Women Pastors

[LeeLoving]

I agree. However, if Paul is saying that because there was prevalent teaching among the pagans that Eve was formed first and was not deceived, and he is refuting that claim rather than explaining why "women can't teach", then it is a context-specific statement.

Consider how many women would have attended synagogue and learned Torah... somewhere between very few and zero. Indeed, one of the rabbis actually wrote, "Rather let Torah be burned than taught to a woman". Paul is shattering that norm by saying, in essence, "Let the women learn Scripture!" He adds, "in silence" which is also appropriate for the male students. The gist of the whole passage changes entirely.

Instead of saying, "If you have two X chromosomes, you have inherited Eve's propensity for gullibility and are therefore restricted forever from vocalizing in the Christian assembly", Paul is saying, "Also let the women learn like the men do, but let those who were teachers of pagan falsehood be restricted from teaching in the Church until they have learned Christian truth".

I think women can take part in church just as men can, sharing the gospel and talking about things as they like, just as a man could, but unless I'm mistaken somehow Paul is saying that he doesn't permit a woman to teach or to "usurp authority over the man". It seems to me that in church certain things are the responsibility of men and not women and he gives his reasoning as to why. I don't know how you could read it any other way.

 

[Dino246]

I think women can take part in church just as men can, sharing the gospel and talking about things as they like, just as a man could, but unless I'm mistaken somehow Paul is saying that he doesn't permit a woman to teach or to "usurp authority over the man". It seems to me that in church certain things are the responsibility of men and not women and he gives his reasoning as to why. I don't know how you could read it any other way.

When you understand the cultural context, the meaning of the passage changes significantly. Without that context, and especially if you are reading the passage in isolation, it is easy to conclude that Paul was teaching distinct roles for men and women.

 

[SunshineGirl]

I would also like to point out that every Church member is of equal value in the Body of Christ. The Lord Jesus Christ is the Head of the Church and we are His body. Every member of that body is precious.

The Church elders are just like the other members, they never ask for any special treatment and nobody looks up to them as being any better than the rest of us. The only difference is, they have more responsibilities. They have to be available at all times to give counsel or any other kind of support to members who may be in some kind of need.

Folks shouldn't automatically assume that God values men more than women, just because He placed a greater burden on the men in the Church. Women still have very important roles, such as Sunday School teachers and other hospitality roles, such as visiting people in nursing homes and hospitals. And lets not forget the biggest and most important role in the Church and that being raising Children in a Godly way.

Every member has different gifts, so we can all be a blessing to the Church in our own way. Nobody should ever make themselves out to be more important or better in any way. We're equal in God's sight

I agree with you. God can use everyone. I believe God puts us all in places to help people who are struggling or who are lost.
God loves all 🥰
The risen Christ appeared to woman first.
I have been to four Good Friday church services since finding Jesus and I have never heard anyone deliver Gods message like this woman pastor. She had such a genuine love and passion for Jesus. After the service on Good Friday she picked up a wooden cross and marched through the town preaching Gods word and the whole church followed her. Some people carried on their way but so many people stopped and were listening some even joining in the march. It was amazing to watch what God was doing. It was like he was using this woman to round his children up.

 

[Mem]

There are a lot of gullible women. There are many falling over themselves in order stroke men's egos and please them, swallowing the hook, line and sinker. Lol, Reel 'em in fellas!

 

[SunshineGirl]

There are a lot of gullible women. There are many falling over themselves in order stroke men's egos and please them, swallowing the hook, line and sinker. Lol, Reel 'em in fellas!

You can also get some very gullible men too.
That is why I believe we need God to help us discern what/who's spirit is at work in people.

 

[Snackersmom]

You can also get some very gullible men too.
That is why I believe we need God to help us discern what/who's spirit is at work in people.

Amen to that, Sister! I assist with the youth group at church (don't worry boys, I'm not in authority over any men and the official youth pastor is a male). Anyway, we did a study on spiritual gifts last Summer, and the discernment was actually a lot stronger in the girls than in the boys. That's nothing against the boys at all, they had different gifts. But those little ladies could spot a phony in no time flat.

I have no problem with any Biblical restrictions on women. I'm actually pretty careful about that myself. But I have found that anything I thought God was leading me to do in the church, the men in leadership agreed and gave it their blessing. And it always turned out great.

My issue (and reason for even posting in this thread), is that over the years I have encountered many people who use their "status" as married and/or male to make others feel inferior or like they have nothing to add or are only good for babysitting the nursery and sweeping the floors. I even had one pastor appoint a couple of guys to make sure I and other single females didn't get deceived and start fornicating . I've made it 40 years celibate without a "warden", I think The Holy Spririt is keeping me in check just fine.

Anyway....the reality is that we are ALL called to help people grow in faith and knowledge of the Lord. What exactly that would look like for each of us as individuals is our personal responsibility to seek God about and obey the leading of The Holy Spirit.

God talks to us girls, too. Some of you dudes might not believe that, but that's because you're shouting too loud to hear Him.

 

[Snackersmom]

There are a lot of gullible women. There are many falling over themselves in order stroke men's egos and please them, swallowing the hook, line and sinker. Lol, Reel 'em in fellas!

I'm not sure why you are supporting the deception of women by egocentric men . Was this post intended to be satirical?

 

[Snackersmom]

Sorry Snackersmom but I will not be responding to any more of your questions. You said you do not agree with what is in 1 Cor 9:5 even though it is plain as day. So really Scripture means nothing to you.

What I said I did not agree with was your INTERPRETATION of the verse, not the verse itself. There is a huge difference .

I read the passage that all the apostles had the right to take along a believing wife in their ministry duties, not that all of them were definitely married. Paul himself said that he wasn't and thought it best that way, though he acknowledged that not all are called to that.

Suit yourself about not answering the questions I brought up, but I will have to assume it's because you are unable to. And I would not have insulted you by saying that our difference on the matter indicates that scripture means nothing to you. But if that is the way you want to go then that is between you and God .

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

I even had one pastor appoint a couple of guys to make sure I and other single females didn't get deceived and start fornicating . I've made it 40 years celibate without a "warden", I think The Holy Spririt is keeping me in check just fine.

Seriously?! Oh wow, I don't think that pastor would like my response to that idea!! Where do these people get off? Take about egotistical and spiritual pride. smh

 

[Snackersmom]

Seriously?! Oh wow, I don't think that pastor would like my response to that idea!! Where do these people get off? Take about egotistical and spiritual pride. smh

Lol well I think (hope?) he probably meant well and was just trying to protect us? His own daughter was honestly pretty gullible and seemed to have very little discernment, he was worried about her in that area and I think just assumed that all single females are the same way.

We were starting a young adults group and I was actually the one getting most of the spiritual leading for it, planning the food and activities, etc. but he wanted to make it clear that the official leaders would be male and they were to make sure that the girls didn't get suckered by any random dudes who might show up (funny, he did not ask us ladies to look out for our brothers in that regard ).

I didn't really care in the sense that I wasn't looking for a "leadership" title and just wanted God to use the group to accomplish whatever He wanted to accomplish. But the insinuation that the girls were all just sheep waiting to be led astray was pretty insulting.

 

[SunshineGirl]

Amen to that, Sister! I assist with the youth group at church (don't worry boys, I'm not in authority over any men and the official youth pastor is a male). Anyway, we did a study on spiritual gifts last Summer, and the discernment was actually a lot stronger in the girls than in the boys. That's nothing against the boys at all, they had different gifts. But those little ladies could spot a phony in no time flat.

I have no problem with any Biblical restrictions on women. I'm actually pretty careful about that myself. But I have found that anything I thought God was leading me to do in the church, the men in leadership agreed and gave it their blessing. And it always turned out great.

My issue (and reason for even posting in this thread), is that over the years I have encountered many people who use their "status" as married and/or male to make others feel inferior or like they have nothing to add or are only good for babysitting the nursery and sweeping the floors. I even had one pastor appoint a couple of guys to make sure I and other single females didn't get deceived and start fornicating . I've made it 40 years celibate without a "warden", I think The Holy Spririt is keeping me in check just fine.

Anyway....the reality is that we are ALL called to help people grow in faith and knowledge of the Lord. What exactly that would look like for each of us as individuals is our personal responsibility to seek God about and obey the leading of The Holy Spirit.

God talks to us girls, too. Some of you dudes might not believe that, but that's because you're shouting too loud to hear Him.

It sounds like the Lord has got you doing some great work with the youth group.
I love seeing Gods special gifts working in people 🥰

Sadly people will always use their status and not just in the church. You just have to remember you are as good as the rest. Jesus Christ loves YOU 🥰

Has the pastor appointed these other people due to safeguarding? The world has gone safeguarding mad 😜

 

[Snackersmom]

It sounds like the Lord has got you doing some great work with the youth group.
I love seeing Gods special gifts working in people 🥰

Sadly people will always use their status and not just in the church. You just have to remember you are as good as the rest. Jesus Christ loves YOU 🥰

Has the pastor appointed these other people due to safeguarding? The world has gone safeguarding mad 😜

Thank you Sis! I love those kids. The group has almost tripled in regular attendance since I started helping a year ago, the youth are witnessing to their friends and seeking God's will for their lives. We've had multiple re-dedications and 3 members are headed for the mission field this Fall. I'm so proud of them I can't even say . Definitely not taking any credit though, I know it's all God and a lot of different people had a hand in that. Just saying that God is working, despite the involvement of a female lol . And really, even though I don't have or want an official title, I am still accountable to God for what I say or don't say while I am helping out. Following God's leading to help the kids grow is just as much my responsibility as it is the youth pastor's in my opinion.

And yeah, the pastor at my old church was probably just safeguarding. There were other issues at that church but I like the one I'm at now. The official leadership is all male, but they have made it clear that they want to know if anyone (male or female) feels led to do something, and in my case they have always approved and supported what I felt God was saying. So I'm happy with that as I don't care about titles and such.

 

[SunshineGirl]

Thank you Sis! I love those kids. The group has almost tripled in regular attendance since I started helping a year ago, the youth are witnessing to their friends and seeking God's will for their lives. We've had multiple re-dedications and 3 members are headed for the mission field this Fall. I'm so proud of them I can't even say . Definitely not taking any credit though, I know it's all God and a lot of different people had a hand in that. Just saying that God is working, despite the involvement of a female lol . And really, even though I don't have or want an official title, I am still accountable to God for what I say or don't say while I am helping out. Following God's leading to help the kids grow is just as much my responsibility as it is the youth pastor's in my opinion.

And yeah, the pastor at my old church was probably just safeguarding. There were other issues at that church but I like the one I'm at now. The official leadership is all male, but they have made it clear that they want to know if anyone (male or female) feels led to do something, and in my case they have always approved and supported what I felt God was saying. So I'm happy with that as I don't care about titles and such.

I think it's amazing how so many young people are getting to know Christ and you are a part of that 🥰
You keep doing the work God has put on your heart to do.
I was starting to loss hope working with teenagers but hearing what God is doing for your youth group has helped thanks 🥰

 

[Snackersmom]

I think it's amazing how so many young people are getting to know Christ and you are a part of that 🥰
You keep doing the work God has put on your heart to do.
I was starting to loss hope working with teenagers but hearing what God is doing for your youth group has helped thanks 🥰

Thank you so much for the encouragement! One thing that helped I think was emphasizing to the kids that Christianity is not a spectator sport, God has cool jobs and "missions" that are unique to them personally. We told them to seek the leading of the Holy Spirit and encouraged them in their obedience. Once they felt God actually using them, they were hooked! Ha, it's been awesome..... would love to talk "shop" sometime but don't want to derail this thread any further. Feel free to message me privately, or maybe we could start a thread in the pastor/small group forum (though some of the boys might crash our party if they see us in there, lol)

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I think women can take part in church just as men can, sharing the gospel and talking about things as they like, just as a man could, but unless I'm mistaken somehow Paul is saying that he doesn't permit a woman to teach or to "usurp authority over the man". It seems to me that in church certain things are the responsibility of men and not women and he gives his reasoning as to why. I don't know how you could read it any other way.

I agree. Its important to note that it's not about equality - it's about respect for God's hierarchical order of things. Ask yourselves this: What major figure is trying to usurp God's authority all this time? It's Satan! And he's trying to get Christian women to do the same thing by causing them to envy the position of Christian men in the church and family, to make women feel like their position is inferior when it isn't. It's sad that he's been successful too.


🍇

 

[Charlie_2024]

There is no need to twist Scripture to understand as I do. There is, however, a need to understand the context and to interpret the passage within that context rather than treating the text like it stands on its own.

If you honestly think that Paul (and, by extension, God Himself) is saying that all women were deceived when Eve was deceived, then I challenge you to explain why, in Romans 16, Paul praised so many women. They must have spoken in the Church to earn the praise Paul gives. Further, he praises Prisca (Priscilla) specifically as a teacher.

So, instead of sniping at me because I believe something different than you do, do your homework and come to a conclusion that makes sense of ALL relevant passages.

So you don't believe the Bible when it says "all have sinned". All means all no matter how we look at it, so yeah it wasn't only Eve who sinned but all women and men also. But the Bible clearly says that women sinned first. Even convinced Adam to sin.

I was dealing with the verses in question, you're the one who bought unrelated, irrelevant verses into it. You need to explain why Paul said women should be silent and why he mentioned the fact the Eve sinned first and fell into transgression. You sidestepped that issue and made reference to other unrelated verses

 

[Charlie_2024]

But you just quoted Paul as saying, "I do not permit a woman to teach... but to be in silence."

Which is it? Silence, or teaching?

Do you see how your interpretation is self-refuting?

No, you missed the point. Children are not Christians or Church members. So anyone can teach them. But no woman is allowed to teach Christians.
The word "Christian" means a born again Saint and followers of the Lord Jesus Christ. Children cannot be baptized until they are mature enough to be responsible for their actions and that's usually at around 18 years of age.

So sorry you missed the point again and women still need to remain silent before the Church. They can speak to children outside of the Church. Now the Church doesn't mean building, I know most people think the Church is some grand old building. But it's actually a body of believers.

 

[Mem]

I'm not sure why you are supporting the deception of women by egocentric men . Was this post intended to be satirical?

You're not demonstrating my point, are you?

 

[Snackersmom]

You're not demonstrating my point, are you?

LOL, BURNNNNN!!!!!! Ha, I don't know you well enough to know for sure how you meant it, and text can be harder to interpret. But I did ask if it was satirical and I'm assuming now that's how you meant it.

And to be fair, people say crazy stuff like that all the time and actually mean it.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

But no woman is allowed to teach Christians.

and women still need to remain silent before the Church. They can speak to children outside of the Church. Now the Church doesn't mean building, I know most people think the Church is some grand old building. But it's actually a body of believers.

I pulled out just these ^ two parts of your post, to ask you a question regarding your perspective, if you don't mind


What is your understanding of the following passage (esp the part with the bold emphasis, and in view of its context):

Acts 18 -

24Now a certain Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus, being an eloquent man, mighty in the Scriptures. 25He was instructed in the way of the Lord. And being fervent in spirit, he was speaking and was teaching earnestly the things concerning Jesus, knowing only the baptism of John. 26And he [Apollos] began to speak boldly in the synagogue. But Priscilla and Aquila having heard him, took him to them and [they] expounded the way of God to him more accurately [/more perfectly].


My question: do you believe it was "wrong" of Priscilla to be involved in this "expounding" to Apollos (which surely involved explaining so that he would have a better understanding than he previously had to that point)?
Is it your view that Priscilla should have remained completely "silent" (since it involved "expounding" to him, a fellow-believer) and not been at all involved, other than to sit "silently" beside Aquila while he alone spoke to Apollos?




Just wondering your perspective on this, given your quotes above. Thanks.