Can the nonelect ever be born-again? (2 Kings 22:27) With the elect thou wilt be elect: and with the perverse thou wilt be perverted.

[MikeIsraelite72]

Disagree. God divorced the earthly nation of Israel because of their spiritual fornication. Once divorced, earthly Israel's relationship
with Him, to include the earthly Jews (just because they are earthly Jews), ended.

[Jer 3:7-8 KJV]
7 And I said after she had done all these [things], Turn thou unto me. But she returned not. And her treacherous sister Judah saw [it].
8 And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.

[Col 3:10-12 KJV]
10 And have put on the new [man], which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.
12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

[Gal 6:14-16 KJV]
14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace [be] on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

[Rev 21:1-3 KJV]
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.

you are correct citing the bill of divorcement which affirms israels failure in keeping the covenant but by the grace of God there was hope that was spoken by Hosea and affirmed by paul that Israel would be reconciled back to YHWH through the blood of jesus christ and being resurrected he is the firstborn of many brethren and it is this hope which we hold fast to today.

HOSEA 1:10,11
“And the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.
11Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

this is the hope that the 12 tribes scattered and in Judea hoped for over 600 years and it came to pass on the cross and out of the empty tomb through the precious blood of the prophecied savior, the one who should gather them back together and be the one head over them.
Paul affirms this fulfillment and i can’t imagine the goosebumps that the repentant Israelites felt because even now i’m getting goosebumps at how awesome and sovereign our Gods will is. it’s beautiful 🙏❤️

here is the affirmation made by Paul and he makes the distinction between Jacob and Esau, the purpose of their destiny as declared by God himself and still today Esau is at war with us, the true sons of God of whom are heirs of the promise by Gods election

ROMANS 9:22-26
“What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 23And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 24Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Judeans only, but also of the Nations?
25As he saith also in HOSEA, “I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
26And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.”

I love searching the prophets and reading the new testament words of jesus and the apostles where over and over again they reiterate what was spoken by God through his holy prophets. I really appreciate your response and the scripture you cited because i need edification and i need brethren who are excited and love the loving God and his word. Peace new upon you brother, praise YHWH

 

[rogerg]

you are correct citing the bill of divorcement which affirms israels failure in keeping the covenant but by the grace of God there was hope that was spoken by Hosea and affirmed by paul that Israel would be reconciled back to YHWH through the blood of jesus christ and being resurrected he is the firstborn of many brethren and it is this hope which we hold fast to today.

Not possible. That would be God violating His own law. Once divorced a wife cannot be taken back again.

[Deu 24:4 KJV] 4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that [is] abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee [for] an inheritance.

HOSEA 1:10,11
“And the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.
11Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

New Israel, different Jews: the elect.

[Hos 1:9 KJV]
9 Then said [God], Call his name Loammi: for ye [are] not my people, and I will not be your [God].

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

this is the hope that the 12 tribes scattered and in Judea hoped for over 600 years and it came to pass on the cross and out of the empty tomb through the precious blood of the prophecied savior, the one who should gather them back together and be the one head over them.
Paul affirms this fulfillment and i can’t imagine the goosebumps that the repentant Israelites felt because even now i’m getting goosebumps at how awesome and sovereign our Gods will is. it’s beautiful 🙏❤️

Those are the elect. See the verses I included in my prior post to you.

ROMANS 9:22-26
“What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 23And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 24Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Judeans only, but also of the Nations?
25As he saith also in HOSEA, “I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
26And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.”

Paul is speaking of the elect - those God had chosen from "all nations, kindreds, and peoples, and tongues",
not only Jews. They were elected individually by God, but not because of any familial association nor bloodline.

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Not possible. That would be God violating His own law. Once divorced a wife cannot be taken back again.

[Deu 24:4 KJV] 4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that [is] abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee [for] an inheritance.



New Israel, different Jews: the elect.

[Hos 1:9 KJV]
9 Then said [God], Call his name Loammi: for ye [are] not my people, and I will not be your [God].

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;



Those are the elect. See the verses I included in my prior post to you.



Paul is speaking of the elect - those God had chosen from "all nations, kindreds, and peoples, and tongues",
not only Jews. They were elected individually by God, but not because of any familial association nor bloodline.

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

I don't expect a reply but never mind

If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her

 

[Dino246]

I don't expect a reply but never mind

If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her

That’s an ordinance under the Sinai covenant, but has no bearing on Christians.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

That’s an ordinance under the Sinai covenant, but has no bearing on Christians.

Do you believe every name is in the book if life to begin with

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

I don't expect a reply but never mind

If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her

According to scripture

This is in Deuteronomy 25.5


don't expect a reply but never mind

If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

According to scripture all life is in the book of life to begin with

So according to scripture the book of life is in heaven

So according to scripture all life is heavenly life.

It's called the living stone 🙂 and it's called life.

Is this Jewish lady singing to two different lords in Isreal.

One being a person who has called himself lord as in an Israel man, as I heard they call kings or slave masters lord there.

 

[MikeIsraelite72]

Not possible. That would be God violating His own law. Once divorced a wife cannot be taken back again.

[Deu 24:4 KJV] 4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that [is] abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee [for] an inheritance.



New Israel, different Jews: the elect.

[Hos 1:9 KJV]
9 Then said [God], Call his name Loammi: for ye [are] not my people, and I will not be your [God].

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;



Those are the elect. See the verses I included in my prior post to you.



Paul is speaking of the elect - those God had chosen from "all nations, kindreds, and peoples, and tongues",
not only Jews. They were elected individually by God, but not because of any familial association nor bloodline.

[Rev 7:9 KJV]
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

i’m trying to figure out what you mean when you say a “new israel” because the first thing that comes to my mind is that you’re insinuating that God pulled an end around on Abraham when he made the promises to him. Anrahsm offered Isaac on that alter in faith that his seed, sperm from his loins would become many nations and God promised this even when he divorced them that he would keep them and sow them in many places which he did over the course of 600 plus years. The greco roman empire was built with the Israelites scattered to the north and the west of palestine. This is where Paul took the gospel and i used James 1 in my earlier post to demonstrate that he was writing to those scattered tribes only.

you are correct citing dueteronomy in reference to the divorced wife and the law against taking her as a wife again however Jesus Christ, the husband, gave his life for them and by doing this he did not break his own law…. consider what Paul mentions in his epistle to the romans

ROMANS 7:1-3
“Or do you not know, brothers—for I am speaking to those who know the law—that the law is binding on a person only as long as he lives? 2For a married woman is bound by law to her husband while he lives, but if her husband dies she is released from the law of marriage.b 3Accordingly, she will be called an adulteress if she lives with another man while her husband is alive. But if her husband dies, she is free from that law, and if she marries another man she is not an adulteress.”

God did not break his own law in death he freed adulterous Israel and after they are regathered from all the nations in which they are scattered our king Jesus Christ in his glory will return destroying Edom forever and set up the kingdom that will be established forever. He will again take Israel as His bride and in this we have to accept that Jesus is righteous and keeps his own laws but his righteousness exceeds outside of the law.

i really encourage you to take time and study history, i have notes that i’m going to share with you in hopes that it will edify, the seed of Jacob that the 12 tribes sprang from has always been a people and still is, i can’t imagine our faith in God and his word devoid of those promises and that people.

in reference to what you cited in Revelation
The phrase “all nations” here could only be a reference to all of the nations of the Adamic οἰκουμένη – that part of the world over which Rome has ruled and which will suffer this tribulation. While the hundred and forty-four thousand are certainly all of Israel, this innumerable multitude must also all be of the children of Israel, as only Israel had ever had these promises of salvation. The phrase “all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues” must concur with the promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that their seed would become innumerable and from it would come many nations which would then inherit the world.

ROMANS 4:16-22
“16 Therefore from of the faith, that in accordance with favor, then the promise is to be certain to all of the offspring, not to that of the law only, but also to that of the faith of Abraham [the faith of Abraham being what Abraham had believed], who is father of us all; 17 (just as it is written, ‘That a father of many nations I have made you,’) before Yahweh whom he trusted, who raises the dead to life, and calls things not existing as existing; 18 who contrary to expectation, in expectation believed, for which he would become a father of many nations according to the declaration, 'Thus your offspring will be:' 19 and he not being weak in the faith, nor having considered his own body by this time being dead, being about a hundred years old, and the deadness of the womb of Sarah, 20 but at the promise of Yahweh he did not doubt in disbelief, rather he was strengthened in faith, giving honor to Yahweh, 21 and having full satisfaction that what He has promised, He is also capable of doing; 22 for that reason also 'it was accounted to him for righteousness.'”

countless christians consider themselves approved because they have faith like abraham, however, mostly all of them don’t believe what abraham believed and stand in disagreement contending that “seed doesn’t mean offspring “ or “spiritual israel” or even what you said in your post “new israel” if you can’t identify the children of israel yesterday or today then your saying that God has failed which is a lie. i look forward to continuing our discussion🙏🙏🙏 praise YHWH

 

[MikeIsraelite72]

I don't expect a reply but never mind

If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her

you beat me to it 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

 

[Dino246]

Do you believe every name is in the book if life to begin with

Perhaps if you explain how your question is relevant to my comment, it would help.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Perhaps if you explain how your question is relevant to my comment, it would help.

Well according to scripture this is also in the book of Deuteronomy

Love the lord with all your heart
And love your neighbour

 

[rogerg]

i’m trying to figure out what you mean when you say a “new israel” because the first thing that comes to my mind is that you’re insinuating that God pulled an end around on Abraham when he made the promises to him. Anrahsm offered Isaac on that alter in faith that his seed, sperm from his loins would become many nations and God promised this even when he divorced them that he would keep them and sow them in many places which he did over the course of 600 plus years. The greco roman empire was built with the Israelites scattered to the north and the west of palestine. This is where Paul took the gospel and i used James 1 in my earlier post to demonstrate that he was writing to those scattered tribes only.

Probably new Israel wasn't the best term to use but I was trying to differentiate between it and earthly Israel. I probably should
have used true Israel or Israel of God instead.
Kind of hate to say this but I think we are just too far apart in our fundamental beliefs/perceptions/understanding of the gospel
to be able to reconcile those differences. I think we would just end up going around in circles over a long period of time, and in the end, neither of us would change our POV anyway, so it doesn't seem worth our time or effort beating our heads against the wall. In ending, I would just suggest that you read the verses I posted because I think they should tie everything together and answer most of your questions. If they do and should you feel like continuing, let me know and we can begin from there.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

you beat me to it 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

That's ok may I ask you if the same verse you where going to quote is the same book as love the lord God with all your heart.

Shouldn't that verse you where going to quote that I beat you to it be believed 🙂

PST The best way to find out where you stand with someone

Is Just ask them, do you believe every life is in the book of life.

See if you get an answer

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Probably new Israel wasn't the best term to use but I was trying to differentiate between it and earthly Israel. I probably should
have used true Israel or Israel of God instead.
Kind of hate to say this but I think we are just too far apart in our fundamental beliefs/perceptions/understanding of the gospel
to be able to reconcile those differences. I think we would just end up going around in circles over a long period of time, and in the end, neither of us would change our POV anyway, so it doesn't seem worth our time or effort beating our heads against the wall. In ending, I would just suggest that you read the verses I posted because I think they should tie everything together and answer most of your questions. If they do and should you feel like continuing, let me know and we can begin from there.

Have you ever planted a seed and watch it grow 🙂

I know of a good soil mix do you 🙂

 

[Dino246]

Well according to scripture this is also in the book of Deuteronomy

Love the lord with all your heart
And love your neighbour

Again... relevance?

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Again... relevance?

relevance is a nice word

And so is the word answer 🙂

Do you believe all life is in the book of life to begin with

 

[Dino246]

relevance is a nice word

And so is the word answer 🙂

Do you believe all life is in the book of life to begin with

Why do you keep asking me the same question?

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Why do you keep asking me the same question?

why won't you give an answer

 

[maxamir]

Where does revalation 2:2 say Judge false Christians ?

What does righteous judgement mean, should it not mean with his judgement,

As in you seek his wisdom first

Or does it mean posting a revalation verse 2;2 that doesn't exist in this picture

I take it your judgement was not sound here ?.

it would help if you actually read the Scriptures so you can learn righteous judgement.

Rev 2:2 "I know your works, your labor, your patience, and that you cannot bear those who are evil. And you have tested those who say they are apostles and are not, and have found them liars;

 

[maxamir]

yes I think where you probably go wrong is not understanding that unless it's God who's Judging you don't have the authority
.

1Co 6:2 Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world will be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Co 6:3 Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?