Who is “He”, Who is “Us”, and Who is “Him”, in Ephesians 1:4?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
#1
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
 

Artios1

Born again to serve
Dec 11, 2020
678
420
63
#2
He/Him.... is God
Us and we.... are the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
He chose us in him, in Christ, to receive the spiritual blessings in the heavenly places. This choice that these blessings would be found in Christ was made before the foundation of the world. The choosing was the blessings in Christ, not those who would be in Christ.
 

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
#5
He chose us in him, in Christ, to receive the spiritual blessings in the heavenly places. This choice that these blessings would be found in Christ was made before the foundation of the world. The choosing was the blessings in Christ, not those who would be in Christ.
Ephesians 1:5
Who hath predestinated us unto the adoption of children through Jesus Christ unto himself: according to the purpose of his will:
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,230
2,207
113
#6
us in Him, "us" that are chosen is qualified by a preposition "in" , a preposition is a word that shows direction, location, or time, or introduces an object and a prepositional phrase is a group of words consisting of a preposition, its object, and any words that modify the object, "in Him."
So, if we change the order of the words, it doesn't change the meaning of the statement to say, "In Him, He chose us." when? before the foundation of the world, why? that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight, how? in charity.
And Ephesians 3:12 confirms this.
12 In Him and through faith in Him we may enter God’s presence with boldness and confidence.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,778
113
#8
Ephesians 1:4
As he [God the Father] chose us [the children of God] in him [Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted [without blame] in his [God the Father's] sight in charity [love].
 

Johann

Active member
Apr 12, 2022
928
212
43
#9
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
Paul gives praise to God for all the spiritual blessings he has poured out upon his people, v3-14. i] God be praised. Paul opens by praising God for the wonderful blessings that were given to the saints / Jewish believers (blessings which Gentiles similarly share as members of Christ). These blessings are every "spiritual" blessing and they are experienced in the "heavenly realms". Seeing that we are in a relationship with Christ, we are in a sense, spiritually one with him in the heavenly realms, while still being part of the earthly realm. This verse serves as a summary introduction to the eulogy.

euloghtoV adj. "praise be to" - blessed be. Fronted for emphasis. The verb to-be is assumed, either optative = a wish prayer, or imperative, "let be ...", or indicative, "is praised / blessed. Possibly "worthy of praise / blessing."

"Father" - [the god and] father. "Father" is without an article, joined to "the God" by kai indicating they are one in the same.

tou kuriou (oV) gen. "of [our] Lord" - of the lord. The genitive is adjectival, relational.

hJmwn gen. pro. "our" - of us [jesus christ]. The genitive is adjectival, also probably expressing subordination; "Lord Jesus Christ over us", Larkin.

oJ euloghsaV (eulogew) aor. part. "who has blessed" - the one having blessed, praised. The participle serves as a substantive, standing in apposition to "the God and Father." The eulogy gives praise to God on the ground of his blessings to us.

hJmaV "us" - There is debate over whether Paul includes his readers in the "us". It is likely that the "us" are Jewish believers, or even the apostles. In v13 his readers, "you", are included in the blessings, in that the Gentiles get to share in the blessings poured out on God's historic people. The Gentiles are "included in Christ", along with God's chosen people Israel.

en + dat. "with" - in/with [all/every spiritual blessing]. Adverbial use of the preposition, expressing reference / respect; "with respect to." The blessing is "spiritual". "Spiritual blessings" means those elements of life that are ours in our association with the Spirit, as outlined in verses 3-14.

en + dat. "in" - Local; expressing space / sphere.

toiV epouranioiV adj. "the heavenly realms" - the heavenlies. The adjective serves as a substantive. Numerous definitions have been suggested for "the heavenlies", eg., "the sphere of the blessings which are related to the Spirit", Lincoln. Some argue that it is another word for heaven, but this is very unlikely. It seems more likely that the term refers to the "spiritual sphere of influence" touching both earth and heaven. Spiritual forces, both good and evil, exist within its sphere: see 3:10, also 1:20, 2:6, 6:12.

en Cristw/ "in Christ" - The preposition en is locative / incorporative union, the prepositional phrase again serving to modifying the verb "blessed" - the spiritual blessings which come to us through our incorporation in Christ, by grace through faith.


v4
ii] Election and adoption to sonship, v4-6. In these three verses, Paul identifies the first spiritual blessing: Set apart / called / elected / predestined as a holy people, God like, Christ like. The people of Israel were elected to sonship, chosen to be holy and blameless in the sight of God, "to the praise of his glorious grace."

kaqwV "for" - as, just as. The NIV reads the conjunction as causal, "because", although an epexegetic / explanatory sense seems better. "God has blessed us in that he has ......."

exelexato (eklegw) aor. "he chose" - he chose out, selected [us]. The aorist tense may indicate a single act, but not necessarily. The first element of God's kindness, his blessing, is the divine election of a people. Commentators with a reformed leaning tend to argue for an individual sense to the blessing of predestination. Yet, it is likely that a corporate sense is intended in that God chose Abraham and through his seed (ultimately Christ) he gathered an eternally secure people to himself. Today, a person is incorporated into this chosen people, this new Israel, through faith in Christ.

en + dat. "in" - in [him]. Local, space, metaphorical / incorporative union, probably "in Christ." Through our incorporation in Christ we are the elect people of God.

pro + acc. "before" - Here adverbial, temporal. Both this prepositional phrase, and "in him", modify the verb "to choose."

kosmou (oV) gen. "[the creation] of the world" - [foundation (also deposit, sowing in the sense of conception)] of world. The genitive is adjectival, possessive, "the world's creation", but possibly objective. God's choice of a people, including his determination of a how a person can join with this people (namely, by grace mediated on the basis of the faithfulness of Christ appropriate through faith), was made "before the creation."

einai "to be" - [for us] to be. The infinitive is adverbial, expressing purpose; "in order that we may be ...... The accusative subject of the infinitive is hJmaV, "we".

J.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,465
6,722
113
#12
He calls Himself Yahweh when asked by Moses His Name. That means pretty much He will be What He will Be. Thus, I must say, He is the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit for they are certainly One as we are taught in the OT and in the NT.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#13
Ephesians 1:5
Who hath predestinated us unto the adoption of children through Jesus Christ unto himself: according to the purpose of his will:
To what has he predestined us to? (The “us” are those in Christ, btw.) Those in Christ have been predestined unto the adoption. How does scripture define the adoption?

Romans 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

The adoption is the future redemption of our body. It is when we finally put off this corruption and put on incorruption. God’s word will define itself. I’d stay away from the heresy of the RCC.
 

Johann

Active member
Apr 12, 2022
928
212
43
#14
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
THOUGHT - How do we know we have the Spirit as first fruits or as a pledge? Have you had a victory over sin this past week? If you are a believer, surely you can remember some time during the past week when sin was tempting you mightily to surrender to some lust (strong desire) and yet you were able to say "No" because of the "Pledge", the Holy Spirit Who was indwelling you (cp Ro 8:13+ - note our responsibility/God's provision). Indeed, every spiritual victory you have experienced in the past or will experience in the future is an affirmation that you have received the pledge of the Spirit of God, "by Whom you were sealed for the day of redemption." (Ep 4:30+) And so our present experiences of victory over the power of sin enabled by the Spirit are but a foretaste that the best is yet to come when we will experience permanent, perfect victory over the power of sin! (Hallelujah!) Not only that, but the day of redemption will bring us freedom from the presence of sin, and even remove the pleasure of sin! (Glory!) (cp Heb 11:25+)
--and this includes anger issues.
J.
 

Johann

Active member
Apr 12, 2022
928
212
43
#15
To what has he predestined us to? (The “us” are those in Christ, btw.) Those in Christ have been predestined unto the adoption. How does scripture define the adoption?

Romans 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

The adoption is the future redemption of our body. It is when we finally put off this corruption and put on incorruption. God’s word will define itself. I’d stay away from the heresy of the RCC.
Correct-

Wuest writes that "The bestowal of the Holy Spirit is God’s part payment in the salvation He gives the believing sinner, that part payment guaranteeing the full delivery of all parts of the salvation given. Salvation is in three parts; justification, the removal of the guilt and penalty of sin and the bestowal of a positive righteousness, Jesus Christ, is given at the moment the sinner puts his faith in the Lord Jesus as Saviour; sanctification, a progressive work of the Spirit in the life of the believer, is a present possession in which He eliminates sin from the experience of the believer and produces His own fruit; glorification, the act of God transforming the present bodies of believers into perfect, sinless, deathless bodies. The believer has the first two now. The Holy Spirit, indwelling the believer, is God’s earnest money, guaranteeing to him the future glorification of his body. (Wuest Word Studies - Eerdman Publishing Company Volume 1, Volume 2, Volume 3 - used by permission)
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
3,505
468
83
#16
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
Who is Paul addressing?
1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God,

To the saints who are in Ephesus, and are faithful in Christ Jesus

Paul is not addressing those who are not yet Christians. He is not saying that people who are not yet saved, but who might one day become saved, were chosen in Him before the foundation of the world, because He is not addressing anyone who is as yet an unbeliever.

We know that Jesus is God's chosen/elect one, and that God chose Jesus before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless before Him in love.

Those who do not believe in Christ are without Christ, outside Christ and without hope until they believe in Him..

When someone outside Christ hears the gospel, turns from dead works to faith in God and in Christ Jesus they become in Christ. Having believed, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit and baptised by the Holy Spirit into Christ's body.

Then what was true of Christ before the foundation of the world becomes true of the new creation who is now in Christ. We inherit His past. We are now also chosen in Him before the foundation of the world.

And what was true of Christ in the more recent past, such as his death and resurrection, becomes the believer's past. We died and were buried and were raised with Him.

And what is true of Christ now is also true of the believer now. As he is so are we in this world.

And what will be true of Christ at the end of the age will be true of the new creation in Christ at the end of the age. They will inherit with Him all things.

No one who is not yet in Christ was chosen in Him before the foundation of the world, because only those who are in Him are in the chosen One who was beloved and chosen before the foundation of the world.
 
Dec 24, 2023
52
20
8
#17
I think it's: As God chose us adoptees in the Christ before the foundation of the world, that we adoptees should be holy and unspotted in God's sight in charity.

Why do you ask, dear?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,652
5,908
113
#18
Ephesians 1:4
As he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in his sight in charity.
Jesus and his disciples

“This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his Lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you. These things I command you, that ye love one another.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:12-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father,

and ye in me,

and I in you.

( we ) He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me ( him ) shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jesus answered and said unto him, ( we )If a man love me, he will keep my words: and ( him ) my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

( not we ) He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings:

( still him ) and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.”
‭‭John‬ ‭14:15-17, 20-21, 23-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 

jamessb

Active member
Feb 10, 2024
738
122
43
Santa Fe NM
#19
Ephesians 1:3-4 (NET Bible): Blessed is the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly realms in Christ. For he chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world that we should be holy and blameless before him in love.

For he (God) chose us (believers) in Christ before the foundation of the world that we (Christians) should be holy and blameless before him (God) in love.
 

tylerbones1313

Active member
May 1, 2022
565
156
43
#20
Epesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

He refers to God. Him refers to Jesus Christ us refers to ALL who will believe.

But you have to understand God knows not only everything that will happen (never negated human free will) but also all that could happen under any given set of circumstances. This allows for a robust account of human freedom and divine sovereignty.