The deity of Jesus Christ

[wattie]

Not long ago, there were a number of posters on here that were lowering Jesus' deity, below the Father.

I think some were Jewish who thought they had accepted Jesus as the Messiah, but actually made Him somehow a lesser God than the Father.

Anyway, I wanted to address when Jesus says the Father is 'greater than I'

After saying this, later on He ascends to be with the Father. Their position is now equal. And their power, and their omnipresence etc..

So.. what was happening when Jesus said the Father is greater?

He was talking about position, not a superior being.

If I say the King of England is greater than me, he isn't a superior being. We are both equally human. But he had a greater position as king.

 

[EternalFire]

In keeping with your king analogy, do you see Jesus as lowering his position again when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father?

 

[wattie]

In keeping with your king analogy, do you see Jesus as lowering his position again when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father?

Yes, there is sub-ordination in the Trinity. He would be lower in position again. That doesn't make Jesus no longer being fully God, though. The bible doesn't have Jesus ever being 'not God'

 

[Burn1986]

Not long ago, there were a number of posters on here that were lowering Jesus' deity, below the Father.

I think some were Jewish who thought they had accepted Jesus as the Messiah, but actually made Him somehow a lesser God than the Father.

Anyway, I wanted to address when Jesus says the Father is 'greater than I'

After saying this, later on He ascends to be with the Father. Their position is now equal. And their power, and their omnipresence etc..

So.. what was happening when Jesus said the Father is greater?

He was talking about position, not a superior being.

If I say the King of England is greater than me, he isn't a superior being. We are both equally human. But he had a greater position as king.

There are some shallow people on here. Everyone knows the trinity. If those other whacks want to talk about why pigs don’t fly then more power to them. At some point it’s debating Captain Obvious stuff.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Not long ago, there were a number of posters on here that were lowering Jesus' deity, below the Father.

I think some were Jewish who thought they had accepted Jesus as the Messiah, but actually made Him somehow a lesser God than the Father.

Anyway, I wanted to address when Jesus says the Father is 'greater than I'

After saying this, later on He ascends to be with the Father. Their position is now equal. And their power, and their omnipresence etc..

So.. what was happening when Jesus said the Father is greater?

He was talking about position, not a superior being.

If I say the King of England is greater than me, he isn't a superior being. We are both equally human. But he had a greater position as king.

Hebrews 2:7 quotes Psalm 8:5 before expanding on Jesus more.

"Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. 9But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man."

There is the husband and wife analogy given in marriage too. The husband is the leader or head. The wife submits to the husband's will. This is not demeaning, but rather a structure of leadership. Jesus created the universe, so how would a Jew honestly consider Him to be a lesser God?

I can only speculate without talking to one personally to see what the issue is. There sounds like perhaps there's a misunderstanding of a doctrine of the trinity. Here's one of the many key verses on the Trinity in the true scriptures.

7For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

I John 5:7

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

Yes, there is sub-ordination in the Trinity. He would be lower in position again. That doesn't make Jesus no longer being fully God, though. The bible doesn't have Jesus ever being 'not God'

Agree, and we have Great Examples of Humility in the GodHead:

1) The Lord Jesus Christ Humbled Himself To "Be Sent":

"...The Father Hath Sent Me..." ( 17 verses in John )​

2 The Blessed Holy Spirit Doubly Humbled Himself To "Be Sent"

By Both The Father And The SON:​

"But the Comforter, Which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father​

will send in My Name, He shall teach you all things, and bring​

all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. "​

(John 14:26 AV)​

"But when the Comforter is come, Whom I will send unto you​

from the Father, even the Spirit of Truth, Which proceedeth​

from the Father, He shall testify of Me" (John 15:26 AV)​

and:

3) There Are Many [ 160 ] Bible Reasons The LORD Jesus Christ Is God!

Amen.

 

[Dino246]

There are some shallow people on here. Everyone knows the trinity. If those other whacks want to talk about why pigs don’t fly then more power to them. At some point it’s debating Captain Obvious stuff.

While debating the "Captain Obvious" stuff isn't needed, declaring it is, as we never know when an unbeliever is viewing what we read and may learn the gospel through our words.

 

[Burn1986]

While debating the "Captain Obvious" stuff isn't needed, declaring it is, as we never know when an unbeliever is viewing what we read and may learn the gospel through our words.

Thanks dad 😏

 

[Dino246]

Thanks dad 😏

Speaking to myself as much as to you.

 

[Burn1986]

The diety of Jesus?! C’mon
Man!

Can we go back any further to anything beyond basic understanding?

Okay look, why did Jesus stop at a certain well in Samaria to talk to the Samaritan woman? The well he sat upon was named El Elohe Israel (Gen 33:20) which means God, the God of Israel. So when the woman came out, there was God, the God of Israel sitting there ready to meet the woman (John 4:5-)

Jesus also called Himself I Am (John 48:58)

Are y’all satisfied? This is so pointless. Let’s get all worked up over basic basic Christianity 101 and not even be able to pray and get a real change in our or someone else’s life because we’re too fixated on trying to go back and debate basic stuff with stubborn people.

 

[Nehemiah6]

He was talking about position, not a superior being.

I would like to expand on this, although I am in total agreement that Jesus is indeed God, with the Father, and the Holy Spirit, within the Godhead.

1. While Christ was on earth, He was in TOTAL SUBMISSION to God the Father voluntarily. He came as the obedient Servant of the Father.

2. At the same time, from eternity past, there is a "hierarchy" of authority within the Godhead. But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. (1 Cor 11:3) The Father is the "Head" or authority over the Son and the Holy Spirit. Therefore Jesus said that He would ask the Father to send the Holy Spirit after His ascension. But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: (John 15:26)

At the same time Christ would send the Holy Spirit to earth (presumably after asking the Father (although the Father had already planned this before creation). Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

So once again, we are dealing with the mystery of God the Father, and Christ. All of this is beyond Christian comprehension.

Therefore we should not even expect unbelievers to understand any of this. All they need to do is believe that Jesus is God, who died for their sins.

 

[Nehemiah6]

There are some shallow people on here. Everyone knows the trinity. If those other whacks want to talk about why pigs don’t fly then more power to them. At some point it’s debating Captain Obvious stuff.

Who said it is about "debating"? The deity of Christ is a key doctrine of the Bible. So when the "antichrists" reject the deity of Christ on a public forum, it is up to Christians, to proclaim it from Scripture in response.

There have been many who came here to tell Christians that Jesus is less than God. It is even worse on some other Christian forums, where the liars are allowed to continue posting their lies, and are not shut down.

The "Terms of Service" of some Christian forums will not allow attacks on the deity of Christ since there may be "baby" Christians who could be shaken in their faith. Those who reject the deity of Christ can go and find their own forums, where people agree with their false doctrines.

 

[Magenta]

why did Jesus stop at a certain well in Samaria to talk to the Samaritan woman? The well he sat upon
was named El Elohe Israel (Gen 33:20) which means God, the God of Israel. So when the woman came
out, there was God, the God of Israel sitting there ready to meet the woman (John 4:5-)

Jesus also called Himself I Am (John 48:58)

Are y’all satisfied? This is so pointless.

I learned something new! Thank you .

 

[Burn1986]

Who said it is about "debating"? The deity of Christ is a key doctrine of the Bible. So when the "antichrists" reject the deity of Christ on a public forum, it is up to Christians, to proclaim it from Scripture in response.

There have been many who came here to tell Christians that Jesus is less than God. It is even worse on some other Christian forums, where the liars are allowed to continue posting their lies, and are not shut down.

The "Terms of Service" of some Christian forums will not allow attacks on the deity of Christ since there may be "baby" Christians who could be shaken in their faith. Those who reject the deity of Christ can go and find their own forums, where people agree with their false doctrines.

You mad bro

 

[Burn1986]

I learned something new! Thank you .

I probably should’ve deleted my last paragraph but… 😎

 

[wattie]

The diety of Jesus?! C’mon
Man!

Can we go back any further to anything beyond basic understanding?

Okay look, why did Jesus stop at a certain well in Samaria to talk to the Samaritan woman? The well he sat upon was named El Elohe Israel (Gen 33:20) which means God, the God of Israel. So when the woman came out, there was God, the God of Israel sitting there ready to meet the woman (John 4:5-)

Jesus also called Himself I Am (John 48:58)

Are y’all satisfied? This is so pointless. Let’s get all worked up over basic basic Christianity 101 and not even be able to pray and get a real change in our or someone else’s life because we’re too fixated on trying to go back and debate basic stuff with stubborn people.

The thing is, you get people who deny Jesus is fully God on this and other forums. That's why we go back to 101 basics.

I wish forums would actually deny membership to posters who attack the deity of Christ, but this isn't the case.

That is why I come back to this

 

[Nehemiah6]

You mad bro

Why? I just stated the FACTS.

 

[p_rehbein]

The Gospel of John identifies, defines and establishes the Holy Trinty. Other Books also define the Trinity. Folks say because the word Trinity is not mentioned, it is not to be believed.


The Apostle Paul identified the triune man, and, as we were created in Gods Image, the Triune God is Scriptural Truth.

1 Thessalonians 5:
23And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[p_rehbein]

Why discuss questions like this? Because Scripture teaches us to.

1 Peter, Chapter 3:
15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

16Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ.

17For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

 

[p_rehbein]

There are some shallow people on here. Everyone knows the trinity. If those other whacks want to talk about why pigs don’t fly then more power to them. At some point it’s debating Captain Obvious stuff.

You mean like "If I drink a beer will I go to hell?"