Church buildings

[hornetguy]

And when the fellowship becomes too large for a specific home (around 20 or so)........ it splits.....And a believer who has risen up with the love, desire, knowledge ...and willingness to serve ...takes the lead at another home location. And thus continues the growth and maturity of believers....in concert with the movement of God’s word...

We call those "small groups".... part of a larger, central congregation. We usually meet on Sunday evening... and many times will go out as a group to share a meal somewhere.
The main church group still exists, but this promotes developing closer relationships, which is sometimes lost in a large congregation.
I see nothing wrong with church buildings, as long as the building doesn't become the largest drain on the offering.
We still are tasked with "feeding the hungry".... #1 importance in my understanding.

 

[Edify]

If a church folded because of finances, a home church would be a good idea for them.
That said, it's far better to meet in an old garage or small building because of thieves.
I was in a small church where someone visited it to come back & steal some expensive instruments.
Imagine how easy that would be if it was an upper middle class house.

 

[Dino246]

My experience is quite the opposite. I didn't have nearly the growth until God took me to a house Church.

One thing critics of house churches on this page seem to miss is that all churches are independent groups that need to be vetted, and we always need to be looking for God's lead whether it's to a house Church or other.

As for the complaint that they aren't accountable to anyone, are not all churches accountable to God? If you're accountability is to anyone else you have a problem no matter the location or size of your gathering.

And no, you don't need a designated leader. Holy spirit is perfectly capable of leading, though it can take time for people to unlearn old, unbiblical patterns of a priest/entertainment model that ignores the universality of the Holy Spirit's availability and the need for all parts of the body to be utilized to edify the church (1 Corinthians 12). Frank Viola has written extensively on the history of how we got here in the book Pagan Christianity that is well worth a read, as well as several books on house church, though I have not read the latter myself. I did listen to an interview with him about one of them on the Cold Case Christianity podcast, though, which can be found here (Link will open Spotify app).

You do need spiritual elders, however, to keep things on track. Biblically speaking an elder is just a mature Christian. You also need a biblical shepherd to guard against the wolves, but this is very different from our modern idea of 'pastor.' In my house church at God's directive Jesus is our shepherd, though I would not assume that for every group. I can't say I fully understand the role since Jesus certainly does more than that for our fellowship, but it is something to seek God on rather than defaulting to common definition.

Oh, also of note, God indicated to our fellowship that when starting a house church, it is improper to start it in your own home since this tends to make us think it is our church instead of God's.

As for the concern of someone previewing how they might rob someone's house, that only makes sense if you are assuming it's a drop in church like big churches usually are. House churches tend to be much more personal places where you either know everybody who's coming already, or someone you know well is the person inviting them. Furthermore, why are we leaving God out of the equation? We should not be foolish but faith in God means trusting Him enough not to live in fear, especially when it comes to furthering his Kingdom.

With respect, you missed the point.

Spiritual maturity is not dependent on the place one meets... at all, whether it's a house church, a Roman audience hall, a modern megachurch theatre, or a prison fellowship in a lunchroom. Your experience and mine are both irrelevant to the point.

 

[Ballaurena]

With respect, you missed the point.

Spiritual maturity is not dependent on the place one meets... at all, whether it's a house church, a Roman audience hall, a modern megachurch theatre, or a prison fellowship in a lunchroom. Your experience and mine are both irrelevant to the point.

I now appreciate that I didn't understand the context of what you were saying in pointing out the original poster's lack of logic, and I apologize for my mistake. However, I would say there is a logical argument there to be made.

Although it hasn't come up for a while, God seemed to indicate to my house Church that we were called to it because it was a healthier model of spiritual life that God is guiding others to as well. This is far from an absolute statement, though, as reproducing big church on a smaller scale isn't the point, and there may even be some exceptions on size. Rather God wants to get us back to the model of all members having critical pieces in the fellowship and real community, as opposed to the passive model in bigger churches where only a small portion has input and the others are passive or less involved. The standard bigger model does no favors to any, over-burdening the few and devaluing the contributions of others.

While part of it is even recognizing the much-needed spiritual gifting of things like prophecy and healing, my experience has also proved this out DRAMATICALLY. I learned more and had more personal breakthroughs in just a few years of house church than I did in decades of big church, and on things that big church would have never been able to touch. Therefore I don't find our experiences irrelevant to the point at all. I mean the difference has literally been that big church might give you a card and compassion while the other will cure your deadly disease and restore your wounded heart.

 

[Nehemiah6]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

Of course. And why not? The important thing is to maintain the true Gospel and the truth in every church building. Cathedrals are not necessary, but decent buildings definitely are a place where all can gather without being bothered. And meeting in homes is limited to a handful of people.

 

[GaryA]

With regard to much of the concerns and fears mentioned - the concerns and fears may certainly be very real in the world we live in today - however, I think you may be forgetting/missing something...

In many churches today, there exists the prevailing attitude and practice of "bring 'em to church and let the preacher do all of the work" - but, this is not the way it is suppose to be.

According to what the Bible shows us about the early church beginnings, it was [virtually] everyone in the assembly - not just one or two - that went out to share the gospel - lead folks to Christ - get 'em saved - and then "bring them to church" - not - bring them to church so they can hear the gospel and be saved.

Ideally, there should not be anyone but born-again believers gathered in assembly.

This proper-and-correct way of doing things is the "answer" to all of those concerns and fears - and, it helps to protect the church from "invited" problems - if you know what I mean.

 

[homwardbound]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We DO need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

Your relationship is personal first and foremost above everything else, to me at least.
As Jesus was asked, what is the greatest of Law?
I noticed this, to Love God, his Father first, that is the greatest command of all commands.
And that the Ten Commandments does not have that Law said there in it. Except the first four are the Love, Jesus was talking of. Jesus gave his all to Father for us to see what real love is, over the worldly love we all have naturally at first birth, not in second birth.
Then the second / to love our neighbor as we love ourselves naturally.
Who is our neighbor, anyone and everyone we see as we go out and about in our daily lives.
Then he added to loving our neighbor as we love ourselves. seeing we the people do not always love ourselves do we?
So, he said love others as he has loved you first. How has Son Jesus loved you, is the question at hand to you and all others too.
Has he, on that cross taken away all sin but unbelief to him? John 1:29, John 19:30
If you agree between God and you it is done for you. Then ask God for the new life offered you in God's risen Son for you. Believe, receive and see. God knows who do and who do not yet, and therefore gives and not gives as God sees fit, knowing what is best for each person.
Jeremiah 29:11

 

[wattie]

I hope so!

That's quite an assertion.

I'm not sure what that means, but when you left that church, weren't you 'outing' them?

The JW's, Mormons, Branch Davidians, Jim Jones, etc. all have/had buildings. Jim Jones' large congregation had accountability. When a member dozed off during a service, they physically hit the guy. (This was before they moved to South America and REALLY had accountability).

A small, independent, assembly can be a very godly group that is in agreement (koinonia) with what they teach and lovingly correct those among them who are in error. They're accountable to one another.

Yup that's how independent Baptists are structured.

Following the example of New Testament churches.

 

[Marilyn]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We DO need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

I agree that buildings are not needed. A tree, near a lake would be nice, a car, a bus, a walk in the park etc "Where 2 or 3 are gathered together in My name there I am in the midst.`

The point being that in the 2`s and 3`s there is RELATIONSHIP, there is DISCIPLESHIP.

Paul to Timothy - `And the things you have heard from me among many witnesses, commit these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also. ` (2 Tim. 2: 2)

Jesus said `Go make disciples....` Not go make buildings and Lord it over others.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We DO need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

In certain equatorial regions, I've heard of Christians having church services under a tree until an open air pavilion is built. As the church grows and becomes spiritually giving, better accomodations can be made. House churches are fine if there are only a few and that's your option. There are benefits and drawbacks to everything. When it comes to churches, the shelter provides refuge from weather and privacy from neighbors who do not want to participate.

 

[Nehemiah6]

When it comes to churches, the shelter provides refuge from weather and privacy from neighbors who do not want to participate.

This is so basic it does not even need any discussion.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

This is so basic it does not even need any discussion.

I know it's basic. I'm just answering the OP. Usually there's a question about the catholic church vs independent churches of a locall.
This one is about the meeting structure.

 

[p_rehbein]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We DO need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

Your assumptions are misguided regarding early Christians. Reason they met in homes was because they did not have the monetary funds to build separate Worship Buildings. As well, they were being hunted and persecuted by the Romans. That being said, the largest Church was in Jerusalem.

Now, we can assemble and worship anywhere, and many Congregations do just that on special occasions. Sun Rise Services. Baptism at local river. Camp Meetings, and such. That does not replace Church buildings. Main reason for church buildings is that congregations are made up of people who live in various areas and need a central place to congregate for worship.

Regarding their being more spiritualty mature than people today. The Apostle Paul would disagree with you. Reason he stressed the need for believers in that day to mature beyond the earthly understanding of Scripture and achieve spiritual understanding, and be able to feast on the Word of God. Doing this by receiving the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit and being sanctified by His presence.


There are millions of people who never set foot in a church building. That does not mean they are any more mature in their walk with Christ than those who worship in buildings dedicated to worshiping God. IMO, they are probably less mature given they do not have a congregation to fellowship with, learned Teachers to learn from, and the spiritual and earthly support a Christian Congregations freely gives.

 

[Bruce_Leiter]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We DO need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

In most climates like ours in West Michigan, we do need buildings for both summer and winter!

 

[KohenMatt]

One question is, brethren and sisters... do we really need them?

We do need assemblings, absolutely. But do they have to be in a church building? Can we not assemble anywhere wish to? The earliests Christians generally assembled at their houses. The persecution they endured certainly prevented them from having those buildings, yet spiritually they were more mature than most of us. It is important to go back there.

I see no issue with buildings as long as there is a vision for them. There are many benefits to having a central building where a lot of ministry opportunities happen. There is a central place where pastors, leaders and ministers can be to work together for the Kingdom. It also provides a central and consistent place of worship for the body. Many people, especially the unsaved, may feel intimidated by a smaller group of people. There are some that benefit in hearing the Gospel and witnessing worship without the pressure of being noticed.

I also think that small groups that mean in homes or other facilities are crucial. This is a great place for increased intimacy in fellowship and spurring one another on in smaller groups.

Both can, and should (in my opinion) be part of any church's ministry.

 

[KohenMatt]

I think the jews would build a synagogue once a community got to 12 men- that seems pretty reasonable; since if they all get married and have a kid that's a lot of people for somebody to host at their house. At some point it's just more practical to have a facility that's dedicated to the purpose of assembly.
I wouldn't say it's "important" to not have a building any more than I would say it important for the church to be persecuted. It is possible to put too much emphasis on a building, though.

As a follow- up, Acts 15 talks about the basic commands and instructions new Believers needed so that they could go and hear God's Word.

Acts 15:19-21 19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

I think the early Christians benefitted from going to the Jewish synagogues so that the Word of God (at that point) could be spoken and learned by them. Obviously, they wouldn't take on all of the beliefs and doctrines of the Jewish people, but they were able to hear the Word of God in a structured environment.