The Law Is Out Of Date And Will "SOON DISAPPEAR"?

[SabbathBlessing]

:

The law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. and the law is good, if a man use it lawfully, so you are going to have to deal with it whether you like it or not.

I didn't see you explain those things what I did see you doing was accusing the church so you shouldn't do that.

So as I said the law shows sin! but there is a solution for sin and it releases you from the curse of the law but I haven't seen you talk about that, I have seen you trying to pretend the law is extinct while trying to discuss it.

Amen.

There is no condemnation when we are walking in the Spirit. When we are walking in the Spirit He enables us to keep His commandments.

Romans 8:4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

John 14:15-18 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

How do we become spiritually minded which is life and peace? We need to be in harmony with God's will.

Psa 40:8 I delight to do Your will, O my God,
And Your law is within my heart.”

Isa 48:18
Oh, that you had heeded My commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.

It's the only way to be in harmony with God. He doesn't make us do it alone, but it does require our cooperation.

 

[Aaron56]

This puts me in mind of the beginning of creation when God looked and saw that it was good, and the sixth day God looked on all that He had made and, indeed, it was very good. But I note that what is conspicuously missing is God's explicit declaration, "It is finished' although it is written in Genesis 2 that God had finished the work that He had been doing, so on that day rested from all His work, and Hebrews 4:4 tells us that His works have been finished from the foundation of the world.

Genesis 2:3Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because on that day He rested from all the work of creation that He had accomplished.
and at the end of that chapter says,
25And the man and his wife were both naked, and they were not ashamed.

The context there speaks to creation but "it," to me, speak of salvation.

and indeed, Job 26 says,
6Sheol is naked before God,
and Abaddona has no covering. (footnote a:Abaddon means Destruction)

and Hebrews 12 says,
2Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.


When God asked Adam, "who told you that you were naked, have you eaten from the tree that I told you not to eat?" I translate the spirit of this question as saying something like, "why would you listen to what anyone else tells you about the condition that were in, as if you had no covering that I can provide?"

If you think about it, their physical condition of nakedness did not change as much as eating of the tree changed their perspective of it, since they became ashamed.

We are still naked before him, as are all things, but we no longer need be ashamed because He covers us with His own glory.

Right.

Before eating the fruit they identified with their Father, God, who is Spirit. They knew they were spirits clothed in flesh.
After eating, and succumbing to the lusts of the flesh and eyes, they identified with their flesh and "saw", with the eyes of their souls, that they were without covering.

"exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator..."

 

[Aaron56]

I found it interesting they make aprons to cover themselves , yet as soon as they hear Gods word they hide saying I was afraid so I hid because I was naked ....

Yeah.
The first corrupted relationship after the fall was the one between God the Father and His children. Their Father became their enemy: One from whom to hide and dread.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yeah.
The first corrupted relationship after the fall was the one between God the Father and His children. Their Father became their enemy: One from whom to hide and dread.

Yes God the Father and mankind his children

“which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭3:38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We became his enemies but then he suffered and died to Bring us back home

“For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭5:10‬ ‭

 

[Aaron56]

To all who believe the Law of Moses is still in force:

When you're giving the Saving Gospel Plan of Christ to a Gentile, which parts of the Law do you teach that are required for Eternal Life? Is there a list of these Laws? What do you give to these new, potential Believers about the Law of Moses?

What is the Gospel that you share? How is a person saved?

Isn't it interesting, when someone who claims we must obey the covenant given at Sinai and they are able to quote the "greatest commandment" (‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.’”) that they miss that Jesus actually changed these commandments?

With the first one: "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind." Jesus came to give us a new heart. Believers are not called to do their best at loving God. They are given a new heart where God resides:

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh."

Jesus fulfilled this prophesy in Ezekiel.

The second law is even better.
We are no longer called to "‘Love your neighbor as yourself.". The standard was changed. Jesus changed the standard.

Jesus said "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. 35 By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”

So the standard for love is no longer "Love as well as you are able." Jesus changed the standard to "love one another as I have loved you."

The standard for our love is the same standard as God's love.

But check this: When Jesus answered the lawyers about the greatest commandment (it was a lawyer's trap) He said this about the 2 greatest commandments:

"All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."

Not "some" of the Law and the Prophets. Not "most" of the Law and the Prophets. "ALL" of the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

If all of a picture is hanging on the wall by the addition of two nails what happens when you remove the nails? The picture falls.

So, when Jesus introduces two new standards for believers: a new heart and a different level of love, what happens to "All the Law and the Prophets"?

They fall.

They fall for the righteous in Christ but they remain for those not in Christ.

Only "blindness" and "delusion" explain why someone would still try to keep the commandments given at Sinai. Jesus removed the support upon which they hung. Now, in Christ, our commandments are given to us moment by moment by the Spirit of God.

 

[Aaron56]

Yes God the Father and mankind his children

“which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭3:38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We became his enemies but then he suffered and died to Bring us back home

“For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭5:10‬ ‭

Amen!

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Isn't it interesting, when someone who claims we must obey the covenant given at Sinai and they are able to quote the "greatest commandment" (‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.’”) that they miss that Jesus actually changed these commandments?

With the first one: "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind." Jesus came to give us a new heart. Believers are not called to do their best at loving God. They are given a new heart where God resides:

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh."

Jesus fulfilled this prophesy in Ezekiel.

The second law is even better.
We are no longer called to "‘Love your neighbor as yourself.". The standard was changed. Jesus changed the standard.

Jesus said "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. 35 By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”

So the standard for love is no longer "Love as well as you are able." Jesus changed the standard to "love one another as I have loved you."

The standard for our love is the same standard as God's love.

But check this: When Jesus answered the lawyers about the greatest commandment (it was a lawyer's trap) He said this about the 2 greatest commandments:

"All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."

Not "some" of the Law and the Prophets. Not "most" of the Law and the Prophets. "ALL" of the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

If all of a picture is hanging on the wall by the addition of two nails what happens when you remove the nails? The picture falls.

So, when Jesus introduces two new standards for believers: a new heart and a different level of love, what happens to "All the Law and the Prophets"?

They fall.

They fall for the righteous in Christ but they remain for those not in Christ.

Only "blindness" and "delusion" explain why someone would still try to keep the commandments given at Sinai. Jesus removed the support upon which they hung. Now, in Christ, our commandments are given to us moment by moment by the Spirit of God.

“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭21:32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law was fulfilled as the curse it could have been a blessing for Israel if they obeyed or a curse if they broke it they broke it and cursed themselves and the earth they were supposed to rule over

the final curse of the law was the destruction of Jerusalem and scattering of the remnant into all nations carrying their curse


“The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant. Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭24:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[SabbathBlessing]

All of the bible which is the Law and Prophets hangs on Love.

Jesus came not to destroy the law and He so clearly stated.
In fact this is what He has to say about Moses

John 5:46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me.

People can come up with their own conclusions of what spiritual blindness is, but what does Jesus say? Is He not our Righteous Judge? The Creator of everything including His own law that He wrote and spoke. Would He not know what is leading one down the wrong path?

Lets see what He says about it....

Matthew 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’ Where is this found? In the Ten Commandments Exo 20. Jesus condemned those who kept their traditions over the commandments of God quoting directly from the Ten Commandments. Should we follow His teachings or teachings of man? This is what Jesus says when we follow our own teachings...


and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”

Seems like a really bad idea. Jesus tells us where this leads...


10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

So Jesus in this one passage tells us when we choose to obey our rules over the commandments of God this is what happens:

1. We make the commandments of God of no affect- Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments- which reconciles us. So the opposite...Rev 22:15
2. We are only honoring Him with our lips- not our heart, mind and soul
3. Our hearts are far from Him. The opposite of the New Covenant- God's law written in the heart
4. And in vain we worship Him- wow, that's serious. We are told we must worship Him in Truth and Spirit. So worship in vain is keeping our rules over the commandments of God- true worship as we see in Rev 14:12 is keeping God's commandments and the faith of Jesus.
5. Keeping our rules over the commandments of God is the spiritual blind and leads one in a ditch, which is off the narrow path. Much like He taught in Mat 5:19 Mat 7:21-23 Mat 19:17-19,

No wonder Jesus taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments because it affects us being reconciled in Christ Mat 5:19

How does one profess faith in Jesus but not faith in His teaching or the example He left for us.

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

What faith did Jesus have? Did He keep all of the commencements? Are we told that He who abides in Him ought himself to walk just as He walked. Seems like a good idea to me.

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.


Hebrews 10 makes it pretty clear, not all the law of Moses ended.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” [g]says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

All of the bible which is the Law and Prophets hangs on Love.

Jesus came not to destroy the law and He so clearly stated.
In fact this is what He has to say about Moses

John 5:46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me.

People can come up with their own conclusions of what spiritual blindness is, but what does Jesus say? Is He not our Righteous Judge? The Creator of everything including His own law that He wrote and spoke. Would He not know what is leading one down the wrong path?

Lets see what He says about it....

Matthew 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’ Where is this found? In the Ten Commandments Exo 20. Jesus condemned those who kept their traditions over the commandments of God quoting directly from the Ten Commandments. Should we follow His teachings or teachings of man? This is what Jesus says when we follow our own teachings...


and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”

Seems like a really bad idea. Jesus tells us where this leads...


10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

So Jesus in this one passage tells us when we choose to obey our rules over the commandments of God this is what happens:

1. We make the commandments of God of no affect- Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments- which reconciles us. So the opposite...Rev 22:15
2. We are only honoring Him with our lips- not our heart, mind and soul
3. Our hearts are far from Him. The opposite of the New Covenant- God's law written in the heart
4. And in vain we worship Him- wow, that's serious. We are told we must worship Him in Truth and Spirit. So worship in vain is keeping our rules over the commandments of God- true worship as we see in Rev 14:12 is keeping God's commandments and the faith of Jesus.

No wonder Jesus taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments because it affects us being reconciled in Christ Mat 5:19

How does one profess faith in Jesus but not faith in His teaching or the example He left for us.

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

What faith did Jesus have? Did He keep all of the commencements? Are we told that He who abides in Him ought himself to walk just as He walked. Seems like a good idea to me.

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.


Hebrews 10 makes it pretty clear, not all the law of Moses ended.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” [g]says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

“The law and the prophets were until John:

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till ( until ) the seed should come to whom the promise was made;

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one,

but God is one.( nt father son holy ghost are one ) God -an angel- Moses -the children of Israel arent of one )

But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20, 23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭18:17-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:45-47‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. ( Moses is saying this not of himself but of a future prophet God would raise up later to speak his own words that are required of mankind )

Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days. Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭3:22-24, 26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The law and prophets were always pointing to the coming of the lord who would open his mouth and speak his living word it was added because of mankind’s sin , in Christ our sins are remitted . It was ordained of angels and given into Moses hand , the gospel is ordained of the son of God and he himself is the mediator and sacrifice. It was to lead us to the reality of Christ now we can just go to the reality of the gospel where God is speaking to all his creatures

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

could preach Moses law to everyone but it does this to them if they believe and are disciples of Jesus

“forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[SabbathBlessing]

“The law and the prophets were until John:

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.

But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20, 23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭18:17-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:45-47‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. ( Moses is saying this not of himself but of a future prophet God would raise up later to speak his own words that are required of mankind )

Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days. Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭3:22-24, 26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The law and prophets were always pointing to the coming of the lord who would open his mouth and speak his living word it was added because of mankind’s sin , in Christ our sins are remitted . It was ordained of angels and given into Moses hand , the gospel is ordained of the son of God and he himself is the mediator and sacrifice. It was to lead us to the reality of Christ now we can just go to the reality of the gospel where God is speaking to all his creatures

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

could preach Moses law to everyone but it does this to them if they believe and are disciples of Jesus

“forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Do you know what this means?
“For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I see you quote it, but can you explain what it means? You seem to be making it as if its an argument against Christ's own teachings such as John 14:15 Mat 15:3-14 Mat 19:17-19, Mat 5:18-30 Mat 7:21-23 and some of the last scriptures before the Revelation of Jesus Christ Rev 14:12 Rev 22:14-14

Did you know circumcision is not part of the Ten Commandments. It's why Paul contrasts it 1 Cor 7:19. If we understand the different laws, it really makes understanding the scriptures better. Many people see the word "law" and apply it to the laws they don't want to keep instead of allowing the scripture to reveal the context. Something that is holy, blessed and righteous will never become distinct or contrary or against.,

Also, at some point, we have to make some foundational teachings. The way I reconcile the bible is everything has to reconcile with Christ, not the other way around. The apostles were servants of Christ, they were not in the place of Christ. All authority in heaven and earth is with Jesus Mat 28:20 so if there is any scripture that contradicts the very teachings of Jesus, it means we do not understand it. It's the reason why Paul has this warning 2 Peter 3:16 because He never undermined the authority of God.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Do you know what this means?
“For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I see you quote it, but can you explain what it means? You seem to be making it as if its an argument against Christ's own teachings such as John 14:15 Mat 15:3-14 Mat 19:17-19, Mat 5:18-30 Mat 7:21-23 and some of the last scriptures before the Revelation of Jesus Christ Rev 14:12 Rev 22:14-14

Of course yeah prophecy is something God said would happen later , fulfillment is when it comes to pass the law and prophets foretold the gospel would come later and the messiah would be the one to fulfill all of those prophecies about him in the law and prophets the beginning of the gospel is when those things began to be fulfilled

“Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come prophetic word ) that Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭26:22-23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Nothing could change until Jesus fulfilled the prophecies about the coming of the messiah tonisrsel and he preached the gospel then suffered and died to remit sin

“For the priesthood being changed,

there is made of necessity a change also of the law.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭7:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.

But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭8:1-2, 6-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Of course yeah prophecy is something God said would happen later , fulfillment is when it comes to pass the law and prophets foretold the gospel would come later and the messiah would be the one to fulfill all of those prophecies about him in the law and prophets the beginning of the gospel is when those things began to be fulfilled

“Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come prophetic word ) that Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭26:22-23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Nothing could change until Jesus fulfilled the prophecies about the coming of the messiah tonisrsel and he preached the gospel then suffered and died to remit sin

“For the priesthood being changed,

there is made of necessity a change also of the law.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭7:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.

But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭8:1-2, 6-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You still didn't explain it but that's okay.

Regarding Heb 7:12 what law is being referred to? Not the Ten Commandments- Jesus said heaven and earth would pass before one jot or tittle could be changed. Heaven and earth are still here and why we are told not to break the least of these as it affects our status in heaven. Judgement has not happened. All the prophecies have to come to fruition for ALL to be fulfilled. Jesus never said "some prophecies"

So obviously Heb 7:12 is not about the Ten Commandments, but the law that is in the context of that whole chapter...not one mention of the Ten Commandments


Hebrews 7:11 Therefore, if perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron? 12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has [b]officiated at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning [c]priesthood. 15 And it is yet far more evident if, in the likeness of Melchizedek, there arises another priest 16 who has come, not according to the law of a fleshly commandment, but according to the power of an endless life. 17 For [d]He testifies:

“You are a priest forever
According to the order of Melchizedek.”
18 For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness, 19 for the law made nothing [e]perfect; on the other hand, there is the bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

Greatness of the New Priest
20 And inasmuch as He was not made priest without an oath 21 (for they have become priests without an oath, but He with an oath by Him who said to Him:

“The Lord has sworn
And will not relent,
‘You are a priest [f]forever
According to the order of Melchizedek’ ”),
22 by so much more Jesus has become a [g]surety of a better covenant.

23 Also there were many priests, because they were prevented by death from continuing. 24 But He, because He continues forever, has an unchangeable priesthood. 25 Therefore He is also able to save [h]to the uttermost those who come to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest was fitting for us, who is holy, [i]harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and has become higher than the heavens; 27 who does not need daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifices, first for His own sins and then for the people’s, for this He did once for all when He offered up Himself. 28 For the law appoints as high priests men who have weakness, but the word of the oath, which came after the law, appoints the Son who has been perfected forever.

So if we allow the context to define Itself, we will be allowing God to direct our paths....Pro 3:5-6

The law of the priesthood had to change because Jesus came from the tribe of Judea, not through the tribe of Levites and in the law the priest had to come from Levi, which is why there was a change in the law, the priesthood, since Jesus is now our High Priest in the New Covenant. Hebrews 4:14

 

[Mem]

All of the bible which is the Law and Prophets hangs on Love.

I suppose this is the reason that if you break one law you break them all. If you fail to love your neighbor as yourself, then everything that hangs on that falls also and is broken. Everything depends on your love, and if you so much as fib to your neighbor, your love is too weak to hold up even one of the laws let alone all of them.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

I suppose this is the reason that if you break one law you break them all. If you fail to love your neighbor as yourself, then everything that hangs on that falls also and is broken. Everything depends on your love, and if you so much as fib to your neighbor, your love is too weak to hold up even one of the laws let alone all of them.

You're right it is, that's why we need Christ. What we can't do on our own is possible through Him Phil 4:13 and God has a people who can overcome Rev 14:12

 

[Pilgrimshope]

You still didn't explain it but that's okay.

Regarding Heb 7:12 what law is being referred to? Not the Ten Commandments- Jesus said heaven and earth would pass before one jot or tittle could be changed. Heaven and earth are still here and why we are told not to break the least of these as it affects our status in heaven. Judgement has not happened. All the prophecies have to come to fruition for ALL to be fulfilled. Jesus never said "some prophecies"

So obviously Heb 7:12 is not about the Ten Commandments, but the law that is in the context of that whole chapter...not one mention of the Ten Commandments


Hebrews 7:11 Therefore, if perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron? 12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has [b]officiated at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning [c]priesthood. 15 And it is yet far more evident if, in the likeness of Melchizedek, there arises another priest 16 who has come, not according to the law of a fleshly commandment, but according to the power of an endless life. 17 For [d]He testifies:

“You are a priest forever
According to the order of Melchizedek.”
18 For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness, 19 for the law made nothing [e]perfect; on the other hand, there is the bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

Greatness of the New Priest
20 And inasmuch as He was not made priest without an oath 21 (for they have become priests without an oath, but He with an oath by Him who said to Him:

“The Lord has sworn
And will not relent,
‘You are a priest [f]forever
According to the order of Melchizedek’ ”),
22 by so much more Jesus has become a [g]surety of a better covenant.

23 Also there were many priests, because they were prevented by death from continuing. 24 But He, because He continues forever, has an unchangeable priesthood. 25 Therefore He is also able to save [h]to the uttermost those who come to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest was fitting for us, who is holy, [i]harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and has become higher than the heavens; 27 who does not need daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifices, first for His own sins and then for the people’s, for this He did once for all when He offered up Himself. 28 For the law appoints as high priests men who have weakness, but the word of the oath, which came after the law, appoints the Son who has been perfected forever.

So if we allow the context to define Itself, we will be allowing God to direct our paths....Pro 3:5-6

The law of the priesthood had to change because Jesus came from the tribe of Judea, not through the tribe of Levites and in the law the priest had to come from Levi, which is why there was a change in the law, the priesthood, since Jesus is now our High Priest in the New Covenant. Hebrews 4:14

I try not to explain much but let the word say what it says that’s sort of my foundational belief that when we start trying to outthink what it says we get off track let the scripture form the narrative that’s how faith works but again it’s hard to find faith in the law of Moses for sinners who won’t repent

Can’t find faith here

“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

gotta look here to find faith after the law

“But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

In other words

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬

“The law and the prophets were until John: ( that testament )

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, ( led everyone here ) and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[SabbathBlessing]

I try not to explain much but let the word say what it says that’s sort of my foundational belief that when we start trying to outthink what it says we get off track let the scripture form the narrative that’s how faith works but again it’s hard to find faith in the law of Moses for sinners who won’t repent

Can’t find faith here

“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

gotta look here to find faith after the law

“But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

In other words

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬

“The law and the prophets were until John: ( that testament )

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, ( led everyone here ) and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Does someone with faith believe the teachings of Jesus and do them, or just hear them and not do them James 1:22 Rev 22:14 Isa 56:1-6

Jesus in His own Words tells us to live (do) His every Word. Mat 4:4

My understanding is faith is active and not passive, which leads us to establish the law Rom 3:31 and according to scripture His saints (saved) keep both the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. Its not just faith in Jesus but we need the faith of Jesus.

What faith did Jesus have? Was He a hearer only, or did He also do His Fathers will and keep all of the commandments John 15:10 and is our example to follow 1 John 2:6

 

[Mem]

You're right it is, that's why we need Christ. What we can't do on our own is possible through Him Phil 4:13 and God has a people who can overcome Rev 14:12

You can try to enter into your rest every seventh day to overcome the world, but I have already entered into His rest because He has already overcome the world.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

You can try to enter into your rest every seventh day to overcome the world, but I have already entered into His rest because He has already overcome the world.

No one enters His rest by being in rebellion to His commandments. In His rest there is no rebellion to Him or His commandments, just peace Isa 48:18.

Many of the Israelites never entered their rest into Canaan because they also rebelled against the Sabbath commandment Eze 20:21 Eze 20:13 something we are warned not to follow after their same path of disobedience Heb 4:6 Heb 4:11

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Does someone with faith believe the teachings of Jesus and do them, or just hear them and not do them James 1:22 Rev 22:14 Isa 56:1-6

Jesus in His own Words tells us to live (do) His every Word. Mat 4:4

Look back at my last post real quick . Do you see how you have addressed absolutely nothing that is plainly in those scriptures ????

thats my only value in this forum each of us has something to contribute , for some reason not known to me Godbhas given me a tiny bit of ability to notice things in his word .

I’m not a teacher or great explainer of things that aren’t there my value is very limited . I’m saying this not because I think I’m something special or anything but others here have gifts also that are more on line with what your wanting to explain things to you I don’t have that part I’m just a sheep hoping the lord sees fit to save my scrawny pitiful soul from death ….so I’ve decided to look at the saviors word and ( just my opinion ) that’s where God speaks to believers in him

It’s just a thought not me coming against you . My only intention was to share those verses with you in hopes you might read them and consoder what it is they are actually saying

i don’t now or will o mean to offend you or argue for the sake of arguing I think those scriptures I shared have a lot of value for someone who considers what they say

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Look back at my last post real quick . Do you see how you have addressed absolutely nothing that is plainly in those scriptures ????

thats my only value in this forum each of us has something to contribute , for some reason not known to me Godbhas given me a tiny bit of ability to notice things in his word .

I’m not a teacher or great explainer of things that aren’t there my value is very limited . I’m saying this not because I think I’m something special or anything but others here have gifts also that are more on line with what your wanting to explain things to you I don’t have that part I’m just a sheep hoping the lord sees fit to save my scrawny pitiful soul from death ….so I’ve decided to look at the saviors word and ( just my opinion ) that’s where God speaks to believers in him

It’s just a thought not me coming against you . My only intention was to share those verses with you in hopes you might read them and consoder what it is they are actually saying

i don’t now or will o mean to offend you or argue for the sake of arguing I think those scriptures I shared have a lot of value for someone who considers what they say

I did address them. I was asking if you think having faith in Christ would that mean we would do what He asks and follow His example or not. It's a simple question. You seem to be indicating that having faith in Christ means not following His teachings such as John 14:15 Mark 7:7-13 Mat 15:3-14, Mat 19:17-19 Mat 5:19-30

The law leads us to Christ Gal 3:24 once faith comes- Christ leads us to obey the law John 14:15. Why faith establishes the law Rom 3:31 You seem to be indicating the opposite so I asked you to clarify.