largely silent and disengaged. Our own nation, long the major supporter of Israel is at best lukewarm, wavering in our commitment and in many cases openly opposed to their survival.

Yet this is not the issue for me, we were forewarned this would happen.

What keeps me tossing at night is the near total silence and indifference of the Christian church. There are a precious few that have taken a stand on this issue, but for the most part there is silence. Rarely is this mentioned from the pulpit. No sermons, no organized activities, no counter voice to the constant deadly attacks by those supporting evil. I hear no demands on our faltering government to support Israel coming from Christs own Church. The silence is deafening. Are we repeating the history of pre-WWII Germany? While Israel stands alone fighting an evil whose goal is enslavement of the world, we are risk of doing just that. Can we sit quietly while God's people are at risk?

That's the thought that keeps me awake.

I have written many times on "X" and Facebook that Israel has a right to defend itself. Maybe, we can all do the same.

 

[RodB651]

What keeps me tossing at night is the near total silence and indifference of the Christian church. There are a precious few that have taken a stand on this issue, but for the most part there is silence. Rarely is this mentioned from the pulpit. No sermons, no organized activities, no counter voice to the constant deadly attacks by those supporting evil. I hear no demands on our faltering government to support Israel coming from Christs own Church. The silence is deafening. Are we repeating the history of pre-WWII Germany? While Israel stands alone fighting an evil whose goal is enslavement of the world, we are risk of doing just that. Can we sit quietly while God's people are at risk?

Replacement theology / supersessionism would be my answer as well.

Yes, the silence is deafening and yes, we are repeating the history of pre WW2 Germany.

 

[j55]

Only God can read people minds. There won't be any peace in that geographic location. Especially Jerusalem.. Zechariah 12;3. Nations have attacked it in the past. Now proxies who are funded by Iran are attacking Israel. Zechariah chapter 8 . When Messiah arrives 7th Trump, then there will be peace.
Matthew chapter 24. We're in time of wars and rumors of wars. Jesus said this would happen before Messiah arrives 7th Trump. Labor pains will get more intense before Satan as false Christ comes 6th Trump, and Jesus 7 th trump.
Im not going to debate or strive.

 

[Jimbone]

I am no expert on "Replacement Theology" but I may be able to answer some of your questions.

Jesus Yeshua is absolutely not "Replacement Theology" and is the only savior/redeemer for EVERYONE, there is no other. God told Abraham that his descendants would be "...a blessing for all peoples on earth." Yeshua is the fulfillment of this promise. Abraham's descendants are still God's "chosen people" as are all those who come to faith through the blood of Christ.

The Messiah is the savior of all people, including Jews. Yeshua told us that some Jews would experience a “Hardening of the Heart” until the "...age of the gentiles" is complete. That is when all God’s people will respond to His call at the end times and will be redeemed, both Jew and Gentile. (I most note the growing messianic movement now underway in Israel).

“Replacement Theology” as I understand the term, is the idea that the gentile church has “replaced” God’s Chosen People. It includes the belief that all the blessings recorded in the First Testament (OT) have been taken away from Abraham’s descendants and given to the gentile church. Abraham’s people are then eternally separated from God’s blessings.

HMMMM, God's chosen people huh? Well what exactly were they "chosen" to do? It's my understanding they were chosen to bring forth the Messiah who all nations of the world would be blessed through. Guess what? THEY DID IT!!!!!!!! WWOOOO!!! They were Gods chosen people to bring forth the Messiah through, and they did. Now ALL men are saved through Jesus right?

Now- "For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God."
Right?
This in no way replaces anything, it fulfills His promises and word and makes the way for man to be reconciled to God. As far as the whole Mosaic System of Gods temple and animal sacrifice, that was all pointing to Jesus and served it's purpose, that age came to an end exactly when Jesus said it would. Now I wouldn't say that system was "replaced" exactly. It served it's purpose exactly how it was supposed to. It pointed to Jesus and Jesus came. There is no more need to point to Him anymore, now we follow Him. ALL of us, and I know quite a few messianic Jews, they weren't "replaced", but their way to God is the same as ours now. I just think calling that "replacement" anything is kind of off the mark, really it's just Fulfillment Theology.

 

[Seeker47]

HMMMM, God's chosen people huh? Well what exactly were they "chosen" to do? It's my understanding they were chosen to bring forth the Messiah who all nations of the world would be blessed through. Guess what? THEY DID IT!!!!!!!! WWOOOO!!! They were Gods chosen people to bring forth the Messiah through, and they did. Now ALL men are saved through Jesus right?

Now- "For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God."
Right?
This in no way replaces anything, it fulfills His promises and word and makes the way for man to be reconciled to God. As far as the whole Mosaic System of Gods temple and animal sacrifice, that was all pointing to Jesus and served it's purpose, that age came to an end exactly when Jesus said it would. Now I wouldn't say that system was "replaced" exactly. It served it's purpose exactly how it was supposed to. It pointed to Jesus and Jesus came. There is no more need to point to Him anymore, now we follow Him. ALL of us, and I know quite a few messianic Jews, they weren't "replaced", but their way to God is the same as ours now. I just think calling that "replacement" anything is kind of off the mark, really it's just Fulfillment Theology.

Yes! Yes! Well said brother!

 

[JaumeJ]

HMMMM, God's chosen people huh? Well what exactly were they "chosen" to do? It's my understanding they were chosen to bring forth the Messiah who all nations of the world would be blessed through. Guess what? THEY DID IT!!!!!!!! WWOOOO!!! They were Gods chosen people to bring forth the Messiah through, and they did. Now ALL men are saved through Jesus right?

Now- "For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God."
Right?
This in no way replaces anything, it fulfills His promises and word and makes the way for man to be reconciled to God. As far as the whole Mosaic System of Gods temple and animal sacrifice, that was all pointing to Jesus and served it's purpose, that age came to an end exactly when Jesus said it would. Now I wouldn't say that system was "replaced" exactly. It served it's purpose exactly how it was supposed to. It pointed to Jesus and Jesus came. There is no more need to point to Him anymore, now we follow Him. ALL of us, and I know quite a few messianic Jews, they weren't "replaced", but their way to God is the same as ours now. I just think calling that "replacement" anything is kind of off the mark, really it's just Fulfillment Theology.

One night, after I experienced theinfilling of the Holy Spirit, I was taught by a voice coming to me in my sleep saying, "The children of Israel, while they were in the Wilderness, were disobedient, and by their disobedience salvation was gained by the ntions.: For me this explained dthe choden part of chosen people, and it is a wonderful blessing.

 

[ServantofMostHigh]

I am struggling with an issue that concerns me greatly. Perhaps someone here on CC can give me wise council.
Th nation of Israel is right now engaged in a struggle for existence. It is fighting a war against seven named enemies, all sworn to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. They are totally surrounded on all sides and their back is pressed against the sea. The nations of the world actively support her enemies or, remain largely silent and disengaged. Our own nation, long the major supporter of Israel is at best lukewarm, wavering in our commitment and in many cases openly opposed to their survival.

Yet this is not the issue for me, we were forewarned this would happen.

What keeps me tossing at night is the near total silence and indifference of the Christian church. There are a precious few that have taken a stand on this issue, but for the most part there is silence. Rarely is this mentioned from the pulpit. No sermons, no organized activities, no counter voice to the constant deadly attacks by those supporting evil. I hear no demands on our faltering government to support Israel coming from Christs own Church. The silence is deafening. Are we repeating the history of pre-WWII Germany? While Israel stands alone fighting an evil whose goal is enslavement of the world, we are risk of doing just that. Can we sit quietly while God's people are at risk?

That's the thought that keeps me awake.

it's not the healthy that need a doctor The Messiah was given to the israelites because they are the ones who need His help the Most, they are the biggest sinners, they are a stiff necked people who constantly stray from God's Council, they believe in the Law of Moses . .an eye for an eye, the atrocity that was done to them recently was abhorrent yet what that nation is doing in gaza and all their neighbours is far beyond an eye for an eye, 1400 israelites killed yet how many Palestinians have been killed 50,000, Yeshua And Heavenly Father gonna rebuke them severely, Most High gonna let the Land of Israel turn into a radioactive ash pile, the Israeli test have gone into an orgy of violence now we see how black their soul is, eyes are gonna melt in their sockets and tongue will stick to the roofs of their mouths.
the Tenth Commandment is not to covet their neighbour houses etc but Israel is obsessed about grabbing land, the final commandment, they have strayed from My Fathers Commandments, look at the place that's supposed to be a,Holy land. it is blood drenched prison of hatred on all sides shame on all of you, Palestinians and Jews alike
I will tell you the motive for the war in middle east...Temple Mount, the Jews want to kick Muslims off Temple Mount because the Jews think they Can bring down the Messiah to Earth in the 3rd Temple When it's built, The Jews want to do their ritual sacrifices but if they do they are denying Yeshuas sacrifice
The Muslims want too hold on too Temple Mount because they fear the Return of Messiah because He will expose their Hatred, my brothers and sisters do not take this side or that, its evil all within human hearts in that region. Look at what they have done to Yerusalem....Jerusalem is ment to be a city of peace but that is a mockery now, Father gonna rebuke this world for we have all gone astray like lost sheep and the shepherd's grow fat yet Fathers sheep are dieing of hunger, , this world knows iam here but I will go when Father tells me too , Jerusalem...you who slay the Prophets, how often have I longed to gather you under my wings like a mother hen but you would not have it, the star of David is a representing of the number 666, no joke ,6 triangles 6 shapes 6 sides study it people time is rolling up my people this world is in such danger from the ebmvil men and women.an who control it, they want too cull us by 90% only newclear war has that capability, flash heat blast, in the twinkling of an eye we shall be changed, my heart is broken I want to go Home and be with My Dad, this world of man is disgustingly corrupt and unjust, Thy Kingdom Come Father

 

[JaumeJ]

The Israel of Jesus Yeshua is yet to be established. This will occur when the New Jerusalem is brought down by Elohim.

He is the King of Israel, there no longer is a High Priest to rule over the Eternal Israel but Jesus Yeshua. Think, contemplate and meditate upon this. Otherwise confusion will always encircle.

 

[ServantofMostHigh]

The Israel of Jesus Yeshua is yet to be established. This will occur when the New Jerusalem is brought down by Elohim.

He is the King of Israel, there no longer is a High Priest to rule over the Eternal Israel but Jesus Yeshua. Think, contemplate and meditate upon this. Otherwise confusion will always encircle.

King of kings and Lord of lords

 

[Seeker47]

it's not the healthy that need a doctor The Messiah was given to the israelites because they are the ones who need His help the Most, they are the biggest sinners, they are a stiff necked people who constantly stray from God's Council, they believe in the Law of Moses . .an eye for an eye, the atrocity that was done to them recently was abhorrent yet what that nation is doing in gaza and all their neighbours is far beyond an eye for an eye, 1400 israelites killed yet how many Palestinians have been killed 50,000, Yeshua And Heavenly Father gonna rebuke them severely, Most High gonna let the Land of Israel turn into a radioactive ash pile, the Israeli test have gone into an orgy of violence now we see how black their soul is, eyes are gonna melt in their sockets and tongue will stick to the roofs of their mouths.
the Tenth Commandment is not to covet their neighbour houses etc but Israel is obsessed about grabbing land, the final commandment, they have strayed from My Fathers Commandments, look at the place that's supposed to be a,Holy land. it is blood drenched prison of hatred on all sides shame on all of you, Palestinians and Jews alike
I will tell you the motive for the war in middle east...Temple Mount, the Jews want to kick Muslims off Temple Mount because the Jews think they Can bring down the Messiah to Earth in the 3rd Temple When it's built, The Jews want to do their ritual sacrifices but if they do they are denying Yeshuas sacrifice
The Muslims want too hold on too Temple Mount because they fear the Return of Messiah because He will expose their Hatred, my brothers and sisters do not take this side or that, its evil all within human hearts in that region. Look at what they have done to Yerusalem....Jerusalem is ment to be a city of peace but that is a mockery now, Father gonna rebuke this world for we have all gone astray like lost sheep and the shepherd's grow fat yet Fathers sheep are dieing of hunger, , this world knows iam here but I will go when Father tells me too , Jerusalem...you who slay the Prophets, how often have I longed to gather you under my wings like a mother hen but you would not have it, the star of David is a representing of the number 666, no joke ,6 triangles 6 shapes 6 sides study it people time is rolling up my people this world is in such danger from the ebmvil men and women.an who control it, they want too cull us by 90% only newclear war has that capability, flash heat blast, in the twinkling of an eye we shall be changed, my heart is broken I want to go Home and be with My Dad, this world of man is disgustingly corrupt and unjust, Thy Kingdom Come Father

I disagree with just about everything you have posted here both theologically and biblically. The only reason God chose a particular people; Hebrews, to live forever in a particular land; Israel, is to bring salvation to the gentiles.

 

[Cameron143]

I disagree with just about everything you have posted here both theologically and biblically. The only reason God chose a particular people; Hebrews, to live forever in a particular land; Israel, is to bring salvation to the gentiles.

How would that work since Israel has been absent from the land for long periods of time and largely apostate. While they were indeed a light to the Gentiles in the 1st century as most of the early church was Jewish, God chose them as a people to bring Messiah into the world under the same kind of covenant as Adam originally to accomplish the work of the new covenant.
It was always God's plan for salvation to go to every nation, tribe, kindred, and tongue.

 

[Seeker47]

Two thoughts. First, Israel has always been occupied by God's People. A remnant never left. Second, I can leave my house for a while but it still remains my house. God gave the land of Israel to His people forever.

I don't know how it all will work. My personal belief is that the Israel is are no more apostate than the gentile church, yet YHWH knows what he is doing.