Loss of salvation???

[Genez]

Well, I've tasted bore water that tastes like the ocean. I've tasted tap water that tastes like licking a steel plate. I've tasted dam water that tastes like mud.

But, as you can see, if you have no idea of the ocean, metal or dirt, you still will have no idea of what water tastes like. This has been my point all along. Gaining additional knowledge needs a reference point of some sort to begin with otherwise one cannot learn. Line upon line, precept upon precept.

ps. fyi I don't make a habit of licking metal plates.

Solution!

When Adam asked what death is?

The Lord told him..

Eat your fingers. Then eat your arms.
Then your toes... Then your legs.


Don't stop until you know...

....... Simple, eloquent solution!

 

[homwardbound]

OK ...

Fine, that's a separate truth to teach about.

It did not relate directly to the issue that was at hand.

Here! https://christianchat.com/threads/loss-of-salvation.215327/post-5354881


grace and peace ............

Okay, thank you, to me it does,
God does not take away salvation offered us the people, we either believe God or not. There are those that know the truth and choose to not believe, knowingly. never got saved, never fully believed God
Once saved by God, one stays saved by God, and each person knows this truth in themselves not anyone else, because God continues to teach each that believes God and is free from the sin of death "Unbelief"
Believe God, receive from God and be new in God, love and mercy to all, thanks we do not see the same, yet I do believe you do believe too
God all in all knows each person personally. Romans 8:15-16
The issue

 

[homwardbound]

For our sins caused Jesus spiritual death. He bore the penalty for our sins.
The agonizing death for Him to bear was being forsaken by God. Spiritual death.

I do not think Jesus died Spiritually, as you have said in what you have posted, did Jesus die Spiritually, really?
Just asking going over your posts, not accusing, just seeking out what you are trying to say thanks

 

[Genez]

I do not think Jesus died Spiritually, as you have said in what you have posted, did Jesus die Spiritually, really?
Just asking going over your posts, not accusing, just seeking out what you are trying to say thanks

You heard what I said.... Not everyone will understand.

When He screamed out.... "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?"

When He screamed that out?
Our sins were piercing him. It was forcing God to have no part with union with him while becoming sin for us. (spiritual death)

"Him who knew no sin, he made to be sin on our behalf; ​

that we might become the righteousness of God in him." 2 Corinthians 5:21​

Believe it or nor. What you feel was the case? Is not what the Word tells us.

God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that ​

in him, we might become the righteousness of God.​

When He became sin for us? God forsook him! (spiritual death)

It's in your Bible!

Go look it up!
................................ 2 Corinthians 5:21

grace and peace ................

 

[homwardbound]

You heard what I said.... Not everyone will understand.

When He screamed out.... "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?"

When He screamed that out?
Our sins were piercing him. It was forcing God to have no part with union with him while becoming sin for us. (spiritual death)

"Him who knew no sin, he made to be sin on our behalf; ​

that we might become the righteousness of God in him." 2 Corinthians 5:21​

Believe it or nor. What you feel was the case? Is not what the Word tells us.

God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that ​

in him, we might become the righteousness of God.​

When He became sin for us? God forsook him! (spiritual death)

It's in your Bible!

Go look it up!
................................ 2 Corinthians 5:21

grace and peace ................

Okay, thank you, as we all turn up interpretation(s) of scriptures written
God, to this day understands the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I do not, I think Jesus never died spiritually ever. Physically yes. I do believe John 1:29, behold the Lamb of God who takes (took) away the sin of the world for us in his one time willing death for us all, on that cross (John 19:30) for the people to choose to believe this or not, are given presently and forever as reconciled (Forgiven) at that cross of Love and mercy for us, me having the failures in not being able to do Law perfectly ever. (2 Cor. 5:17-20) Now it gets done through us, me at least I am seeing this presently, it is not me or others ever able to do it, only God through us, at least me, that did it, so we can be given new life in Son's risen Life to tell others as God saves us through the cross.
Galatians 3:19-26
"I need God" 2 Cor 12:7-10, Luke 18:9-14, God did what "I" know "I" can't do for me and you and everyone else too.
Is this true for you too?
Thank you

 

[Genez]

Okay, thank you, as we all turn up interpretation(s) of scriptures written
God, to this day understands the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I do not,

Fine. Move on then.

Just the same.
God wants his word to be understood....
Not all at once. But, understood more and more.

It will not be understood by all.


In the first place, I hear that when you come together as a church,
there are divisions among you, and to some extent I believe it.
No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which
of you have God’s approval."

1 Corinthians 11:18-19


grace and peace .........

 

[sawdust]

Solution!

When Adam asked what death is?

The Lord told him..

Eat your fingers. Then eat your arms.
Then your toes... Then your legs.


Don't stop until you know...

....... Simple, eloquent solution!

I'm laughing but also going "yuck" with my stomach twisting in horror at the thought.

Better solution ....

Psalm 3:5
Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;

We don't need to understand where the path leads if we know and trust the one leading.

 

[sawdust]

I do not think Jesus died Spiritually, as you have said in what you have posted, did Jesus die Spiritually, really?
Just asking going over your posts, not accusing, just seeking out what you are trying to say thanks

Jesus experienced what spiritual death is truly like, to be utterly forsaken by God. Even though we are born spiritually dead, we have never been truly forsaken by God. He seeks us from the moment we are born. It was the Lord in the Garden who went looking for Adam after he sinned. If Adam had to bear the full weight of what he did, the Lord should never have sought for him or made sacrifice to cover him. Adam should have been utterly forsaken and left to his own means but he wasn't.

For the three hours Christ had our sins laid on Him, He was utterly cast off from God with no help whatsoever from God to endure the torture.

 

[Genez]

Jesus experienced what spiritual death is truly like, to be utterly forsaken by God. Even though we are born spiritually dead, we have never been truly forsaken by God. He seeks us from the moment we are born. It was the Lord in the Garden who went looking for Adam after he sinned. If Adam had to bear the full weight of what he did, the Lord should never have sought for him or made sacrifice to cover him. Adam should have been utterly forsaken and left to his own means but he wasn't.

For the three hours Christ had our sins laid on Him, He was utterly cast off from God with no help whatsoever from God to endure the torture.

Some wish to remain in a Sunday school state of mind.

We were dull to being spiritually dead because we never knew what it was like to be spiritually alive.

In contrast to us. Jesus was born living the highest order of spiritual life.
So, when cut off when bathed and submerged into mankind's sins?
He first entered into shame and disgust..
Then the contrast became immediate and unbearable.

So, let us go out to Him outside the camp, bearing His contempt ​

[the disgrace and shame that He had to suffer]. Hebrews 13:13​

​

Those who are sheltered Christians have no frame of reference for this.....

 

[posthuman]

Before he ate, Adam had no idea what death is.

But, Satan, listening in, did.

sure he did.

he had see and spoken with his wife.

 

[posthuman]

Jesus experienced what spiritual death is truly like, to be utterly forsaken by God.

Jesus is God. He does not deny Himself.

Psalm 22 is about Israel thinking they are forsaken when they actually are not.

 

[sawdust]

Jesus is God. He does not deny Himself.

Psalm 22 is about Israel thinking they are forsaken when they actually are not.

Psalm 22 is a prophetic utterance of what the Messiah will experience.

 

[posthuman]

Some wish to remain in a Sunday school state of mind.

We were dull to being spiritually dead because we never knew what it was like to be spiritually alive.

In contrast to us. Jesus was born living the highest order of spiritual life.
So, when cut off when bathed and submerged into mankind's sins?
He first entered into shame and disgust..
Then the contrast became immediate and unbearable.

So, let us go out to Him outside the camp, bearing His contempt ​

[the disgrace and shame that He had to suffer]. Hebrews 13:13​

​

Those who are sheltered Christians have no frame of reference for this.....

His humanity is not at the expense of His deity - - i think His situation on the cross is far more complex than it's being described here.

 

[sawdust]

sure he did.

he had see and spoken with his wife.

Is that suppose to be a joke? Was Eve's conversation so boring it was like talking to a dead person?

 

[posthuman]

Psalm 22 is a prophetic utterance of what the Messiah will experience.

Psalm 22 is a song with a name, it's called 'The Hind of the Morning'

Israel is that deer, hunted. She thinks she is forsaken, but she isn't.

Psalms 22:24​

For He has not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; Nor has He hidden His face from Him; But when He cried to Him, He heard.​

 

[sawdust]

His humanity is not at the expense of His deity - - i think His situation on the cross is far more complex than it's being described here.

Of course it is more complex. Christ's humanity is unlike anything we can experience.

Either Christ was truly forsaken on the Cross or He lied or was wrong when He cried out asking why He was forsaken.

 

[posthuman]

Is that suppose to be a joke? Was Eve's conversation so boring it was like talking to a dead person?

her name isn't Eve until later.

Woman ate the fruit during her encounter with Satan. Adam was not there. he could not have been. she ate, and death entered her: the first spiritually dead human, ever.

she went to her husband. she said something to him, and he listened to it, and made the decision to also eat.

Adam was not deceived. scripture is clear.
this means neither Satan nor Woman tricked him - he knew exactly what he was doing.

scripture is also clear that Woman was first in sin. if Adam had been present when she fell, and did nothing, he would have been first in sin.

 

[posthuman]

Of course it is more complex. Christ's humanity is unlike anything we can experience.

Either Christ was truly forsaken on the Cross or He lied or was wrong when He cried out asking why He was forsaken.

or He sang a song of Israel while He hung on the cross taking her place, one that every single Israelite there knew was a lament of the consequences of their unbelief and unfaithfulness and a celebration of the unfailing lovingkindness of their God, Who was right there in full view of them all, totally not forsaking them.

bro it is A LOT more than you think, if you think God forsook Himself.

 

[posthuman]

the visible earthly church has a long history of trying to make us feel sorry for omnipotent God so they can take our money.

 

[sawdust]

Psalm 22 is a song with a name, it's called 'The Hind of the Morning'

Israel is that deer, hunted. She thinks she is forsaken, but she isn't.

Psalms 22:24​

For He has not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; Nor has He hidden His face from Him; But when He cried to Him, He heard.​

Christ was forsaken for three hours while our sin was on Him. He was not utterly forsaken forever. Once our sins were dealt with, He was restored to fellowship because He had no sin of His own.

God the Father was not forsaking His Christ, He was forsaking us in Christ. We, all humanity, were finally receiving the true penalty for our sin and Jesus was the One bearing it.