Mike Winger's "Why I think Calvinism is Unbiblical"

[maxamir]

It is finished. Jesus satisfied God’s required payment for sin for the whole world and whosoever would believe would have the blood of Jesus applied to them.

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

there are seven uses for the greek word kosmos which is the english word world in Scripture and the word world in the verse you quoted means the scope of the whole world and people without distinction and not every person without exception.

Christ did not die for goats but for His sheep which are made up of people from all nations, tribes , peoples and tongues throughout the whole world and not one nation as the people of Israel had presumed, who had forgotten the promise given to Abraham was to all nations.

If Christ died for every single person without exception then all must be saved and there be no Hell but you falsely presume that Christ did not come to secure salvation for any person and only came to make salvation possible for those who by nature hate God and somehow find it within themselves to choose Him to be saved and therefore rob God of the glory of His salvation and give it to spiritually dead men to falsely boast in themselves.

 

[maxamir]

God does not fail.

you are correct, God does not fail and secured salvation for those He eternally loves and sent Christ to save and not simply make salvation possible for men who by their very nature hate God and would never choose Him unless he first chose them.

 

[NEWTOCHRISTIANITY]

Humble yourself before your Creator and cry out to Him alone to save you by His grace which was so clearly demonstrated in the person and work of Christ Jesus.

@maxamir : Thank you so much for this, brother; I really appreciate your answer.

 

[maxamir]

I will correct what you stated.

The letter to the Romans is an exposition of why Israel failed to achieve righteousness.
While the Gentiles did achieve that righteousness.

Romans 9:30-31
What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, attained righteousness, but the righteousness that is by faith; however, Israel, pursuing a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law.

Romans 10:3
For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.

Romans 11:7
What then? What Israel is seeking, it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained it, and the rest were hardened.

You failed to understand the narration of Paul in Romans.

The question then follows; how did you not understand what the subject of Romans was?

I think I know why and I have noticed this with Calvinists.

If you can not understand that the righteousness that is written of only comes by grace through faith in the blood of Christ then please do not yet call yourself a Christian.

 

[Evmur]

thank you for proving that the source of your judicial blindness is your false and cowardly dispensational eschatology which seeks to evade the suffering promised to the godly through an unbiblical rapture and hopes to see this world blown up in order to try to quicken the coming of Christ into a carnal kingdom where blasphemous sacrifices are to be reinstated, not realising that Christ is reigning right now in His people and has already handed this world over to the loosing of Satan unto its greater judgement and not in a thousand years time as you falsely presume and are deceived into believing and will prove yourself to be a goat unless God grants you the grace to submit to Him alone and the particular grace He has provided through Christ alone and not the choice of sinful men.

You are better than this.

You are a Dispensationalist, we all are since we are not under the law but under grace.

I believe the church and not Israel will go through the Great Tribulation, the Great Tribulation is Antichrist's final attempt to destroy all religion [with the possible exception of Judaism]

It is very difficult to discern the worship of the Millennial reign but Christ and His atoning sacrifice [then recognised by the Jews] will be the centre of it.

Our Lord is Head over all things for the church, He always is King but His Sovereignty is not manifest to all, He has not yet put all things under His feet. He is to be manifest to ALL as King and honoured by all. This is the glory to be revealed.

 

[Evmur]

as I have already explained to you, from God's perspective and His eternal decree as confirmed in Scripture, not all are saved. Therefore the Christian from their perspective within time is to submit to God in all things and seek to reflect the love shown to them in faithfully loving and warning all that there are few who will enter the Kingdom according to God's will rather than deceiving people into thinking that salvation is dependent upon their depraved wills.

People do not fear God today because people such as yourself are either unfaithful in telling people who God is or are too scared to do so.

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Not all will be saved, but the quarrel is about whether this is by God's decree.

That God has decreed death to the sinner and has from the beginning faithfully warned every man is PROOF that sin is not His decree. God has no truc with sin or the father of it.

 

[Evmur]

I have given you the plain truth of Scripture but it seems like you continue to reject the clear teaching of sovereign election and by doing so you reject the work of the Godhead and therefore the Trinity in which God Holy Father chose His people and sent His Holy Son to secure their salvation and the Holy Spirit to seal that salvation to them.

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I BELIEVE in sovereign election unto the church, we are chosen before all worlds were begun to be a people for praise of God's glorious grace. chosen to be conformed to the image of the Beloved, God's Son.

This excludes nobody from being saved.

 

[Evmur]

it was God Himself who humbled me by opening my eyes to His holiness and the offense of my sin against Him which deserved eternal wrath and who showed me Christ who bore my curse and wore my wrath in my stead to pay the price for my forgiveness, guaranteed in His resurrection unto my justification through the faith He had given me by grace alone to receive His perfect righteousness and hope of eternal life.

God subdues the human will, subjucates it to His own. We put our hands up in surrender.

I have never understood why Christians would object to this, He is God, He has the right subjucate our wills to His own. If it were a man then yes we may protest and rebel but it is God.

And He knows us better than we know ourselves and He knows what is best for us better than we do. God's will is perfect.

's no such thing as human freewill.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

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^
This quote cracks me up because it's obvious AW Pink never read the Book of Acts.

26 And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth
27 that they should seek God
28 “‘For we are indeed his offspring.’
29 Being then God's offspring


To say God, who gave man, His Offspring, a chance to seek Him by how He created Adam did not die for ALL of His Offspring at Calvary reveals the level of ignorance that presides within the minds of the mentally challenged.

 

[Cameron143]

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^
This quote cracks me up because it's obvious AW Pink never read the Book of Acts.

26 And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth
27 that they should seek God
28 “‘For we are indeed his offspring.’
29 Being then God's offspring


To say God, who gave man, His Offspring, a chance to seek Him by how He created Adam did not die for ALL of His Offspring at Calvary reveals the level of ignorance that presides within the minds of the mentally challenged.

Man's propensity to go his own way is independent of God's design that aid man to seek for him. That is, the desire of God to assist man to seek after Him is certainly evident in nature and conscience. But the nature of man is corrupted and none actually will until enabled by God.
And your rudeness is noted. What I find more amazing in those who suppose to teach than their arrogance is there apparent lack of perception of the lack of actual fruit of the Spirit in their own lives. Often on would think that others must believe rudeness and pride to be fruit of the Spirit by how often they are employed.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Man's propensity to go his own way is independent of God's design that aid man to seek for him. That is, the desire of God to assist man to seek after Him is certainly evident in nature and conscience. But the nature of man is corrupted and none actually will until enabled by God.
And your rudeness is noted. What I find more amazing in those who suppose to teach than their arrogance is there apparent lack of perception of the lack of actual fruit of the Spirit in their own lives. Often on would think that others must believe rudeness and pride to be fruit of the Spirit by how often they are employed.

It's not really about man and what man has done when it speaks about the purpose and reason for what God did. And what God did was make a way for man to seek Him. And since God made a way for all men to seek Him it would be illogic to think God would not die for all men.

 

[Mem]

Man's propensity to go his own way is independent of God's design that aid man to seek for him. That is, the desire of God to assist man to seek after Him is certainly evident in nature and conscience. But the nature of man is corrupted and none actually will until enabled by God.
And your rudeness is noted. What I find more amazing in those who suppose to teach than their arrogance is there apparent lack of perception of the lack of actual fruit of the Spirit in their own lives. Often on would think that others must believe rudeness and pride to be fruit of the Spirit by how often they are employed.

I know one too many people that can't see their own rudeness in pretending to be nice to me. But on the positive side, my eyes are getting exercised in so frequently rolling them.

 

[Cameron143]

It's not really about man and what man has done when it speaks about the purpose and reason for what God did. And what God did was make a way for man to seek Him. And since God made a way for all men to seek Him it would be illogic to think God would not die for all men.

I readily admit that God endued creation in such a manner as to lead man to seek after Him. I further posit that God endued man with eternity in his heart so by his conscience he may know of the existence of God. But the natural man is not as man was created. If he were, there would be no need to be born from above.
So while God has shown His desires towards man, fallen man does not seek God...Romans 3. What was possible for Adam and Eve before sin is not possible for mankind since the fall. Your failure to acknowledge this is where I believe you err. Even given all that God has done in the natural creation, fallen man needs an act of God in spiritual creation to seek after God.

 

[Cameron143]

I know one too many people that can't see their own rudeness in pretending to be nice to me. But on the positive side, my eyes are getting exercised in so frequently rolling them.

Not exactly sure of your point or even if I'm the one standing accused. But no need to be cryptic. I'm not offended by rebuke, and have no problem apologizing if I have committed an offense.
I know of no cure for stressed eye muscles due to over eye rolling other than rest.

 

[Mem]

Not exactly sure of your point or even if I'm the one standing accused. But no need to be cryptic. I'm not offended by rebuke, and have no problem apologizing if I have committed an offense.
I know of no cure for stressed eye muscles due to over eye rolling other than rest.

It's more of a quirky reflex in want of the rest from observing the manipulated animation from such persons whose characteristics are reminiscent of both puppet and puppeteer. And I would have to know you more personally than the internet allows in order to determine your worth in accusing, notwithstanding my suspicions of course.

 

[Cameron143]

It's more of a quirky reflex in want of the rest from observing the manipulated animation from such persons whose characteristics are reminiscent of both puppet and puppeteer. And I would have to know you more personally than the internet allows in order to determine your worth in accusing, notwithstanding my suspicions of course.

While it wouldn't be advisable to make functional judgments based on a small sampling of a poster's contributions, a larger body of posts reveals quite a bit about an individual.
Perhaps an eye patch worn consecutively from one eye to the other might provide some relief.

 

[Mem]

While it wouldn't be advisable to make functional judgments based on a small sampling of a poster's contributions, a larger body of posts reveals quite a bit about an individual.
Perhaps an eye patch worn consecutively from one eye to the other might provide some relief.

Lol, do you find that works well enough for you?

 

[Cameron143]

Lol, do you find that works well enough for you?

I identify as a pirate since youth so the positive effects of patch wearing has always attended me.

 

[Mem]

I identify as a pirate since youth so the positive effects of patch wearing has always attended me.

Aye can see that, though I lean more toward buccaneer. What does "aar" even mean anyway?

 

[HeIsHere]

I identify as a pirate since youth so the positive effects of patch wearing has always attended me.

Good news, they have prosthetic eyes now, they pop right in, no need to wear a patch.