Predestination is misunderstood...
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Yes, I agree the gift of eternal life is spiritual salvation which is 100% a done deal and cannot be undone.
I do know that eternal life or “aeonian life" does also mean quality of life, but I think both are true and one does not negate the other.
And yes agree on saved, that is why in Matthew 24:13 we read ...But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.
This means physically saved in context of the wider passage.
I am not able to stay on top of this thread, I would need to go back and carefully read the discussion between you and Paul to really comment further. There are things he says I agree with also.
I do know that eternal life or “aeonian life" does also mean quality of life, but I think both are true and one does not negate the other.
And yes agree on saved, that is why in Matthew 24:13 we read ...But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.
This means physically saved in context of the wider passage.
I am not able to stay on top of this thread, I would need to go back and carefully read the discussion between you and Paul to really comment further. There are things he says I agree with also.
But before he fell? He could know the Lord in a state that only a regenerate person can know.
I believe that was the point being made....
Angels come from a unique perspective concerning God.
Adam before he fell was able to know God in a manner that no unregenerate person can know...
Satan before he fell had a perceptive capacity for God that was quite strong....
That discipline is called "isagogics."
My pastor was always studying Scripture and ancient writings. The ancient writings, in part, to gain a grasp for idiomatic expressions, that when we interpret literally? Could cause much confusion if not understood. Earlier today I heard him teach how Paul used a term found in the Greek that we have no English equivalent for and he needed to explain, what in the Greek might require one word, but to make clear in the English, would need several sentences to try to convey what was written to our thinking.
My pastor was always studying Scripture and ancient writings. The ancient writings, in part, to gain a grasp for idiomatic expressions, that when we interpret literally? Could cause much confusion if not understood. Earlier today I heard him teach how Paul used a term found in the Greek that we have no English equivalent for and he needed to explain, what in the Greek might require one word, but to make clear in the English, would need several sentences to try to convey what was written to our thinking.
Very interesting!
Exactly, in my first language so many things get lost in the translation to English, it is very difficult to convey that nuance. I feel like it is different than an acquired language because as much as you study and learn the language the nuance is really only understood within that culture, just my sense of it.
I will need to look up "isagogics"
Exactly, in my first language so many things get lost in the translation to English, it is very difficult to convey that nuance. I feel like it is different than an acquired language because as much as you study and learn the language the nuance is really only understood within that culture, just my sense of it.
I will need to look up "isagogics"
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If you do not believe in the Fall and that every man is born spiritually dead and enslaved to sin then you do not really need a Saviour and His resurrection and do not believe Scripture which makes this truth very plain.
Eph 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,
Eph 2:5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
Mat 8:22 But Jesus said to him, "Follow Me, and let the dead bury their own dead."
Luk 15:32 It was right that we should make merry and be glad, for your brother was dead and is alive again, and was lost and is found.' "
Eph 5:14 Therefore He says: "Awake, you who sleep, Arise from the dead, And Christ will give you light."
Eph 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,
Eph 2:5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
Mat 8:22 But Jesus said to him, "Follow Me, and let the dead bury their own dead."
Luk 15:32 It was right that we should make merry and be glad, for your brother was dead and is alive again, and was lost and is found.' "
Eph 5:14 Therefore He says: "Awake, you who sleep, Arise from the dead, And Christ will give you light."
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Keep reading and you will learn that none can come to Him unless God draws him and it has been granted to him do so.
Joh 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
Joh 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
