Predestination is misunderstood...

[Johann]

And that, brother, I consider a more biblical view. The only thing I would add to what I highlighted above is that God extends His love, mercy, compassion, and grace to us through, in and by Christ. And I do so based on the exceedingly broad teaching of Christ's preeminence in all things in Rom 11:36.

And may our Lord Christ Jesus be glorified and magnified in ALL spheres of our lives, at home-and here.
Thank you brother-shalom to you and family.
Johann.

 

[John146]

There are two types of sanctification.

Positional sanctification (in Christ) we are set apart from the world (1 cor 6: 11)

we are also in the process off being sanctified (heb 10: 14) It is the process of Christian growth, as we grow in christ. and our conditional sanctification gets closer to our positional sanctification

In the end, they will both be equal. this is called glorification

???

Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

 

[Johann]

There are two types of sanctification.

Positional sanctification (in Christ) we are set apart from the world (1 cor 6: 11)

we are also in the process off being sanctified (heb 10: 14) It is the process of Christian growth, as we grow in christ. and our conditional sanctification gets closer to our positional sanctification

In the end, they will both be equal. this is called glorification

Correct-


Positional Sanctification (Hebrew: Qadash)

1 Corinthians 6:11 states, "But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God."

The Greek verb translated as "sanctified" here is ἁγιάζω (hagiazō), which can mean setting something aside for sacred use or making someone pure and holy. In this case, it indicates that believers are set apart from sin and its consequences because of their union with Christ.

This idea of being set apart is rooted in Old Testament language, particularly in the Hebrew term qādāš, which conveys the notion of separating oneself or something for divine service. For example, priests were set apart for temple duties, and Israel was set apart as God's chosen nation. Similarly, believers in Christ are seen as having been set apart for God's purposes.

Progressive Sanctification (Greek: Agiasmos)

Hebrews 10:14 says, "For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." The Greek noun translated as "being sanctified" here is ἀγιασμός (agiasmós), which denotes the process of becoming more like Christ over time. Progressive sanctification involves the gradual transformation of believers as they grow in holiness and maturity.

Again, there are Old Testament roots for this concept, specifically in the Hebrew term ṭāmîyd, which describes a continuing purifying process. As believers engage in spiritual disciplines and submit themselves to the Holy Spirit, they experience progressively deeper levels of sanctification.

Conclusion: Glorification
Ultimately, the goal of sanctification is not merely to achieve a certain level of holiness but to reach fullness in Christ, known as glorification. Romans 8:29–30 speaks about believers being predestined to become conformed to the likeness of Christ, culminating in their glorification. While positional sanctification represents the beginning of this process, progressive sanctification leads us towards its completion.

It must be stressed that neither aspect of sanctification is earned through human effort alone. Both positional and progressive sanctification result from the work of God's grace in conjunction with the believer's response of faith and obedience.
J.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

And may our Lord Christ Jesus be glorified and magnified in ALL spheres of our lives, at home-and here.
Thank you brother-shalom to you and family.
Johann.

nice prayer, but shouldn't you by now of humbled yourself before your brothers, and apologized publicly for calling a disabled person a troll.

 

[Johann]

Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Hebrews 10:14 states, "For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified." This verse emphasizes the completed work of Christ's sacrifice on the cross, which brings about perfection for believers who are sanctified. The context of this verse in Hebrews underscores the superiority of Christ's sacrifice over the repeated sacrifices under the Old Covenant. Through Christ's once-for-all sacrifice, believers are made perfect and sanctified before God
3
.Etymology and Morphology of Sanctification

The word "sanctification" has its roots in Latin and Old French, ultimately derived from the Late Latin term "sanctificare," meaning "to make holy." The word combines "sanctus," meaning "holy," and the verb form of "facere," meaning "to make" or "to do." Over time, the term evolved to encompass the idea of consecration and setting apart for sacred use

.In its theological sense, sanctification involves being set apart for God's intended purpose and living in accordance with His design. The Greek term for sanctification, "hagiasmos," conveys the concept of holiness. Sanctification is not merely a positional state but also a process of growing in holiness and conformity to Christ throughout one's life


.The process of sanctification involves both God's work and the believer's active participation. It includes being separated from sin, growing in godliness, and reflecting Jesus Christ more clearly in one's life. Sanctification is not a one-time event but an ongoing journey towards becoming more like Christ, culminating in glorification when believers will be made completely holy in God's presence.

J.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

???

Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Get rid of your KJV it is flawed.

The greek word sanctified is in the present tense. Not the perfect.

It is an ongoing process It is present passive,

as apposed to perfected forever which is in the perfect tense (a completed action)

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Hebrews 10:14 states, "For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified." This verse emphasizes the completed work of Christ's sacrifice on the cross, which brings about perfection for believers who are sanctified. The context of this verse in Hebrews underscores the superiority of Christ's sacrifice over the repeated sacrifices under the Old Covenant. Through Christ's once-for-all sacrifice, believers are made perfect and sanctified before God
3
.Etymology and Morphology of Sanctification

The word "sanctification" has its roots in Latin and Old French, ultimately derived from the Late Latin term "sanctificare," meaning "to make holy." The word combines "sanctus," meaning "holy," and the verb form of "facere," meaning "to make" or "to do." Over time, the term evolved to encompass the idea of consecration and setting apart for sacred use
.In its theological sense, sanctification involves being set apart for God's intended purpose and living in accordance with His design. The Greek term for sanctification, "hagiasmos," conveys the concept of holiness. Sanctification is not merely a positional state but also a process of growing in holiness and conformity to Christ throughout one's life
.The process of sanctification involves both God's work and the believer's active participation. It includes being separated from sin, growing in godliness, and reflecting Jesus Christ more clearly in one's life. Sanctification is not a one-time event but an ongoing journey towards becoming more like Christ, culminating in glorification when believers will be made completely holy in God's presence.

J.

Sadly, He thinks his KJV is perfect.. no mistakes

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Are you struggling with something, or is it, you have to many people put you in an impossible position in the past.


When Samuel anointed Saul as the king of Isreal

He predicted the spirit of the lord would come upon him and he would prophesy,

And Samuel said to saul you will be change into a different person.

What happend to king Saul ?

Would you agree at some point king Saul was a prophet to.

Are you going to say Saul never had faith to.

Only God knows that

if we was saved, he is in heaven today

if he is not he is in hades

 

[John146]

Get rid of your KJV it is flawed.

The greek word sanctified is in the present tense. Not the perfect.

It is an ongoing process It is present passive,

as apposed to perfected forever which is in the perfect tense (a completed action)

LOL, get rid of God's preserved holy word? Not a chance. You should give it a try. No need to Greekify anything.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Only God knows that

if we was saved, he is in heaven today

if he is not he is in hades

The question was if he had faith.

I think you may be struggling to understand a basic teaching, that faiths comes First before salvation

 

[Johann]

Sadly, He thinks his KJV is perfect.. no mistakes

Address the topic and not the KJV-with it's "many mistakes"
J.

 

[Johann]

Get rid of your KJV it is flawed.

The greek word sanctified is in the present tense. Not the perfect.

It is an ongoing process It is present passive,

as apposed to perfected forever which is in the perfect tense (a completed action)

In the Greek New Testament, the verb "sanctify" (ναιοω / hágiazō) appears in various tenses, including the present continuous ("present participle") and the simple present tense. While the present continuous indicates ongoing action or a process, the simple present tense typically denotes habitual actions or facts that remain true regardless of time.

When discussing the usage of the simple present tense for the verb "sanctify" in the New Testament, it is essential to consider the broader context of the passage rather than solely focusing on the tense itself. The simple present tense of "sanctify" can imply several meanings depending on the context:

Habitual Sanctification: The simple present tense can indicate that sanctification is a regular occurrence or characteristic of the believer's daily walk with God. For example, Paul writes in Romans 12:1-2, "I urge you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, which is your spiritual service of worship. And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect."

Here, the simple present tense of "be transformed" implies that transformation is an ongoing reality for believers. Similarly, the simple present tense of "sanctify" in passages like 1 Peter 1:2 states, "according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood," could imply that sanctification is a continual process experienced by believers.

Factual Sanctification: The simple present tense can also indicate that sanctification is a permanent state of being for believers. For instance, in 1 Corinthians 1:2, Paul addresses the church in Corinth as "sanctified in Christ Jesus," implying that the Corinthian believers have already undergone the act of sanctification. In this case, the simple present tense of "sanctified" serves to reinforce the permanency of the believers' sanctification status.

To summarize, the presence of the simple present tense for the verb "sanctify" in the Greek New Testament does not necessarily limit the meaning to an ongoing process. Instead, the context determines whether the simple present tense implies habitual sanctification or factual sanctification. By carefully considering the surrounding text, we can discern the appropriate meaning of the simple present tense in the given passage.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Only God knows that

if we was saved, he is in heaven today

if he is not he is in hades

Would you agree that God predestined King Saul to have faith, at the least, ?

This is where my issue is with many here.

There only seeing being predestined as something that is something only centred around salvation,


I'm arguing that a person can be predestined to be changed and have faith.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

LOL, get rid of God's preserved holy word? Not a chance. You should give it a try. No need to Greekify anything.

If it was God's preserved word, it would be interpreted correctly.

But if you want to base your theology on an interpretation of other interpretations. Feel free

The KJV is in error in this passage. You can believe the truth or reject it. Thats on you

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

The question was if he had faith.

I think you may be struggling to understand a basic teaching, that faiths comes First before salvation

Actually your right Faith does come BEFORE salvation. Because you would never call out to be saved if you did not have true saving faith

And I agree, the question is did he have faith? I do not know the answer to that question so I can not judge

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Would you agree that God predestined King Saul to have faith, at the least, ?

No. Because no place does it say this

The people wanted him as King. God did not chose him the people did.

This is where my issue is with many here.

There only seeing being predestined as something that is something only centred around salvation,

The only predestination that matters concerns salvation.., The rest is simple guesses unless it is specifically stated

Calvanism says you were predestined to be saved, Thus God makes you alive so you can believe.

it also says those who reject christ are predestined to hell. I do not agree with this.

I'm arguing that a person can be predestined to be changed and have faith.

But we do not know if that person will change or not. That person must make a decision. if he remains in unbelief, he will suffer his fate..

 

[Rufus]

quoting fatalism does not make your view of predestination correct

But intelligently, logically and biblically refuting fatalism goes a long way in doing just that.

 

[Rufus]

Actually your right Faith does come BEFORE salvation. Because you would never call out to be saved if you did not have true saving faith

And I agree, the question is did he have faith? I do not know the answer to that question so I can not judge

But regeneration (new birth) precedes faith, for the dead have no spiritual ability to do anything pleasing to God, which would include believing on Him through Christ.

 

[Johann]

But regeneration (new birth) precedes faith, for the dead have no spiritual ability to do anything pleasing to God, which would include believing on Him through Christ.

Ohhh-I see--


The statement "regeneration (new birth) precedes faith, for the dead have no spiritual ability to do anything pleasing to God, which would include believing on Him through Christ" is a theological perspective held by some Christians. This view emphasizes the idea that regeneration is a sovereign work of God, whereby He imparts new life to a spiritually dead person, enabling them to respond to the gospel message with faith in Jesus Christ.

This perspective is based on passages such as Ephesians 2:1-5, which describes the spiritual condition of unbelievers as being dead in their trespasses and sins, and Colossians 2:13, which speaks of God making believers alive together with Christ. The idea is that regeneration is a necessary prerequisite for faith, as it is only through the impartation of new life that a person can respond to the gospel message with faith.

However, it is important to note that not all Christians hold this view, and there is some debate among theologians regarding the relationship between regeneration and faith.

Some argue that faith precedes regeneration, while others maintain that regeneration and faith occur simultaneously.

Ultimately, the relationship between regeneration and faith is a complex theological issue that requires careful consideration of various biblical passages and theological perspectives. While some Christians may hold the view that regeneration precedes faith, it is important to recognize that this is not the only perspective on this issue.
J.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

No. Because no place does it say this

The people wanted him as King. God did not chose him the people did.


The only predestination that matters concerns salvation.., The rest is simple guesses unless it is specifically stated

Calvanism says you were predestined to be saved, Thus God makes you alive so you can believe.

it also says those who reject christ are predestined to hell. I do not agree with this.




But we do not know if that person will change or not. That person must make a decision. if he remains in unbelief, he will suffer his fate..

So just to be sure, you dismiss a prophet of God, (Samuel) telling saul the spirit will change you for better good, as having nothing to do with the spirit changing sauls faith ?. Or the spirit predestinating Saul to be changed.